Sin
2nd Black Belt
tell me what you know about this guy, and why is there a symbol on his site that looks like a swastica. http://www.aarkj.com/main.htm
Dillman
- Thread starter Sin
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loki09789
Senior Master
Dillman toured with Remy PResas and Wally Jay for years and taught Pressure point techniques. His bio/resume is on the site so you can read up on that.Sin said:
The Swastics looking thing is clearly identified as a Modern Arnis logo. The image is of a chain of hands holding weapons (looks like knives, sometimes it is sticks on other logos).
Most of the Modern Arnis old timers can fill in the specifics better though.
loki09789
Senior Master
The info is out there to do your own searching.Sin said:
Any stuff from an Oyata group that implies such 'ripping off'?
OP
Sin
2nd Black Belt
- Thread Starter
- #5
well sure there not gonna admit it they have dignity........just like if you cheated off a test are you gonna tell on someone that looked off your paper. i know I wouldn't..i really wouldn't care as long as we didn't get caught.......Dillman has no leniage to anyone is the anicent arts...so there really is one way he could have learned and that is through Oyota or someone clsoe to him...dillman has made a lot of money...he should at least pay hommage to Oyota.
loki09789
Senior Master
Personally, I don't know if there are any Oyata supporters who are complaining. So, did he 'rip Oyata off' or is it 'success envy?'loki09789 said:
Sorry if I sound testy but this "he did wrong" stuff in MA gets old real fast, especially when there is so much behind the scenes information that is not known to people who choose to judge.
Flatlander
Grandmaster
I have to agree with this completely. The fact of the matter is, all too often people take the scraps of information that they have about someone, invent some type of illogically deduced worst case scenario, and then go off badmouthing others without having known all of the relevant information.loki09789 said:
Please bear in mind that I know nothing about George Dillman either. But apparently, neither do you, Sin. I think you should do more research before you publicly condemn the man - would you not wish the same for others who would publicly discuss you?
Xequat
Black Belt
From what I understand, Dillman did train with Oyata, but he respects Oyata a great deal. Dillman supposedly first started learning pressure points from Hohan Soken, whom I believe has a long, distinguished lineage under his belt, all the way back to some king or something. I'm not an expert on Dillman, but there's some info that I've heard. So maybe you could start there with your investigating. I'm sure RRousselot (Oyata) and ppko (DKI) on MartialTalk could give you a little more direction.
loki09789
Senior Master
Some day, someone will be complaining about being slapped with a libel suite over crap like this. These types of comments/agendas could be construed as impeding with said person's ability to do business because of it. Especially considering the scope/reach of internet forums.flatlander said:
This stuff is just 'not cricket' as it is, but it could end up in legal hands if it keeps going as it has.
For people who extole the 'character growth' of martial arts training, there sure is a lot of libelous, petty commentary about the 'family'.
Just a point of order.....the symbol is not a Modern Arnis symbol but an old symbol used for Okinawan Karate. You can find this symbol on the cover of several books including:
Okinawan Karate by Mark Bishop http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...9201/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_2_1/103-1123277-8158201
Thanks,
Jeremy Bays
http://www.WoodlandArchery.com
Okinawan Karate by Mark Bishop http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...9201/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_2_1/103-1123277-8158201
Thanks,
Jeremy Bays
http://www.WoodlandArchery.com
chinto01
Black Belt
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Just a thought on the whole this one ripped off that one theory. In order to ripp someone off does that person not have to own something? In my opinion the martial arts are not something to be owned by one individual or group. It is something that should be shared as common knowledge. I believe that this is why we have the whole my style is better than your style thing going on. Why not all share different techniques and begin to unify things instead of claiming ownershipon techniques which leads to the he ripped me off arguement. Like I said just a thought but that is what we do at our dojo. We have black belts in our own system that train with others from other systems and we all get together to incorporate new things and share techniques and nobody walks away saying anything was stolen but shared with one another.
Xequat
Black Belt
Yeah, I agree on a philosophical scale, but there is too much money involved and too many different styles for one person to learn everything. Certain styles work for certain people, too, so brown belt level material for one style might not be as useful and might be too difficult for a black belt in a defferent style. Some people train to fight and some train for sport, so we have several different styles.chinto01 said:
loki09789
Senior Master
I thought he was talking about the stylized hands holding weapons when the swastica reference was made. The other logos have the three pointed logo that is a variance on the Ying Yang idea (and my Okinawan mother would whip me for not being able to remember the name at the moment).Samurai said:
THe point is that none of these symbols have any intentional relation to the NAZI ideology or swastika
ppko
Master Black Belt
George Dillman did not rip off Seiyu Oyata in matter of fact he admits training with him and has never spoken anything but highly of him. Hohan Soken showed George that there is more to the Martial Arts than what he had been shown so he started training with different masters Oyata was one of them but he has trained with many others and he is always researching and finding out more stuff. Everything that DKI does has not come from one man but from many, as I am sure that is the case for many Martial ArtistsSin said:
ppko
Master Black Belt
Who are you talking about George Dillman, Chris Mitter, or Mark YercheckSin said:
ppko
Master Black Belt
You say no disrespect in the post before this, but in this post you most deffinately are showing disrespect. Which is it going to be, if you want a good conversation about these matters than at least talk like you want one.Sin said:
RRouuselot
Master of Arts
1) Dillman went to about 6 seminars given by Mr. Oyata.....filming at all of them and rarely training at any of them.Xequat said:
2) Dillman met Hohan Soken one time.
Some articles on Hohan Soken:
http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=426
http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=427
http://www.seitokaratedo.com/Sokenbiofiles/sokenbio1.htm
loki09789
Senior Master
DING! Round 2 of the Bashfest begins.... call them 'facts' but what is the purpose?RRouuselot said:
Remember, just like with guns "facts don't kill people's reputations, people kill people's reputations."
RRouuselot
Master of Arts
1) Dillman trash talked Mr. Oyata for years claiming he "kicked his ***" in a fight and all sort of other BS. ppko this was waaaaaaaay before your time with Dillamn so I expect you never heard any of the BS Dillman was spreading about my teacher. Although lately Dillman has stopped or cut back his trash talking.......why? Maybe it's because so many folks have gotten wise to him.ppko said:
2) In a 1984 July issue of Karate Illistrated Dillman says about his first demo he attended given by Mr. Oyata and I quote Dillman here: "it's like nothing I have ever seen before"........Hohan Soken died in 1982 by the way.
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Sin
2nd Black Belt
- Thread Starter
- #20
Well maybe i need to rephrase my accusations.......Dillman can probably beat me up...maybe not my insructors but that is for another tread/argument...And i am sure what Dillman teaches is good stuff...and I am not saying it dosen't work...only thing I am saying is that he got rich off the stuff, marketing it....so in other words he whould be considered a sell out...Now we have to go back to the never ending debate on..."Well if ya got it flaunt it" kinda deal...like he pop singers of today that are all about money...I mean honestly who really likes matallica's new music...we al least after the law suit with Napster and cutting there hair......New isn't always better..I would really like to her a debate between someone ho has trained with oyota and someone who has trained with dillman...now i know many of you are prolly angry with me for bringing tis up...only thing I am really trying to do is put somethings to rest, and to expand my own knowledge on the subject as well. Please i do not intend to anger anyone...i would just like to know more on the subject. And if it takes raddling a few chains then so be it...i just don't like the fact that oyota has been doing what Dillman is doing before Dillman was even born. And i don't like that Dillman is tking all the creidit :asian:
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