What is your highest tested belt rank?

[The Master]

Yes.


Raw footage. So I guess you're not right all the time, despite your expressed opinion of yourself, and of others' training and testing.

Which soke board was it?

Please don't force your assumptions that we all cheat/don't deserve our belts/etc. on us simply because for some people it is true.

There are a lot of belt factories and McDojo's out there - that's not in debate. That does not mean, however, that everyone who has ever attained a rank did so in an inappropriate fashion. As has been said, my test for each rank began the day I stepped on the mat after the previous testing, and culminated in the test itself. Pretesting occurred throughout each time I stepped on the floor.

But you were on the floor, and demonstrated your skill and spirt each time you set foot on there. You didn't get promoted because you had perfect attendance, or a nice smile, or bought the GM lunch.

If it is not possible to fail, then it is not a test; however, as an instructor, I will not put a student up for testing who cannot pass - that is poor practice on my part. That does not, however, guarantee that students will pass, and I have had students who have not, for a wide variety of reasons, ranging from lack of effort at testing to a nervous breakdown (and a I mean that literally; said student has a biochemical mood disorder which includes anxiety, and lost it totally before testing - but he came back the next time and performed beautifully) - but performing under stress is part of the testing process. Anyone can perform in class, in familiar surroundings, with only classmates to watch, where the goal is catch and correct mistakes - it is much harder to perform in front of a test board, with family, friends, and cameras watching.

How one deals with failure, is also a test. There is a difference between the "brainfart" and the "never knew it in the first place". The instructor who knows their students well enough to know the difference is a good one, in my not so humble opinion.

What she said. For a person who is so concerned about the testing processes others undergo, I find it interesting that you call yourself "The Master" - a title I generally expected to be bestowed, not taken.

I am what I am. http://dict.die.net/master/

 

[The Master]

Yeah, it does appear that he is a Master Baiter.

Did I really just say that?

*ducking for cover*
:redcaptur

Come again? Sometimes the comments rub one the wrong way. It makes a mess out of perfectly normal meglomania.

 

[Blindside]

Come again? Sometimes the comments rub one the wrong way. It makes a mess out of perfectly normal meglomania.

Still dodging the question?

 

[The Master]

Still dodging the question?

Not at all.
I was asked what my highest rank is.
I answered. "Mastre"
I was asked who tested me.
My own departed instructor, who never cared for fame.
There are no levels, ranks, dans, or their ilk, just training.
Hard training, and a disdain for self promoting egos, who wear muti striped belts, who misuse foreign languages, who try to buy prestige, and purchase that which their own shortcomings otherwise keep them from.

I have no problem with those who train in arts that keep score. When the art is legit, it is a good way to tell where people stand. But today, it is too easy to buy rank, rather than earn it. So I asked who tested.

The answers are interesting. Diverse. Educating.
They give me more respect for a number of people here, some who already had it, but now a bit more is understood on their own journey.


Salute.

 

[terryl965]

Not at all.
I was asked what my highest rank is.
I answered. "Mastre"
I was asked who tested me.
My own departed instructor, who never cared for fame.
There are no levels, ranks, dans, or their ilk, just training.
Hard training, and a disdain for self promoting egos, who wear muti striped belts, who misuse foreign languages, who try to buy prestige, and purchase that which their own shortcomings otherwise keep them from.

I have no problem with those who train in arts that keep score. When the art is legit, it is a good way to tell where people stand. But today, it is too easy to buy rank, rather than earn it. So I asked who tested.

The answers are interesting. Diverse. Educating.
They give me more respect for a number of people here, some who already had it, but now a bit more is understood on their own journey.


Salute.

Ok I'm one of those people with the stripes on my belt, so what? I can tell you this I never ask or begged for my stripes and when I get ask a straight forward question I can answer it without dodging around corners. I find everything you have said when ask a question to be disrespectful and down right rude toward some highly qualify people on this forum. Why hide who and what you are if you are of any important to anybody elses training and have been training and your Instructor is decease than why not say. I tell people who I have trained with and I;m proud of the poeple that have given me far more than I could ever give them.

A master of what duck and dodge.

Yes I almost never get angry here on this forum but you sir have deistrated lack of Humility and respect towards your fellow Martial Artist here on thei forum.

What style are you me TKD and proud of it
What rank are you me 4th dan Kukkiwon certified and 5th Okinawa Karate
Where do you train and who do you train with, again me I own and operate a school located in Arlington Texas and train under the guideience of 5 other Master that I have mention before.

You bring this upon yourself for being not up front with answer to legitament question.

 

[wade]

Go to www.usakarate.org and go to the link page if ya wanna see something interesting. They will register you as an individual member and also give you BB rank all the way up to master for a very reasonable price be it Karate, Taekwondo, Jujitsu are what ever. If at anytime you think your own system does not respect you nor give you due credit for what you have done this is the place to go. Then when questions like who tested you and where you tested and what your rank is (here it is $100 per Dan, all the way up to 10th), well then you can give them an honest answer. Pardon any misspelled words, it's hard to type this while I am still laughing so hard about it. SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, don't beat each other up, the answer is right here.......................:mst:.

 

[terryl965]

Go to www.usakarate.org and go to the link page if ya wanna see something interesting. They will register you as an individual member and also give you BB rank all the way up to master for a very reasonable price be it Karate, Taekwondo, Jujitsu are what ever. If at anytime you think your own system does not respect you nor give you due credit for what you have done this is the place to go. Then when questions like who tested you and where you tested and what your rank is (here it is $100 per Dan, all the way up to 10th), well then you can give them an honest answer. Pardon any misspelled words, it's hard to type this while I am still laughing so hard about it. SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, don't beat each other up, the answer is right here.......................:mst:.

Wade if only I knew this before all the training and to think I could be a 10th already and be in there hall of fame too!!!!

 

[The Master]

Wade has found a source of my complaint.
Belt mills, mcdojos, old boy networks, and their ilk.

No disrespect was meant towards any legitimate people.
Who have I disrespected?
I haven't named any names.
So I fail to see why there is hostility towards me.

But please, don't tell me that showing up for class 3 times a week for 2 years somehow is equal to skill and ability, or that sending a check and a vhs tape to some PO box in Florida for fat men to watch is the same as stepping on the floor live.

Let me put this another way.

You have a child.
The child goes to school.
The child knows the material.
You know it.
The teacher knows it.
The child fails the test.
Should that child be promoted?

If the answer is no, then why argue when the same situation occurs in a martial arts school?
If the answer is yes, do you go to the school and argue with the teacher when they hold the child back?


Some people are getting upset, yet are failing to see the larger picture.
I asked what your highest tested rank was.
Every art and organization has different standards. There is a point where the learning stops, and the perfecting or mastery begins.
One would hope that one is at least as good at 8th as they were at 5th.
That 10 years from now you will be more polished and efficient than you were 10 years ago.

I am not condemning anyone for stripes.
Just if they put on bought or traded rank.
My own rank and training is irrelevant. I have claimed neither on this site, other than "Master".

 

[terryl965]

Just if they put on bought or traded rank

Well I bought mine for 39.95 plus tax when I passed my test, just kidding.
Master as you put why can you not just answer the question about your own rank and who you was trained by. It would give some credit to what you have to say, in my years of training 40 plus I know when most people skit the issue they are normanally hiding something. Not saying you are but you are being evasive about point blank question.

 

[The Master]

Originally Posted by The Master
Oh, and to any "sokes" who will argue that they were examined by a board of their peers/seniors, I have 2 simple questions. 1-Has anyone ever failed the test?

Originally Posted by Kacey
Yes.

Kacey, I reread an earlier post of yours. That wasn't what I was referring to when I said video testing. I was referring to the trend of rank-mills to take a large check and a video test in order to "award" grandmaster or "founder" or "soke" status. Soke is as most know, an abused Japanese word usually used by half-rate martial artists when they can't cut it in a legit school and open their own "system".

Legit schools may use it in certain situations. Legit schools also fail people.
I am unaware of any soke board that has ever failed to "recognize" someone once the check has cleared. I have asked around, and no one I have asked here are aware of any either. I would be interested in hearing of one that actually does have standards other than if the check clears.

 

[Brandon Fisher]

I understand where you are coming from. I have been teaching non stop for the past 14 years 13 on my own for the most part. I have not worked a regular full time job ever because I have either taught full time or have owned my own business that allowed me to teach 20+ hours a week. I now have opened a full time school and I am teaching 6 days a week and training on my own also. Note the dojo opens at 11am m-f and 9am on saturday until 5pm. I understand dedication and hard work to get rank advancement. But I also understand that people incure costs when getting promotions through associations. To me thats not the same as just buying the rank. I have been in martial arts for over 22 years and I have loved every minute of it along with the blood sweat and tears. This includes training in Karate, Ju Jitsu and some Kobudo.

Now do I have issues with diploma mills? Oh yeah I do. My testing fees in my school are $20 up 4th Kyu then it is $25. My shodan testing fees are high but it barely covers costs. Certificate, assoc dues and recognition, and a embroidered belt from Okinawa. These places that charge $500 for a 5th dan with no resume presented drives me crazy. Or these guys that claim sokeship with no backing or they buy it. I founded my system and have recently been officially recognized as the founder and awarded the title of soke of Seijitsu Shin Do - Karate Do. But my students know me as Sensei or Sensei Brandon only. They are taught the way I was taught and they work hard for their rank. I admit I allowed one promotion to go through when the student should have failed but I admit it came back to bite me and I won't ever allow it to happen again.

My point is there is no reason to come out and slam these people it does not do any good at all. Worry about your school and your students, make them top grade. Top grade martial arts makes the school legitimate, nothing else.

 

[grydth]

The training and the experiences were of infinitely more value than any symbol I ever got.

All my Tai Chi instructor (Ken Nichols) ever awarded me after a test was a small statue..... but getting by that hurdle opened up the door to learning much more..... and since he had the good sense to turn the review into a major exercise in humility, I have trained much harder after that test.

For some years I had an Iaido instructor, Bob Poresky, who didn't use rank. But he was one of the best teachers I have ever had for anything. I learned to use the katana my father, a Marine Captain, brought back from the Pacific War.

I recall literally being beaten within an inch of my life on a green belt test at a kenpo dojo run by Al Dutton circa 1980. These were the full contact sparring days, and he told you up front that if you slacked they would pound you into the ground. I can still remember watching the blood and sweat drip while I waited for the result. More importantly, the skills and toughness I picked up from Sensei Dutton would save my life a few short years later....

I don't have any great belts from the martial arts - just an enriched (and preserved) life...... and you know, that's enough.

 

[Blindside]

No disrespect was meant towards any legitimate people.
Who have I disrespected?
I haven't named any names.
So I fail to see why there is hostility towards me.
.....
My own rank and training is irrelevant. I have claimed neither on this site, other than "Master".

I think this is the problem. Your original question you asked

What is your current rank, and when was the last test you stepped on a floor and showed your metal to a senior or panel of peers?

And when questioned about your own rank you simply say Master (actually Mastre, which sounds Portuguese), and that your tester is deceased. You are correct, while you answered the question you were asked, you did not answer the question you posed. It was also an opportunity to give a little background about yourself, and perhaps show why you had brought this topic up in the first place. The distinct lack of it seemed like you were avoiding any discussion about yourself.

So I'll repose your own question to you: "What is your current rank and when was the last test you stepped on a floor and showed your metal to a senior or panel of peers? And I'll add my own question; "what style do you study." I'm just curious, information about me is on my profile.

Lamont

 

[Haze]

Originally Posted by Haze
My instructor is always telling me I need to test for higher rank. My reply,,,," If you think I deserve it, then promote me."

Hm. Well ... in a TMA I can see where the attitude might keep you from getting promoted. :idunno:

My instructor knows my attitude and it's not what you have implied. I've known my instructor for about 20 yrs. I know my place in the line. This is said to him in private. I have no need to prove myself to anyone at this stage of my life. No need for more rank. Knowledge is all I'm after.

 

[Steel Tiger]

Go to www.usakarate.org and go to the link page if ya wanna see something interesting. They will register you as an individual member and also give you BB rank all the way up to master for a very reasonable price be it Karate, Taekwondo, Jujitsu are what ever. If at anytime you think your own system does not respect you nor give you due credit for what you have done this is the place to go. Then when questions like who tested you and where you tested and what your rank is (here it is $100 per Dan, all the way up to 10th), well then you can give them an honest answer. Pardon any misspelled words, it's hard to type this while I am still laughing so hard about it. SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, don't beat each other up, the answer is right here.......................:mst:.

Excellent, I've been thinking about learning some Jujitsu, Karate, Taekwondo, but what's the point if I'm not a 5 or 6 dan?

 

[James Kovacich]

My own rank and training is irrelevant. I have claimed neither on this site, other than "Master".

Master of what? A "recognized" traditional style? Your own style? If you can't answer the questions you ask. Then why ask?

You should rethink your thoughts as to what your MOTIVES are AND if you "really" know what you "think" you know.

You might get more respect if you filled out your profile.

 

[FearlessFreep]

My instructor knows my attitude and it's not what you have implied. I've known my instructor for about 20 yrs. I know my place in the line. This is said to him in private. I have no need to prove myself to anyone at this stage of my life. No need for more rank. Knowledge is all I'm after.

At the shcool I attend, our iunstructor won't test us until he knows that we can pass the test so that's know big deal. But then the test tends to be grueling. He says "I already know you can do what's required, now it's about character and heart and determination and spirit". The test is not about knowing the material, it's about have the strength of will and desire to survive the test.

Nobody wears belts in class, and nobody has to test if hey just want to train. All he uses the belts for is to know "what are you training on now" Heck, I don't even have a belt for the class (although I've passed the tests). But if you haven't taken the time to test, it does limit some of what you can progress on with.

 

[shesulsa]

My instructor knows my attitude and it's not what you have implied. I've known my instructor for about 20 yrs. I know my place in the line. This is said to him in private. I have no need to prove myself to anyone at this stage of my life. No need for more rank. Knowledge is all I'm after.

With all due respect, I haven't implied anything - the :idunno: smiley indicates that I cannot possibly know your specific situation. I'm glad you and your instructor have an understanding.

 

[Dave Leverich]

Dave, I got my 1st in 1970 so as you can see I have just been shooting up through the ranks.................................. . I figure at the rate I'm going I'll see my 7th about the time I turn 70.

Hehe, my dad has a quote for where I was in 1970...
bouncing ball to ball

Born in 71, we're speed demons of rank heh.

 

[Kwan Jang]

In awnser to the original post, my highest earned rank is sixth dan. I spent a year working directly on it with my weight training, cardio, nutrition and martial arts training being directly monitored and journaled. My testing was five days and five nights w/ very little sleep or food along the same format as BUDS "hell week". We also had fun things like Native American sweat lodges and team work drills at high altitudes.

Curriculum that I had to master included 14-boxing defenses and counters, 7-double stick strikes, 6-stick and kick combos, kickboxing pattern, kickboxing combinations, 12-corner block and counter, lock and block stick, lock and block stick and knife,stick flow, counter w/ the flow, counter against the flow, 9-count sinawalli, redondo, 5-knife disarms, knife against knife (electric shock knife), knife counter and thrust, CDT gun disarms, Bo staff fighting form, grappling defenses, NHB-MMA fighting pattern, Choo Moo 4, free sparring boxing, free sparring kickboxing, free sparring grappling, free sparring NHB-MMA, adrenal stress challenge, and our system's teaching methods.

My judges included my instructors, KJN Ernie Reyes and KJN Tony Thompson (7th dan-which ids the highest rank in our system), also a Hapkido 9th dan for that portion of the test, and UFC veterans Bob Cook and Frank Shamrock (5x UFC champ) for the grappling and NHB portions of the test. Also some of the Fairtex instructors, including "Woodman" and "Dr. Knees" (i'm not even going to try to mangle the spelling of their real names), as well as former ISKA world champions Jean Claude Leuwer (spelling?) and Javier Mendez for the kickboxing.

On another note, though "the Master" is not very forthcoming on his own experiences and credentials, I do see where he is coming from. There are FAR too many people who claim rank that is either "bought" or cross ranked. Look on some websites of the "soke" organizations or different associations that will cross rank each other. IMO, it can damage the public image of what the rest of us have worked hard for for decades. I remember a case a few years back when an investigative reporter in Florida sent in a certification for fifth dan for her dog to the World Black Belt Bureau and then she showed that for a $50 fee, her dog Rex (using her last name)was issued a fifth degree master's certificate.