The notion that you have to throw/submit yourself in Aikido or get your wrist broken

[Gweilo]

I know all about compliant training partner questions, every time I write something about Systema, these questions arise, sometimes we train with blind faith, and do not understand, until our skills are called upon, if you believe what you are training is inadequate your right, if you believe what you are training is good you are right, you need to understand the why and what you do in training, I agree you need to pressure test honestly what you know, if you do not understand your training, you will always fail, when the bigger, stronger, faster adversary appears.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

"grab my wrist my bro"...

Only some wrist lock require your opponent to grab on your wrist. Most of the locking skill you can apply directly on your opponent without your opponent's initial action.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I agree you need to pressure test honestly what you know,...

You can

- write a book with 200 techniques.
- make a video with 100 techniques.
- give public demo with 50 techniques.
- teach a workshop with 25 techniques.
- fight in tournament with 10 techniques.
- fight in street with 5 techniques.

Those valuable "5 techniques" are what we all try to develop through our life time.

If you have taken down 1000 guys, the chance that you can take down the 1001 guy will be high. That's just simple statistics.

Also if you have knocked down 1000 guys, the chance that you can knock down the 1001 guy will be high. The truth is it's impossible for you to find 1000 guys that you can knock down. This is the weakness of all striking art.

 

[Gweilo]

You can

- write a book with 200 techniques.
- make a video with 100 techniques.
- give public demo with 50 techniques.
- teach a workshop with 25 techniques.
- fight in tournament with 10 techniques.
- fight in street with 5 techniques.

Those valuable "5 techniques" are what we all try to develop through our life time.

If you have taken down 1000 guys, the chance that you can take down the 1001 guy will be high. That's just simple statistics.

Writting is no replacement for proper sparring, theory is theory, pressure testing is experimenting. I think it was Socrates said, an unchallenged life is one not worth living,

 

[Gweilo]

You can

- write a book with 200 techniques.
- make a video with 100 techniques.
- give public demo with 50 techniques.
- teach a workshop with 25 techniques.
- fight in tournament with 10 techniques.
- fight in street with 5 techniques.

Those valuable "5 techniques" are what we all try to develop through our life time.

If you have taken down 1000 guys, the chance that you can take down the 1001 guy will be high. That's just simple statistics.

Also if you have knocked down 1000 guys, the chance that you can knock down the 1001 guy will be high. The truth is it's impossible for you to find 1000 guys that you can knock down. This is the weakness of all striking art.

I have read a lot of your posts, and I admire your passion for your art, your will to discuss in detail what you believe, something the op could learn from, but absimple I will do A then B followed by c, looks great on paper, but in reality it's seldom possible.

 

[Flying Crane]

I could resist without even being close to excerting myself, against the instructor, and my partner

What is the link to your YouTube channel? I want to see this.

You did record it and post it on YouTube, didn’t you?

 

[Alan Smithee]

I know all about compliant training partner questions, every time I write something about Systema, these questions arise, sometimes we train with blind faith, and do not understand, until our skills are called upon, if you believe what you are training is inadequate your right, if you believe what you are training is good you are right, you need to understand the why and what you do in training, I agree you need to pressure test honestly what you know, if you do not understand your training, you will always fail, when the bigger, stronger, faster adversary appears.

What I don't get is that Aikidokas still believe it to be a self defense martial art, even though there is no pressure testing and it's all choreographed. Just accept it for what it is.

Wushu guys tend to be open about the fact that it's a demonstration art and not self defense. Jet Li is certainly up front about that.

Aikidokas have more of an ego on the subject.

 

[Gweilo]

Here's how it looks with resistance. Zero successful joint locks, plenty attempted. And the bald dude was way bigger...

Imagine a boxing match where no punches land

I my opinion both competitors in the video, do not understand vectors, leverage or fulcrum points

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

I will do A then B followed by c, looks great on paper, but in reality it's seldom possible.

When you do A, you have eliminated some other possibilities. After your opponent's response and you do B, you have further eliminated some more possibilities.

I always like to associate MA strategy with man-woman relationship.

When you take your girlfriend to a

- poor neighborhood, you have eliminated the rich neighborhood.
- Dollar Tree store, you have eliminated the expensive store such as Macy's.
- ...

This is the best way to control the money in your wallet.

 

[Alan Smithee]

I my opinion both competitors in the video, do not understand vectors, leverage or fulcrum points

So both are mediocre yet neither of them pulled it off on the other one.

I'm not gonna argue that Aikido attracts the strongest talent pool in the world...So no argument there. However, that's what makes other arts like BJJ so effective. It works for everybody to some extent, and it does not take 30 years either.

 

[Gweilo]

When you do A, you have eliminated some other possibilities. After your opponent's response and you do B, you have further eliminated some more possibilities.

I always like to associate MA strategy with man-woman relationship.

When you take your girlfriend to a

- poor neighborhood, you have eliminated the rich neighborhood.
- Dollar Tree store, you have eliminated the expensive store such as Macy's.
- ...

This is the best way to control the money in your wallet.

Ok, senario, you square up to a medium build opponent, who seems to have a boxing background, you plan your stratergy, your opponent sits down, what do you do ?

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Ok, senario, you square up to a medium build opponent, who seems to have a boxing background, you plan your stratergy, your opponent sits down, what do you do ?

If my opponent tries to sit down, I'll help him to sit down more than he really wants to. I assume the ground game will start from there.

 

[Gweilo]

So both are mediocre yet neither of them pulled it off on the other one.

I'm not gonna argue that Aikido attracts the strongest talent pool in the world...So no argument there. However, that's what makes other arts like BJJ so effective. It works for everybody to some extent, and it does not take 30 years either.

I have trained in Bujinkan, Hapkido, now systema, are these the best arts, no, but I see benefits, Systema as an art is intesting and the training is useful to benefit me, it is a longer process but it will benefit me long term, will I stay with systema, I don't know, some of the training your opponent is too compliant, but the essence of the training is Imo too beneficial to disregard, I am 50 on my next birthday, so my journey is about my self improvement, I am not likely to fight any more, but the desire for self improvement is still there, always looking for me, not the art.

 

[Gweilo]

If my opponent tries to sit down, I'll help him to sit down more than he really wants to. I assume the ground game will start from there.

He he, Sounds like fun, so you Kung fu guys like to roll?

 

[Gweilo]

I am planning a holiday next year to the states, maybe if I come to texas we could have a play, I love meeting and learning from quality people

 

[Alan Smithee]

I have trained in Bujinkan, Hapkido, now systema, are these the best arts, no, but I see benefits, Systema as an art is intesting and the training is useful to benefit me, it is a longer process but it will benefit me long term, will I stay with systema, I don't know, some of the training your opponent is too compliant, but the essence of the training is Imo too beneficial to disregard, I am 50 on my next birthday, so my journey is about my self improvement, I am not likely to fight any more, but the desire for self improvement is still there, always looking for me, not the art.

It can work as a placebo in that the Aikido practitioner exudes confidence by believing what he was taught actually works in a lethal situation, and this is projected to the aggressor.

In that sense I find that there is a place for questionable systems of self defense. But there's also the catastrophic scenario that they get tested. Even supposing that some of it work, they've never done it under pressure and resistance.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

He he, Sounds like fun, so you Kung fu guys like to roll?

Since I train head lock. Most of the time it will go down to the ground.

I am planning a holiday next year to the states, maybe if I come to texas we could have a play,

I'll be in Texas from 12/15 - 5/15 (The rest of the year I'll be in California). If you come to Texas in that period of time, we can get together.

 

[Gweilo]

It can work as a placebo in that the Aikido practitioner exudes confidence by believing what he was taught actually works in a lethal situation, and this is projected to the aggressor.

In that sense I find that there is a place for questionable systems of self defense. But there's also the catastrophic scenario that they get tested. Even supposing that some of it work, they've never done it under pressure and resistance.

I agree with pressure testing, if you are not getting it, ask your instructor, or get on the net and find other like minded people, but be very sure, you understand your training, you understand fulcrum points, structure breaking, leverage and levers, and vectors, biomechanics, and leave the ego at home, and use the sparring to learn.

 

[Alan Smithee]

I agree with pressure testing, if you are not getting it, ask your instructor, or get on the net and find other like minded people, but be very sure, you understand your training, you understand fulcrum points, structure breaking, leverage and levers, and vectors, biomechanics, and leave the ego at home, and use the sparring to learn.

It's completely against their culture of training. Aikido is about cooperation and harmony. That's why I made this thread.. How do you know when you made any technical progress when it's all choreography?

 

[Gweilo]

I'll be in Texas from 12/15 - 5/15 (The rest of the year I'll be in California). If you come to Texas in that period of time, we can get together.

Sorry, to be sure 12/15 - 5/15, does this mean December? , or would it be better to schedule for california, I am very interested in your ground work, and it's always great to exchange knowledge.