How effective is sport BJJ (or GJJ) on the Street?

[ShotoNoob]

It's a very legit argument that the current BJJ only training is not the best for street defense, but IMO, it's still a lot better than most of the unrealistic SD training, that claims to be so realistic.

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Yeah, I just can't get why people object to BJJ for self defense. The real revolution from BJJ is that the took the Japanese TMA JuJitsu's and made BJJ practical & pragmatic and streamlined for most to learn. BJJ is hugely popular because of that... IMO.

And mainly due to the fact that BJJ trains hard and spars hard, every single class. 30-45 minutes of sparring, every class at 80-100% power & intensity is a hell of a lot compared to TMA & SD classes, and will get you excellent strength & conditioning and somewhat, significant fighting mentality.

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I don't do full contact. However as I understand, this reality was driving reason that Jigoro Kano created Judo. The way most Japanese JuJitsu was approached & practiced @ that time was military in flavor where you killed or maimed your opponent, kind of no quarters.
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Again another explosion in popularity.

 

[K-man]

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I think BJJ is great. But I don't understand how BJJ principles can't be almost immediately adapted to street self defense. To the extent that the street attacks are similar to what MMA fighters encounter in structure, what they see in the Cage.
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Is the way most BJJ taught RBSD as mentors here are training? heck No.... Same goes for the karate I train. Can I use my karate to KO a bully who's shoving me around, threatening me? Yes or No?

Certainly. In some situations you can effectively use what you have. BJJ was originally designed for the street and proven there. Since it has developed more for sport.

But hey, don't take my word for it ...

If you can't watch it all, at least watch a couple of minutes from 6:00.

 

[FriedRice]

this may be a little slow moving but worth the watch.

Here's what low level MMA fighters who probably don't have a chance of ever making it in the UFC, are doing:

I like it though.

 

[ShotoNoob]

Certainly. In some situations you can effectively use what you have. BJJ was originally designed for the street and proven there. Since it has developed more for sport....
...If you can't watch it all, at least watch a couple of minutes from 6:00.

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Precisely. As the context of the situation changes, your actions change. It's really straight forward to the thinking martial artist.
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Here they also mention that a specific program has been developed to prepare you specifically for street-wise usage. At the same time, there is a base or foundation under it all. THANKS....
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Will benefit those having any confusion....
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I'd mention the principle part of KIME here, but that's 'karate' so I've been admonished....

 

[sinthetik_mistik]

Over the past 18 months, every thread where we have tried to discuss Karate, Aikido, Wing Chun or any other martial art you'd like to name, eventually it has turned into an arguement where it is pointed out how BJJ or MMA is so much better and the training inherent in any other style is vastly inferior to the sport based styles that spar. Even more, even those that spar are inferior because they don't have a specialised ground game of BJJ.

Now I happen to think that BJJ is a great martial art and MMA is great for anyone who wants to test themselves in the relatively safe environment of the ring, but how effective is BJJ in the street?

I'll start out by saying that BJJ, like many martial arts, is mostly taught in a way that produces excellent fighters for the ring but does not prepare you for the street.

Let's put BJJ under the microscope without style bashing please.

I didn't read all 6 pages of comments on this thread so there is a good chance that what I'm about to say has been said already but yeah, I'm gonna say it anyway. I will start by saying that if I was an Octagon fighter and had to choose one martial art, it would be BJJ. However, on the street it can be less dominant. The obvious flaw being the inability to fight multiple attackers. Another obvious weakness is that if someone is fighting dirty, they can do all kinds of things to prevent a submission grab, such as grabbing the balls... if you are up against some kind of striker, you wouldn't be able to get close enough to him to grab his balls, or bite him, or stick your finger in his eyes, if he is a potent striker, he will neutralize you before you get the opportunity to any of those things. But BJJ is up close and personal, making it easier to do all of these things. But yeah in cage fighting it is second to none.

 

[Tez3]

I will start by saying that if I was an Octagon fighter

I assume you mean an MMA fighter? MMA competitions aren't confined to an 'octagon', they are often in rings or on mats, the octagon is a word the UFC uses.
The whole point of MMA is that it is what it says on the tin, 'mixed' so choosing one style is pointless and will lose you the fight, that goes for any style not just BJJ. There is another style of groundwork I find even better than BJJ, that's Sambo, you will also find a lot of catch wrestlers, wrestlers, Judoka and grapplers who will tell you that BJJ is good but not the best.

 

[Hanzou]

I didn't read all 6 pages of comments on this thread so there is a good chance that what I'm about to say has been said already but yeah, I'm gonna say it anyway. I will start by saying that if I was an Octagon fighter and had to choose one martial art, it would be BJJ. However, on the street it can be less dominant. The obvious flaw being the inability to fight multiple attackers. Another obvious weakness is that if someone is fighting dirty, they can do all kinds of things to prevent a submission grab, such as grabbing the balls... if you are up against some kind of striker, you wouldn't be able to get close enough to him to grab his balls, or bite him, or stick your finger in his eyes, if he is a potent striker, he will neutralize you before you get the opportunity to any of those things. But BJJ is up close and personal, making it easier to do all of these things. But yeah in cage fighting it is second to none.

Laughable.

You're not going to stop skilled grappler by grabbing them in the balls, unless that grappler's testicles are swinging around freely near your arms. Biting, and attempting to eye gouge are also sure fire ways to allow the grappler to completely have their way with you, because instead of properly defending yourself from the actual grapple, you're leaving your limbs wide open for a variety of locks and chokes.

If you are unfortunate enough to have a skilled Bjj practitioner attack you (I seriously doubt that would happen, because the vast majority of Bjj guys are pretty laid back), all those "dirty tricks" are just going to get you hurt. Bjj practitioners are trained to completely restrict the movement of their opponents. If I'm on top of you and you try to poke out my eyes, you've just given your arm up for me to play with. If you attempt to bite me, you've exposed your head and neck to cranks and choking. If you're going for my nuts, I can quickly shift my position to move my nuts out of your reach, and make your life miserable.

You can't beat technical skill with silly nonsense. Bjj wouldn't have lasted this long if you could negate it with playground antics. Fighting in general is up close and personal. I've fought guys from other styles who literally freeze up when I close the distance on them. In a SD situation, someone will be in your face, grabbing you and trying to do physical damage to you.

As for multiple opponents, no MA is reliable against more than one person attacking you. Stop watching Kung Fu movies. Real life isn't a Bruce Lee flick.

 

[elder999]

Laughable.

You're not going to stop skilled grappler by grabbing them in the balls, unless that grappler's testicles are swinging around freely near your arms. Biting, and attempting to eye gouge are also sure fire ways to allow the grappler to completely have their way with you, because instead of properly defending yourself from the actual grapple, you're leaving your limbs wide open for a variety of locks and chokes.

If you are unfortunate enough to have a skilled Bjj practitioner attack you (I seriously doubt that would happen, because the vast majority of Bjj guys are pretty laid back), all those "dirty tricks" are just going to get you hurt.

 

[Hanzou]

Yeah, like I said, laughable (and pretty disgusting).

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Hanzou,

Biting it pretty effective when done right. It really is hard to argue that.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

It is also really disgusting.

 

[Hanzou]

Hanzou,

Biting it pretty effective when done right. It really is hard to argue that.

Effective in what way? Effective in ending a confrontation? I would say no. Effective as a way to get you out of a hold? Again I would say no. Effective as a brief distraction that would briefly relieve the pressure I'm putting on you? Perhaps, but you're also just as likely to escalate the situation with you remaining in an inferior position. If I'm holding someone in side mount and they somehow bite my neck (something I find highly doubtful if you're properly executing side mount, which was NOT done in that video), I'm going to smash them in the face with my elbows or fists so they don't do it again. So congratulations. You went from me just putting you to sleep, to me now turning your face into hamburger, and THEN putting you to sleep.

That video was a joke.

 

[elder999]

That video was a joke.

Yeah, I laughed too...whatever.

 

[drop bear]

Hanzou,

Biting it pretty effective when done right. It really is hard to argue that.

Biting is more effective when the person doing it understands how grappling works. Same with defending bites.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Biting is more effective when the person doing it understands how grappling works. Same with defending bites.

Absolutely!

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Effective in what way? Effective in ending a confrontation? I would say no. Effective as a way to get you out of a hold? Again I would say no. Effective as a brief distraction that would briefly relieve the pressure I'm putting on you? Perhaps, but you're also just as likely to escalate the situation with you remaining in an inferior position. If I'm holding someone in side mount and they somehow bite my neck (something I find highly doubtful if you're properly executing side mount, which was NOT done in that video), I'm going to smash them in the face with my elbows or fists so they don't do it again. So congratulations. You went from me just putting you to sleep, to me now turning your face into hamburger, and THEN putting you to sleep.

That video was a joke.

I really doubt that if someone is biting you deeply that you will react that way. More than likely you will be doing everything you can to get away from them as you are screaming.

I also though the video was hilarious by the way.

 

[Hanzou]

Biting is more effective when the person doing it understands how grappling works. Same with defending bites.

I don't see how knowledge of grappling would make you a more effective biter. In the end, if you need to resort to biting, I hope you have great dental insurance because you're more than likely going to lose your teeth.

 

[Hanzou]

I really doubt that if someone is biting you deeply that you will react that way. More than likely you will be doing everything you can to get away from them as you are screaming.

I also though the video was hilarious by the way.

You're kidding right? If I have someone in a controlled position, what exactly are they going to bite that will force me to release my hold on them?

This line of argumentation is about as bad as people saying they can dick-punch their way out of grappling.

 

[sinthetik_mistik]

I assume you mean an MMA fighter? MMA competitions aren't confined to an 'octagon', they are often in rings or on mats, the octagon is a word the UFC uses.
The whole point of MMA is that it is what it says on the tin, 'mixed' so choosing one style is pointless and will lose you the fight, that goes for any style not just BJJ. There is another style of groundwork I find even better than BJJ, that's Sambo, you will also find a lot of catch wrestlers, wrestlers, Judoka and grapplers who will tell you that BJJ is good but not the best.

No, I don't mean MMA fighter, I mean UFC fighter. I know that UFC is MMA, I was just saying in a hypothetical situation.

 

[sinthetik_mistik]

No, I don't mean MMA fighter, I mean UFC fighter. I know that UFC is MMA, I was just saying in a hypothetical situation.

yeah i am no expert on grappling martial arts. All I know about Sambo is that it is a Russian grappling martial art. I've seen it used in Anthony Bourdain as well as Burn Notice