Racist Cop or Combative Professor?

[grydth]

Can one choose to support neither of the above?

The screeching Professor Gates ignores one thing: That cop was there because of a report of a possible felony in progress at his place. Yes - that means the cop was risking his white *** to protect a black man's home. That's racist??? If he hadn't responded to the scene, then there'd have been accusations of no police protection for black folks. Seems the cop can be slurred with impunity no matter what he does.

The officer ignores one thing: Being a Jerk in the First Degree is not a crime. Were it so, 3/4 of the country would be under arrest. Once he knew that Gates was the homeowner, he should've let the ingrate's whines just roll off his back and cleared the area. The arrest should not have been made.

 

[Archangel M]

Being a Jerk in the First Degree is not a crime. Were it so, 3/4 of the country would be under arrest.

While I agree with the spirit of your post (the cop could have just thickened his skin)..."being a Jerk in the first degree" in a public place (outside the home), if it includes behavior that meets the statute of disorderly conduct, is indeed a violation of law. Its a law that should be used properly and on people that deserve it (as compared to using it just because the guy pissed you off and you can), but it is a law nonetheless.

 

[Joab]

All he had to do was prove he lived there. Instead, he asked for name and badge number and got hostile. He escalated into something it didn't need to be and then cried racism when he got arrested for it.

Gates' behavior in this has been childish and emotionally-driven. I certainly hope he's not an accurate indication of the sort of "intellectual" that Harvard employs.

BTW: Do you suppose there's a potential burglar in Cambridge who's considering robbing Gates, with the assumption that the police won't dare investigate it?[/quote]

Police have to give name and badge number when asked by a citizen, it is the law. It is a perfectly reasonable question, and a professional police officer would have given them immediately with courtesy.

 

[Joab]

From what I understand Gates continued to confront the officers. If he'd been polite, showed his ID immediately, thanked the officers for their quick response and left it at that...no story, but he didn't. He had to show his butt.

There's a reason I'm not a cop...they don't get paid enough for the crap they have to deal with.

It's a tough job. I've worked in security for over 15 years including crowd control, it is tough. And being a cop is far harder, but at least they can do something...but dealing with difficult people is part of the job. The police officer did not act professionally in my estimation and allowed it to escalate far beyond what it should have. Once ID was established that should have been the end of it, regardless of wheteher or not Gates asked for his name and badge number.

 

[Joab]

You seem to be missing a key point. When the police first arrived they DID ask Gates for ID and to step outside to confirm his id. Gates did not comply with what they asked for at first and by his own admission was on the phone while the officer was asking him to step outside. It was only after this that Gates went to retrieve his ID.
Yes, but Gates eventually did give the officer his ID. After it was established that Gates lived there, that should have been the end of it, regardless of whether or not Gates asked for the officer's name and badge number and regardless of whether or not he asked for this info. politely. Period.

 

[Archangel M]

Uhhh..this guy wasnt arrested "because he asked for the cops ID"...yeah the cop could have (and probably should have) just walked back to his car and went 10-8. But turning this into a racial issue is out in left field IMO. The cop "could have just walked off" (doesnt change the legal legitimacy of the arrest however)...and the professor could have just said "thanks for looking out for my home officer..heres my ID".

 

[crushing]

Yes, but Gates eventually did give the officer his ID. After it was established that Gates lived there, that should have been the end of it, regardless of whether or not Gates asked for the officer's name and badge number and regardless of whether or not he asked for this info. politely. Period.

Yes, that's probably where the officers wanted it to end.

 

[Joab]

If that is where the cops wanted it to end, why didn't they end it there than? Cops are supposed to be professionals, they are supposed to know who to deescalate situations. True, I wasn't there, but after realizing the whole thing was really a mistake in the first place, that the guy who broke into the house lived there, the proper approach would have been to use a bit of diplomacy and common sense and not arrest Gates. Even if Gates did disturb the peace, realize that its time to call it a night, have a nice evening sir, and walk away. Arresting Gates was way out of line.

 

[Ray B]

I don't know. I wasn't there. If the LEO asked for ID and Gate complied, then the LEO should have dropped it.

This is my experience:

When I had my commercial dojo, I had a security system installed complete with a panic button that would alert the local police of a robbery in progrss. One afternoon while working on my scooter in the front of the dojo, I hit the remote panic button by accident. The next thing I know, an LEO is approching me with a shotgun. He motioned me away and I complied. He asked who I was and I told him I owned the dojo. My ID was inside so he told me to stand in clear view until his partners (plural) secured the area. Once secured, we walked back in and I showed them my ID and the business license on the wall confirm that I was the owner. With a heart felt thanks I apologied and thank them for responding. The LEOs left without a problem. IMO, this is what should have happened.

 

[Archangel M]

"Way out of line"?? Thats a matter of opinion....

Probably could have been done different is different from "out of line"...either he was disorderly in public or he wasnt. The officer "could have (probably should have) used some discretion here..I agree. That doesnt mean that the arrest was unlawful.

The charges being dropped have noting to do with the facts in this case as much as it was political expediency IMO. The prosecutor using his discretion to not prosecute.

 

[Archangel M]

I don't know. I wasn't there. If the LEO asked for ID and Gate complied, then the LEO should have dropped it.

This is my experience:

When I had my commercial dojo, I had a security system installed complete with a panic button that would alert the local police of a robbery in progrss. One afternoon while working on my scooter in the front of the dojo, I hit the remote panic button by accident. The next thing I know, an LEO is approching me with a shotgun. He motioned me away and I complied. He asked who I was and I told him I owned the dojo. My ID was inside so he told me to stand in clear view until his partners (plural) secured the area. Once secured, we walked back in and I showed them my ID and the business license on the wall confirm that I was the owner. With a heart felt thanks I apologied and thank them for responding. The LEOs left without a problem. IMO, this is what should have happened.

One difference..you didnt stand out in front of your dojo going off on the cops for the way they dealt with you...making comments about their mothers...you dont know who you are dealing with..you are going to regret this..etc. All things the officer claimed were thrown at him by this educated professional.

 

[Ray B]

Anyone can call the police and claim that they saw you break into your own home. I guess after a long day, I would be a little ticked too. I only takes one disgruntled neighbor...

 

[Archangel M]

Anyone can call the police and claim that they saw you break into your own home. I guess after a long day, I would be a little ticked too. I only takes one disgrutled neighbor...

That has nothing to do with the police response to such a call.

It was a passerby by all accounts..I'd be grateful that someone was looking out for my property. Wouldnt you want someone to call if they thought someone was breaking into your home?

 

[Joab]

I've since read an interview with the police officer who arrested Gates. If what he said was true, and if Gates initially refused to show the officer his ID and than caused the kind of scene he describes, I agree Gates didn't handle this incident very well. If what the officer said was true, Gates did break the law by disturbing the peace. It's not how I would have acted, I would have shown my ID immediately, thanked the officers for showing up at my house for checking out admittedly suspicious activity, and called it a night. But even if that is the case, I think the officer should have let it go, and not arrested Gates. Than again, I wasn't there. Than again, they did drop the charge. I will agree that labeling the police officer racist is way out of line, we can not know his heart nor read his mind. Police take a lot of crap, I've seen far worse than this in downtown Seattle and the police let it go (Calling police four letter vulgar names, telling a cop "Terry can die so can you" referring to a slain Seattle police officer who's last name was Terry for instance, I wish the cops had arrested those guys quite frankly) and I think the police should have let this one go as well. True, it sounds like Gates should have handled this incident better, but so could have the police.

 

[crushing]

If that is where the cops wanted it to end, why didn't they end it there than? Cops are supposed to be professionals, they are supposed to know who to deescalate situations. True, I wasn't there, but after realizing the whole thing was really a mistake in the first place, that the guy who broke into the house lived there, the proper approach would have been to use a bit of diplomacy and common sense and not arrest Gates. Even if Gates did disturb the peace, realize that its time to call it a night, have a nice evening sir, and walk away. Arresting Gates was way out of line.

So how do you know the arrest just slightly out of line, let alone way out of line? We don't know what was said or how it was said. All we know is that the officers showed up to possibly protect Gates' home, possessions, and possibly Gates himself from an intruder and somehow the officers end up the villains.

You can have all the verbal and de-escalation skills in the world, there may be some people you just can't calm down.

 

[Joab]

So how do you know the arrest just slightly out of line, let alone way out of line? We don't know what was said or how it was said. All we know is that the officers showed up to possibly protect Gates' home, possessions, and possibly Gates himself from an intruder and somehow the officers end up the villains.

You can have all the verbal and de-escalation skills in the world, there may be some people you just can't calm down.

Your right, I wasn't there. Certainly we need more info from all the police officers and anyone else who observed this incident. I think both sides could have handled this a lot better quite frankly. I'm usually on the cops side, I've worked with them a lot, and it's a very tough job, but arresting the man...well, your right, I wasn't there. Investigate the case further, get more info. and than decide. I hope both sides learned something from this. I hope home owners will treat the police better when a situation like this happens, I hope the police learn to deescalate better, I hope something positive somes out of this whole mess.

 

[crushing]

Your right, I wasn't there. Certainly we need more info from all the police officers and anyone else who observed this incident.

Hopefully they make public the secret evidence provided to President Obama about this issue. He certainly wouldn't have condemned the police knowing as little about what really happened as we do.

 

[MJS]

Yeah, he did his job, the person seen breaking in was the home owner.



Yes, I used quotes because there was no crime though the cop may have thought so at first. Once he got there and established ID he should have left. No I'm not reading one side, but I still see a man arrested in his own home for a disturbance more likely caused by blaring siren in a heavily peopled area.

Again, the cops were responding to what they thought was a burg in progress. How they respond to calls is pre-determined by the policies of that dept. Where I work, that would be a lights/siren response. The Prof was obviously pissed because of the door not opening, as well as the police being called. Asking him for ID most likely pissed him off more. You feel that once it was established that it was his home, they should have left. I, and many others are saying that he was arrested because of his actions. Furthermore, its perfectly normal to check the house. If there were someone inside, are you telling me that the Prof would not have filed a complaint saying the cops didn't do their job?

It has nothing to do with the siren. Saying thats why he got upset is crazy. He acted that way most likely because of the door and being questioned, God forbid.

Please...if the cops took 30min to get there, you know damn well that the public would have been crying like babies about the slow response.

 

[MJS]

The officer ignores one thing: Being a Jerk in the First Degree is not a crime. Were it so, 3/4 of the country would be under arrest. Once he knew that Gates was the homeowner, he should've let the ingrate's whines just roll off his back and cleared the area. The arrest should not have been made.

While being an *** isn't a crime, creating a disturbance and interferring with the investigation is.

 

[jks9199]

As soon as the Professor showed his ID which had the address of the house he was in the incident should have ended. The officer should have handed the ID back and said "have a nice evening sir" and left.

It ain't that simple.

Keeping to some LOOSE similarities with this incident... Let's say a guy is thrown out of a house by the cops after beating his wife half to death. There's a protective order issued against him. Or even just legally evicted from the place for whatever reason... He's still got ID saying he lives there, but he doesn't necessarily have a right to be there. Some extra digging is appropriate even if he's got an ID that lists that address. What about a bad divorce or messy break-up?

Sure, the ID goes a long way towards supporting the claim. But it's not automatically going to end the discussion. A few more minutes chatting, a quick record check... and at least the cop has done what he can to make sure everything is right.