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Don't mock my dreams.Marginal said:That only works if you aspire to be a fat stupid loser.
Roseanne. (From Roseanne)Phoenix44 said:Now let's talk about those "kick-***" female roles, and see if you can name A SINGLE ROLE THAT ISN'T A T&A ROLE. Every single female role, no matter how strong, dresses inappropriately for her job (including Marissa Hargitay as Olivia Benson in Law & Order), frequently ends up with a wet T-shirt or half naked (Princess Leia), or is essentially ineffectual (Pregnant Senator Padme).
Quote from Keen at the ranch: "It's all necessary."rmcrobertson said:5. "Mythopoetic," men's movement. Exactly right. Bly used to show up in Boulder, back in the 70s, and throw these neo-Jungian hand grenades, and leave. Yes, indeed a movie. It's called, "The Stepford Wives."
Thats probably the most accurate assessment of the "trend" we are discussing here as I see it. I have to agree with ya HDJH. "Emasculation" probably isnt the best term. I certainly dont feel less of a "man" because of whats being played over the media. I guess my angle on this issue is "great rush to advance women's rights we have stereotyped men into controlling, violent, rapists and oppressors". While history has shown that most of those offenders were indeed male, blaming the entire gender is as offensive to many of us with the Y chromosome as it would be to blame crime on race. And while there were many gender based wrongs then and now, one has to remember that if Men had control of the reigns of power then and still are "dominant" now, then how did feminism even get started? We "big bad men" here in the US could have pulled a Taliban-like crackdown if we were all that bad. There were/are plenty of men who know whats right and fair here IMO. Is there work ahead? Sure. But I believe that our country is a great example for womens rights worldwide.Farrell, incidentally, was the first man on the board of directors for the National Organization of Women (NOW). He isn't saying, and I certainly am not saying, that Feminism is some great evil that has victimized men. He merely posits that in the great rush to advance women's rights we have failed to see that men themselves have suffered from social stereotypes, and they too have grievances.
lol - I think comparing the US feminist movement and the response to it, versus the Taliban's treatment of women, is a bit wonky. Hopefully, we're working in a society that at least on paper posits that women and men should be equals.Tgace said:Thats probably the most accurate assessment of the "trend" we are discussing here as I see it. I have to agree with ya HDJH. "Emasculation" probably isnt the best term. I certainly dont feel less of a "man" because of whats being played over the media. I guess my angle on this issue is "great rush to advance women's rights we have stereotyped men into controlling, violent, rapists and oppressors". While history has shown that most of those offenders were indeed male, blaming the entire gender is as offensive to many of us with the Y chromosome as it would be to blame crime on race. And while there were many gender based wrongs then and now, one has to remember that if Men had control of the reigns of power then and still are "dominant" now, then how did feminism even get started? We "big bad men" here in the US could have pulled a Taliban-like crackdown if we were all that bad. There were/are plenty of men who know whats right and fair here IMO. Is there work ahead? Sure. But I believe that our country is a great example for womens rights worldwide.
Oh, I agree. The last thing you'll ever hear me do is whine about this topic, or any other for that matter. As far as i'm concerned, the immasculation occurred by our own hand. Nothing that has happened in modern times has happened without the express will and consent of men. At this point it may be out of our hands, but hey, we did it to ourselves. So men, enjoy what you have brought on yourselves.rmcrobertson said:Actually, we're not that great a role model.
And the claim about some great rush to feminism that has ended up "stereotyping men?" No great rush; no big stereo.
I do find it remarkable to see men adopting precisely the stance (victimization) and modes of analysis (look at images) that they generally attack like crazy when feminist types use them.
Pssst--the real issue here is: a) working class people getting screwed by capitalism; b) historical developments that are destroying the privilege and security to which Americans became accustomed after WWII; c) anxiety over scientific developments in the field of biology.