Train TMA but fight like kickboxer

[Gerry Seymour]

In the following discussion, does B have a point? (Please notice that A uses "one" and not "you".)

A: If one wants to lean how to fight, he has to fight.
B: You should not shove your opinion into my throat.

That's fine, because it states the condition, rather than assuming it. If A says "Anyone who wants to study a MA should _______", he's probably stating a preference that doesn't apply to a significant number of people. There are exceptions ("Anyone who wants to study a MA should visit more than one school before deciding" is okay, because that'd apply to pretty much anyone).

 

[Gerry Seymour]

In the following discussion, I understand each and every word that B is saying. But I don't understand the meaning of his whole sentence. Can someone help me on this?

A: What's the difference between long fist kick and Taiji kick?
B: It may be no different in your training. But it's different in my training. Difference of emphasis, difference of training methods.
A: ???

A difference of training methods, to me, doesn't at all imply a difference in the kick, itself. And a difference in emphasis seems like just nuance. If the base mechanics are the same, but one uses a bit more hip and the other a bit more knee (I don't even know what that would mean - just making a point), they're the same kick, performed a bit differently. And that small difference is probably more individual-dependent than style-dependent.

 

[dvcochran]

The EE "digital logic design" is a self study course. You study one chapter, you then take the test. If you pass, you study next chapter. This is an example that if the information is recorded completely, self-study is possible.

Many university course just require you to read a book. At the end of that semester, you write a paper. The teacher then grades on your paper. This is an example that even if the information is not recorded completely, self-study is still possible.

IMO, to learn MA before the 21th century without a teacher could be difficult. But today, it's possible.

I have had to take that class twice during the course of my degree seeking 'education'. The first time it did not have lab class, the second time it did. Granted, I was older and already had a good amount of experience, but I was bored to tears during the first class. I also remember watching how most kids responded when a lab class was included. It was pretty cool as you could really see the light come on for them.

I have taught similar classes at our local vocation school (college of applied science) several times and I always integrate the hands on/applied while going through the book learning. Then circle back to each topic.

The worst thing that can happen is for a person who works 100% in the physical present to get rooted and stuck in a bunch of theory that the never really understood in the first place. Happens all the time to fresh college graduates.

Although somewhat reversed, I fully believe this is just as true in the martial arts. Learning the how is important but a good bit futile if a person never learns the why.
And to be clear, learning the how takes Much longer than people think.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Are you talking about the part from around 8 to 8.5 minutes in? I was impressed throughout, but that absolutely requires a lot more strength than people would give credit for just watching without holding one of those.

@Wing Woo Gar if I read right in the other thread, that was your sifu correct? Very impressive, you are lucky to have trained under him. At 10:30-10:35 he also has a conditioning drill built into that 2-person form that is incredibly effective, but I've only ever seen done in my first school as a kid (and the later instructors when I went back to that school after college did not know it). Until just now, wasn't entirely sure if I made it up in my head.

Those guys are my Sigung’s students. My Sifu was one of their contemporaries. James Wing Woo is my Sigung. Paul Gale was my Sifu. I was trained by both. The guys in the video were Rick Flores and Rich Montgomery.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

They all have a habit of dying early. Wing Chun, Hung Ga, Jeet Kune Do.

Comparing them to the Tai Chi dudes, I'm of the mind those guys got it right. In the end.

What if someone does both equally?

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Are you talking about the part from around 8 to 8.5 minutes in? I was impressed throughout, but that absolutely requires a lot more strength than people would give credit for just watching without holding one of those.

@Wing Woo Gar if I read right in the other thread, that was your sifu correct? Very impressive, you are lucky to have trained under him. At 10:30-10:35 he also has a conditioning drill built into that 2-person form that is incredibly effective, but I've only ever seen done in my first school as a kid (and the later instructors when I went back to that school after college did not know it). Until just now, wasn't entirely sure if I made it up in my head.

There are a lot of videos of these guys. Some of the forms they are doing are pretty rare these days. I will attempt posting some more.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

There are a lot of videos of these guys. Some of the forms they are doing are pretty rare these days. I will attempt posting some more.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Are you talking about the part from around 8 to 8.5 minutes in? I was impressed throughout, but that absolutely requires a lot more strength than people would give credit for just watching without holding one of those.

@Wing Woo Gar if I read right in the other thread, that was your sifu correct? Very impressive, you are lucky to have trained under him. At 10:30-10:35 he also has a conditioning drill built into that 2-person form that is incredibly effective, but I've only ever seen done in my first school as a kid (and the later instructors when I went back to that school after college did not know it). Until just now, wasn't entirely sure if I made it up in my head.

Hers another one

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Are you talking about the part from around 8 to 8.5 minutes in? I was impressed throughout, but that absolutely requires a lot more strength than people would give credit for just watching without holding one of those.

@Wing Woo Gar if I read right in the other thread, that was your sifu correct? Very impressive, you are lucky to have trained under him. At 10:30-10:35 he also has a conditioning drill built into that 2-person form that is incredibly effective, but I've only ever seen done in my first school as a kid (and the later instructors when I went back to that school after college did not know it). Until just now, wasn't entirely sure if I made it up in my head.

Another.

 

[Oily Dragon]

The difference is that there is a sense of toughness that comes with Wing Chun, Hung Ga, and Jeet Kune Do. It doesn't only happen in martial arts but also in other fighting systems. People think that just because they are in great shape that nothing can kill them. So instead of going to the doctor when they should, they try to "fighting it out"with the illness.

I 've come across a lot of "tough guys" in my life who say "I'm going to sweat out this cold or fever" Instead of going to the doctor. Tons of these same guys were killed by Covid as well. A weaker person would be driving to the doctor as soon as possible. Women live longer for the same reason. If they get sick then they want to get treatment right away. (In general). Men are knuckles heads and think that it's something they can beat. The more fit a person is, the more of a knuckle head they will be.

I count myself in that group sometimes. It's not a good way to be and I hope I'll do better about taking care of myself.

There's a sad photo out there of such a guy, he was totally svelte before he caught COVID, then he lost almost all his muscle mass. I won't even try to find it or post it, it's that sad.

Sad panda. But at least he's still alive.

 

[Flying Crane]

@Wing Woo Gar interesting videos you posted. As a ex-Tracy lineage kenpo guy, I saw snippets of things that looked like it could have been original source material for the Parker downstream kenpo.

 

[JowGaWolf]

There's a sad photo out there of such a guy, he was totally svelte before he caught COVID, then he lost almost all his muscle mass. I won't even try to find it or post it, it's that sad.

Sad panda. But at least he's still alive.

The sad part is that you can google bodybuilder covid-19 and see more than one person who looked at being in shape as a cure all. It wasn't until I started looking at things that way that I understood why some of the Martial Arts legends died young. People who do "Super feats" sometimes forget that they are just normal people like the rest of us.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

@Wing Woo Gar interesting videos you posted. As a ex-Tracy lineage kenpo guy, I saw snippets of things that looked like it could have been original source material for the Parker downstream kenpo.

You couldn’t be more correct.

 

[drop bear]

What if someone does both equally?

By the way. Isn’t Dan insanto about a thousand years old?

 

[dvcochran]

Not certain what your exposure has been but

By the way. Isn’t Dan insanto about a thousand years old?

Pretty close. He is 85.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

By the way. Isn’t Dan insanto about a thousand years old?

I’m not sure. What’s the connection? I’m in no way connected to him that I’m aware of. Im neither Wing Chun nor JKD.

 

[Oily Dragon]

The sad part is that you can google bodybuilder covid-19 and see more than one person who looked at being in shape as a cure all. It wasn't until I started looking at things that way that I understood why some of the Martial Arts legends died young. People who do "Super feats" sometimes forget that they are just normal people like the rest of us.

Gordon Liu's stroke wasn't even from all his hard training.

He fell while performing with his band, and hit his head.

 

[jergar]

Still nobody has explained how a non-kickboxing fight suppose to look like.

Will you call these guys fight like kickboxing just because they throw

- roundhouse kick?
- hook punch?

This Taiji master and white crane master also used hook punches. Did they fight like kickboxer?

Hi, I guess it would be on the delivery of said kicks, strikes etc. I mean I throw a hook punch and a round house kick with the same body mechanics as a kick boxer or any other martial art for that matter.The only difference is how you get there .

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Hi, I guess it would be on the delivery of said kicks, strikes etc. I mean I throw a hook punch and a round house kick with the same body mechanics as a kick boxer or any other martial art for that matter. The only difference is how you get there .

Do you know any video that the winner doesn't fight like a kickboxer?

It will be nice to see a video that someone doesn't fight like a kickboxer (when kick and punch are allowed), so we can have some meaningful discussion.

 

[drop bear]

Do you know any video that the winner doesn't fight like a kickboxer?

It will be nice to see a video that someone doesn't fight like a kickboxer (when kick and punch are allowed), so we can have some meaningful discussion.

It depends on how fine a definition of not a kickboxer and how loose a definition of kickboxer you want to go.

You have guys like MVP who are pretty unorthodox.

Vs say John Wayne Parramatta who is very orthodox.