So I just watched dancing with the stars and....

[Blade96]

One of em is bristol palin, and on there she was saying about her pregnancy and all, and how she talks to people to tell them about being a teenage parent and thats its hard. Ok, fair enough. But then she said how she wants to teach people that 'abstinence is a realistic choice and a goal' Say WHAT? Obviously not, cause it didnt ork for her, and it doesnt work for a lot of other people. My question in my mind is How can she be such a hypocrite like that. People are NOT going to take her seriously.

 

[MJS]

One of em is bristol palin, and on there she was saying about her pregnancy and all, and how she talks to people to tell them about being a teenage parent and thats its hard. Ok, fair enough. But then she said how she wants to teach people that 'abstinence is a realistic choice and a goal' Say WHAT? Obviously not, cause it didnt ork for her, and it doesnt work for a lot of other people. My question in my mind is How can she be such a hypocrite like that. People are NOT going to take her seriously.

Perhaps she's saying this now, because she sees that being a teen mom isnt as easy as some seem to think. Of course, I highly doubt that her life as a teen mom was anything like the average person, but thats just my opinion.

But you're right....her abstinence speech apparently didn't work for her. LOL. I wonder if she got the 'talk' either at home or at school.

 

[jks9199]

Abstinence works. There's only been one reported failure of abstinence in recorded history... and people argue about that one.

Of course, it's not easy -- and there are lots of cases where teens fail to maintain abstinence.

Sorry -- pet peeve of mine.

 

[Bruno@MT]

People are NOT going to take her seriously.

How I wish you would be right. Sadly, I thought the same about Sarah Palin, and despite her bes efforts to the contrary, enough people took her seriously.

 

[Big Don]

Abstinence works. There's only been one reported failure of abstinence in recorded history... and people argue about that one.

Of course, it's not easy -- and there are lots of cases where teens fail to maintain abstinence.

Sorry -- pet peeve of mine.

QFT.
It really is a simple concept, it is called self-control.

 

[Blade96]

QFT.
It really is a simple concept, it is called self-control.

and most people don't have self control. I dont think they should either not if they dont want to. And seriously, abstinence until marriage. I think, what if many people never get married? Do those people want to remain virgins til they die? I knew I didnt want to. I think, Yeah, do it if you want to, but it wasnt for me, and I dont think it is for most people, really.

 

[Tez3]

Sex education, contraception and being responsible. Less prudism would help too, more openness and more openmindedness.

 

[Big Don]

and most people don't have self control.

Really? None? Did you smack the last person that pissed you off? Run anyone off the road lately? Park in a handicapped space? Take a little five finger discount the last time you went shopping?
No, congrats, you demonstrated self control.

 

[Tez3]

Of course people have self control. Sex isn't about jumping into bed with anyone that asks, not even for teenagers.

 

[chrispillertkd]

One of em is bristol palin, and on there she was saying about her pregnancy and all, and how she talks to people to tell them about being a teenage parent and thats its hard. Ok, fair enough. But then she said how she wants to teach people that 'abstinence is a realistic choice and a goal' Say WHAT? Obviously not, cause it didnt ork for her, and it doesnt work for a lot of other people. My question in my mind is How can she be such a hypocrite like that. People are NOT going to take her seriously.

I'm not the kind of person who sits around watching B-listers compete in dance. Even less am I the kind of person who takes moral adevice from said people. That having been said, you don't know what a hypocrite is.

It is often the case that a person who has made a particular moral failing in their life is - in some ways - a very good source of advice about avoiding that particular failing. For example, it's not hypocritical at all for alcoholics to run AA meetings and tell people not to drink to excess. The same can be said for Bristol Palin. She's perfectly capable of making a non-hypocritical presentation of why people shouldn't engage in the same behavior she did. It's like a cautionary tale, in some respects. (That being said, fom what little I know of Miss Palin and her former boy friend/fiance the baby seems to be the only good thing to come out of that relationship. But then, babies are always good news.)

Hypocrisy isn't the same as telling someone not to do what you did. It's telling people not to do something because it's wrong and then doing it yourself and acting as if it's OK for you to do it. There's a difference between hypocrisy and simple moral failing. We all fail to live up to our standards but that doesn't make us all hypocrits (that depends on our interior disposition, not on our objective behavior).

Personally, I'm rather tired of people flinging around the "hypocrit/hypocrisy" label as a simple excuse to ignore other's people advice. If you want to sleep with your boyfriend or girlfriend go ahead, but don't say someone else who did and has had regrets about it is automatically a hypocrit.

Pax,

Chris

 

[chrispillertkd]

and most people don't have self control. I dont think they should either not if they dont want to.

What an interesting comment. Do you often free spar with people who don't want to have self-control? Do you train with an instructor who has no self-control? Are you married to someone with no self-control?

Do you have a lot of friends who don't have self-control? If so how do they treat you? I dare say they aren't good friends, are they?

Yes, I can think of a single problem from people not having self-control if they don't want. Not a one.

And seriously, abstinence until marriage. I think, what if many people never get married? Do those people want to remain virgins til they die? I knew I didnt want to. I think, Yeah, do it if you want to, but it wasnt for me, and I dont think it is for most people, really.

Well, yes they would remain virgins until they died. But remaining a virgin wouldn't be the thing that killed them, would it? The modern notion that sexual congress ranks slightly ahead of food and water on the hierarchy of needs is a laugh. The people I know personally who can't seem to comprehend going without also seem to be the people who reduce sex to an animal-like instinct, viewing people as no different than a rutting animal. Not so great, IMNSHO.

Pax,

Chris

 

[MJS]

Sex education, contraception and being responsible. Less prudism would help too, more openness and more openmindedness.

Exactly! Someone should provide sex ed. I know this was heavily debated in another thread, but I stand by what I said there. I dont care who it is...the school system, a counselor, a parent, a responsible relative, someone from a church, but it needs to be taught. As well as explaining and even providing various methods of bc. Yes, I know, some will say, "Well, if you give them a condom, they'll be more likely to have sex!" Ya know what...that may be the case, but I'd rather have the kid be prepared than not be.

Some people seem to think that sex is a taboo. Its not. Your last few words are so true...openness and open mindedness.

 

[derobec]

Exactly! Someone should provide sex ed. I know this was heavily debated in another thread, but I stand by what I said there.

Hi,

I missed the other thread so won't dwell too long on this, but really? There's been a debate over whether there should be sex education? Times are darker than I realized.

Regards,
William

 

[Tez3]

I'm not the kind of person who sits around watching B-listers compete in dance. Even less am I the kind of person who takes moral adevice from said people. That having been said, you don't know what a hypocrite is.

It is often the case that a person who has made a particular moral failing in their life is - in some ways - a very good source of advice about avoiding that particular failing. For example, it's not hypocritical at all for alcoholics to run AA meetings and tell people not to drink to excess. The same can be said for Bristol Palin. She's perfectly capable of making a non-hypocritical presentation of why people shouldn't engage in the same behavior she did. It's like a cautionary tale, in some respects. (That being said, fom what little I know of Miss Palin and her former boy friend/fiance the baby seems to be the only good thing to come out of that relationship. But then, babies are always good news.)

Hypocrisy isn't the same as telling someone not to do what you did. It's telling people not to do something because it's wrong and then doing it yourself and acting as if it's OK for you to do it. There's a difference between hypocrisy and simple moral failing. We all fail to live up to our standards but that doesn't make us all hypocrits (that depends on our interior disposition, not on our objective behavior).

Personally, I'm rather tired of people flinging around the "hypocrit/hypocrisy" label as a simple excuse to ignore other's people advice. If you want to sleep with your boyfriend or girlfriend go ahead, but don't say someone else who did and has had regrets about it is automatically a hypocrit.

Pax,

Chris

Probably comes as a surprise to both of us but I agree totally with you!

If she had been handing out this advice before she got pregnant, slept around then got pregnant yes she'd be a hypocrite but this is afterwards. She is telling people where she went wrong which is fair comment. I don't believe the abstinence advice is good advice but that's my opinion and a different subject. I don't think she went around extolling the virtues of abstinence before she got pregnant so can be accused of nothing more than carelessness with her contraception or her choice of partner or of just being silly,but not of being a hypocrite.

It's nonsense to say people can't, don't or won't have self control, that tends to be a rapists/paedophile's excuse btw, " I couldn't help myself".

If people chose not to have sex for what ever reason I see no reason to mock them, if they chose to remain virgins until they die why shouldn't they. It's about choice. It's why I believe education is the key to taking responsibilty for your sexuality and your choices.

 

[MJS]

Hi,

I missed the other thread so won't dwell too long on this, but really? There's been a debate over whether there should be sex education? Times are darker than I realized.

Regards,
William

Here ya go.
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=89679

The main debate seemed to be who should teach it. My focus was that a) lets snap into the current timezone...sex happens, b) proper sex ed. needs to be taught, c) I dont care who teaches it, but someone needs to educate kids.

 

[Blade96]

ok so i used hypocrite wrong, actually maybe not so far wrong, after all she grew up with the abstinence because her mum believes in it. So she probably claim to believe in this even before she got pregnant.

"The modern notion that sexual congress ranks slightly ahead of food and water on the hierarchy of needs is a laugh. The people I know personally who can't seem to comprehend going without also seem to be the people who reduce sex to an animal-like instinct, viewing people as no different than a rutting animal. Not so great, IMNSHO. "

and I agree with this. I verbally smacked the evil sandan (no i had no self control because i blew up at him all the time) because that was how he viewed sex.

 

[Tez3]

ok so i used hypocrite wrong, actually maybe not so far wrong, after all she grew up with the abstinence because her mum believes in it. So she probably claim to believe in this even before she got pregnant.

"The modern notion that sexual congress ranks slightly ahead of food and water on the hierarchy of needs is a laugh. The people I know personally who can't seem to comprehend going without also seem to be the people who reduce sex to an animal-like instinct, viewing people as no different than a rutting animal. Not so great, IMNSHO. "

and I agree with this. I verbally smacked the evil sandan (no i had no self control because i blew up at him all the time) because that was how he viewed sex.

then why sleep with him in the first place?

 

[Blade96]

then why sleep with him in the first place?

I didnt know it at the time.

 

[Tez3]

I didnt know it at the time.

But you did know he was married.
I'm sorry but if you are going to use your personal history in other threads to make a point you will find people will use it to debate with you.
I have little time for what I've seen of Sarah Palin, I know nothing however of her daughter and I'm not going to judge her for being a single mother and regretting it though I doubt she regrets the child, as Chris said, a child is a blessing.

 

[Blade96]

But you did know he was married.
I'm sorry but if you are going to use your personal history in other threads to make a point you will find people will use it to debate with you.

Some will