Wing Chun Boxing

[macher]

Here's the thing about these sorts of demos; watch the other guy.

If someone throws a jab, leaves it extended, doesn't move their feet and turtles on the counter...yes, what this Sifu is doing would be effective. Good luck finding anyone that would do these things. More often than not that punch is followed by another, and another, and another, and suddenly that flaily arms extended WC attack he is doing is a prescription for getting knocked out.

When they’re are sparring more heavily he’s not leaving the jab extended.

 

[Martial D]

When they’re are sparring more heavily he’s not leaving the jab extended.

Oh? And where is this footage of this heavy sparring? Got a link?

The one you posted is completely unrealistic.

 

[wingchun100]

Here's the thing about these sorts of demos; watch the other guy.

If someone throws a jab, leaves it extended, doesn't move their feet and turtles on the counter...yes, what this Sifu is doing would be effective. Good luck finding anyone that would do these things. More often than not that punch is followed by another, and another, and another, and suddenly that flaily arms extended WC attack he is doing is a prescription for getting knocked out.

Maybe so, but still...I'd like to see him fight against that MMA fighter who's going around knocking out all the traditional martial artists in China.

 

[Martial D]

Maybe so, but still...I'd like to see him fight against that MMA fighter who's going around knocking out all the traditional martial artists in China.

Meh. I'm fairly sure it would end the same way. I don't see how this guy has made any real adaptations to his WC to set it apart. I would like to see it too though.

 

[wingchun100]

Meh. I'm fairly sure it would end the same way. I don't see how this guy has made any real adaptations to his WC to set it apart. I would like to see it too though.

I'm not sure either, but I talk to him on a regular basis on Facebook. Good, open-minded guy. He actually took the time to read and write a testimonial for a Wing Chun book I wrote.

 

[Martial D]

I'm not sure either, but I talk to him on a regular basis on Facebook. Good, open-minded guy. He actually took the time to read and write a testimonial for a Wing Chun book I wrote.

Oh. Well that's pretty cool of him

Is there any video of him sparring against a non cooperative opponent? I can't find any.

It's impossible to really assess without that. Anyone can make themselves look good with a cooperative partner in a scripted sequence. Just ask segal!

 

[wingchun100]

Oh. Well that's pretty cool of him

Is there any video of him sparring against a non cooperative opponent? I can't find any.

It's impossible to really assess without that. Anyone can make themselves look good with a cooperative partner in a scripted sequence. Just ask segal!

I'd have to look around. He has quite a few on YouTube.

 

[Martial D]

I'd have to look around. He has quite a few on YouTube.

While there are fighters than can be effective with a static trunk and head, they are mostly wrestlers. If there's a way to make that work against someone that knows how to move and strike, as a striker, I've yet to discover it.

 

[KPM]

I'm not sure either, but I talk to him on a regular basis on Facebook. Good, open-minded guy. He actually took the time to read and write a testimonial for a Wing Chun book I wrote.

Well! Your experience has been much different than mine! In the FB Wing Chun forum he posted a video of his guys doing this beltt training where they had belts around their waists that were connected so that they couldn't back away from each other. Then they did Chi Sau that degenerated into flailing punches at each other with no technique at all. When I pointed out that it looked like they were just flailing, he called me a "Cxnt" in the forum, and then private messaged me to tell me that he thought my profile picture made me look like a "Fxcking Fxggxt." And all of this simply because I wasn't particularly impressed with a video he posted and made a simple comment! So I have a much lower opinion of the guy than you!

 

[wingchun100]

Well! Your experience has been much different than mine! In the FB Wing Chun forum he posted a video of his guys doing this beltt training where they had belts around their waists that were connected so that they couldn't back away from each other. Then they did Chi Sau that degenerated into flailing punches at each other with no technique at all. When I pointed out that it looked like they were just flailing, he called me a "Cxnt" in the forum, and then private messaged me to tell me that he thought my profile picture made me look like a "Fxcking Fxggxt." And all of this simply because I wasn't particularly impressed with a video he posted and made a simple comment! So I have a much lower opinion of the guy than you!

I rated your comment funny...not because what he DID is funny. In actuality, I dislike it...the interaction, not the post, but I didn't want to give you a negative rating.

I am sorry that has been your experience with him. This is why people say you should never meet your idols...not that he was your idol, but what they mean is, you meet the people in these videos, and then you think much less of them. For example, I admire the hell out of Emin Boztepe's skill, but I know people who have met him. They say if you manage to hit him during Chi Sao, he gets p*ssed and pours the pressure on...all because his ego can't handle that you hit him.

Not saying it's true. Just saying what I heard. And if I found out it WAS true, I'm not sure I could look at his videos the same from that point on.

 

[nikthegreek_3]

You should not combine Wing Chun with Boxing. They have totally different mentality though they have some common principles. The problem is that most people confuse Wing Chun in training with Wing Chun in actual combat and they get totally ineffective. A serious example is the punch: Most Wing Chun guys train and train in chain punches that is JUST a tool ONLY FOR TRAINING purposes and will never work in reality. Watch this video, a perfect explanation about Wing Chun's Punch and you will get my point:

 

[jobo]

You should not combine Wing Chun with Boxing. They have totally different mentality though they have some common principles. The problem is that most people confuse Wing Chun in training with Wing Chun in actual combat and they get totally ineffective. A serious example is the punch: Most Wing Chun guys train and train in chain punches that is JUST a tool ONLY FOR TRAINING purposes and will never work in reality. Watch this video, a perfect explanation about Wing Chun's Punch and you will get my point:

in what way is the mentality different

 

[nikthegreek_3]

in what way is the mentality different

For example: Boxing needs to mainly keep a distance. Wing Chun needs to close the distance so as to be able to apply it's principles (such as structure etch...). Thats is why they also use completely different way of body-movement. In boxing they lean back and forth and change height etch.. because they are based in avoiding punches. Wing Chun cannot do that because it is completely against the structure principles of the "almost" straight spine.

 

[Cynik75]

Boxing needs to mainly keep a distance.

Fighter with longer arms wants to keep distance, fighter with shorter arms wants to close distance.

In boxing they lean back and forth and change height etch.. because they are based in avoiding punches.

There is a lot of blocks in boxing.

Mr Nico from posted video said that the aim of traing is to develop muscle memory, but in fight he will do something different than in training, Why is he developing muscle memory if he do not want to use it in fight?

PS. This video is number 876876765 excuse why chunners loose fights - "they loose because the do not use TRUE/REAL wing chun, the do not use PRINCIPLES, the STRUCTURE is wrong"...
BLA, BLA, BLA
It is hardly to believe that there are no chunners who use wing chun in right way.

 

[jobo]

For example: Boxing needs to mainly keep a distance. Wing Chun needs to close the distance so as to be able to apply it's principles (such as structure etch...). Thats is why they also use completely different way of body-movement. In boxing they lean back and forth and change height etch.. because they are based in avoiding punches. Wing Chun cannot do that because it is completely against the structure principles of the "almost" straight spine.

to add to what cynik said, who said much of what i was going to say

wc main issue is going in a straight line and no reverse, that may well be ok in some situations but makes you a sitting duck against a boxer or an mma guy or anyone that can move sideways,

what i dont know is if this is proper wc or just what most wcs seem to do, which then leaves the question why?

 

[nikthegreek_3]

Fighter with longer arms wants to keep distance, fighter with shorter arms wants to close distance.

There is a lot of blocks in boxing.

Mr Nico from posted video said that the aim of traing is to develop muscle memory, but in fight he will do something different than in training, Why is he developing muscle memory if he do not want to use it in fight?

PS. This video is number 876876765 excuse why chunners loose fights - "they loose because the do not use TRUE/REAL wing chun, the do not use PRINCIPLES, the STRUCTURE is wrong"...
BLA, BLA, BLA
It is hardly to believe that there are no chunners who use wing chun in right way.

Well i disagree. The purpose of training is to develop muscle memory as correctly said in the video. And it is explained that: while in the form you are static and launch the punch at a low distance so as to develop the "Noarming" principle, in the real fight you will go with extended punches + this principle. The video also shows the wrong application of wing chun by some so called "wing chun masters". These people arm their punches and get beaten up. It is not an excuse for Wing Chun, because these people don;t have anything to do with Wing Chun. They claim that they do Wing Chun but they don't.
Of course there are chunners who use wing chun correctly. And in this case they are very difficult opponents. Wong Shun Leung for example, was never defeated (though he was a tiny person). This means definitely that Wing Chun works.

 

[nikthegreek_3]

to add to what cynik said, who said much of what i was going to say

wc main issue is going in a straight line and no reverse, that may well be ok in some situations but makes you a sitting duck against a boxer or an mma guy or anyone that can move sideways,

what i dont know is if this is proper wc or just what most wcs seem to do, which then leaves the question why?

Yes exactly. It is not proper Wing Chun. In the video the guy is executing the correct extended chain punches and he is so fast that it is impossible for the opponent to retract. And when he does the "training chain punches" he cannot reach his opponent - no way.This is the difference between correct and wrong application of the same tool.
Moreover, as he says in the end of the video, Wing Chun doesn't have only straight punches it - may be in the next video.
And as you correctly say, yes it is not proper Wing Chun. They sit like this because they don;t know Wing Chun)) In the video it is also shown how a wing chuner with the usual chain punches is punished by an opponent who moves sideways.

 

[Cynik75]

....It is not an excuse for Wing Chun, because these people don;t have anything to do with Wing Chun. They claim that they do Wing Chun but they don't.

I this way we can say that Mike Tyson winning fights was a real boxer, Mike Tyson loosing fights was not ROTFL

Of course there are chunners who use wing chun correctly. And in this case they are very difficult opponent.

Show me any video. Or any other evidence from non-chunners..

Wong Shun Leung for example, was never defeated (though he was a tiny person). This means definitely that Wing Chun works.

Beimo fights... dark alleys, rooftops, secret places. Nobody knows who, when, how has fought and both sides can claim the victory after fight. The only one existing video from beimo shows very low level (or even untrained) teenagers who fight like drunek bums. Everyone ******* who like to fight saturday night in bar can say "I have won 65 street fights", but he still is untrained amateur.

 

[jobo]

Yes exactly. It is not proper Wing Chun. In the video the guy is executing the correct extended chain punches and he is so fast that it is impossible for the opponent to retract. And when he does the "training chain punches" he cannot reach his opponent - no way.This is the difference between correct and wrong application of the same tool.
Moreover, as he says in the end of the video, Wing Chun doesn't have only straight punches it - may be in the next video.
And as you correctly say, yes it is not proper Wing Chun. They sit like this because they don;t know Wing Chun)) In the video it is also shown how a wing chuner with the usual chain punches is punished by an opponent who moves sideways.

there are folk on here who have putt decades into wing chun, they are much betrer placed than i to discuss the merits of what the giy in the vid is saying.

but from a,simple perspective, if he is showing "fake "wing chuners being knocked over as evidence that its fake, then he needs to go up against similar opponents to show why he is better.

all he is offering is some guy hitting a pad and a very nice vista of some boats and of course the obligatory bl clip

 

[nikthegreek_3]

there are folk on here who have putt decades into wing chun, they are much betrer placed than i to discuss the merits of what the giy in the vid is saying.

but from a,simple perspective, if he is showing "fake "wing chuners being knocked over as evidence that its fake, then he needs to go up against similar opponents to show why he is better.

all he is offering is some guy hitting a pad and a very nice vista of some boats

Well, you are right there are guys who spent a whole life learning fake things. Of course there are. So what? This doesn't prove that Wing Chun doesn't work. Also this guy in the video, is quite well known for his fighting ability (i think he didn't need to advertise this in the video - though his speed and technique is visible). But no matter what this guy is, i mentioned Wong Shun Leung: He is historically accepted as the "king of talking hands". He had many rooftop fights with different systems and he was never defeated. Then how is it possible that Wing Chun doesn;t work? If it doesn;t work, why he was never defeated?? (And it is not a myth - it is a quite recent history - well known in the world of martial arts).