Wing Chun Boxing
- Thread starter KPM
- Start date
Keith: What you are doing is a lot like where I've been going with my WC and Escrima. You know what my "WT" background was. Here's what the Latosa Escrima figure eight pattern looked like back in the 80s and early 90s when applied to empty hands back. The sound effects are classic!
I love WC. I'm very new to it and think it's a great art. However, I think styles/systems do matter despite the idea that they don't when it comes to preparing someone for a real fight. Boxing offers better footwork, better punches from numerous angles, better overall movement (such as head movement), and better training for speed and timing. Simple is often better. Bruce Lee knew this. The evidence is there. As a striking art, WC falls behind boxing for real world effectiveness. It's more complete and diverse overall, but lacks the attributes that boxing offers that win fights. Add in Muay Thai elbows/kicking to boxing and you have probably the number striking art for real world self defense. Throw in BJJ and you're pretty good to go overall.
I think what KPM, Rackemann etc. are doing is fantastic. I think the blending of arts is what everyone should do.
If you love WC and get what you want out of it, that's all that matters though. Whether it's the movements, weapons, kicking or philosophy behind that keeps you motivated in mastering it, those are great things....don't stop. However, if you want to make it more street/ring/self-defense effective, modification is likely going to be necessary.
The idea that you need to train an art for 10 years to get it work is absurd IMO. Maybe 10 years to master it, but it should be effective much sooner than that or there is something wrong with it.
Bruce Lee: "someone with only 1 year of training in boxing and wrestling can easily defeat a martial artist of 20 years of experience.”
I think what KPM, Rackemann etc. are doing is fantastic. I think the blending of arts is what everyone should do.
If you love WC and get what you want out of it, that's all that matters though. Whether it's the movements, weapons, kicking or philosophy behind that keeps you motivated in mastering it, those are great things....don't stop. However, if you want to make it more street/ring/self-defense effective, modification is likely going to be necessary.
The idea that you need to train an art for 10 years to get it work is absurd IMO. Maybe 10 years to master it, but it should be effective much sooner than that or there is something wrong with it.
Bruce Lee: "someone with only 1 year of training in boxing and wrestling can easily defeat a martial artist of 20 years of experience.”
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Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Coming from a different background, I disagree.
The thing is, everyone speaks from their own experience. It’s good to have belief in what you do, but there is a whole lot of stuff out there with which you have no experience. So blanket statements like the one above, really miss a whole lot.
I would say rather that what you propose above can be a very effective combination, if it fits with your personality and inclinations.
But there are a lot of other things for which that is also true.
There simply are no absolutes, in this game.
I haven't had to read through the thread but some of Rackemann's ideas puzzle me. Why try to force Wing Chun to work in boxing range when it's clearly better adapted for the clinch? Why not just use regular boxing and then use Wing Chun to transition into grappling? Why sacrifice the power in a regular long-range horizontal punch for a vertical one, when the reason Chun's strikes are vertical in the first place is because they're meant to be performed at a range where you wouldn't be able to get any power from a horizontal punch?
Nobody Important
2nd Black Belt
This is a good question, one I've brought up in the past. Perhaps someone will offer you a logical response. Good luck.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Boxing has short range concepts that transition into grappling.
Why do wing chun at all?
I mean if you have to do boxing from other ranges. Then do some sort of stand up grappling system in the clinch.
You could pretty much save yourself a system.
"For the hell of it" has been good enough reason for many things in my life. In this case, "because you can" or "for the love of Wing Chun" both work, too.
What makes you think Rackemann does all of that? He starts his students out learning "standard" boxing for a full year before he starts showing them any Wing Chun.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
There you go then. Both questions answered.
That’s kind of where I’ve arrived with WC and why I stopped training in it after SLT.
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