SKK Problem Techniques

[MJS]

For the end of 19 after the right dropping elbow I grab the back of the neck at the base of the skull and allow my left hand to slide under the right shoulder. Then pushing down and to my left with my right hand and up with my left it turns the attacker over and drops them on their back. To preserve the original technique I do not alter it in 6 kata.

Interesting variation. If I'm reading it right, it sounds similar to 14Kempos version.

Side note - glad to be back, my computer crashed and I just got it back.

Welcome back!

 

[marlon]

Most of the techniques that flowed from a hand pattern into a kick pattern would usually end up in the wrong zone for that particular kick..
The same held true when flowing from any impacting patterns into a jujitsu / judo technique, you would usually end up in the wrong location, or zone for the technique.

could you explain this more, please? I have seen this problem with students who do not touch thier partner, but if you do and step accordingly everything should match up. Combo #39 is a great example of this.

respectfully,
Marlon

 

[LawDog]

Marlon,
Most of the early impacting presets were done in a way that put you outside the power curve of a strike or kick. This did cause some of the problem for proper follow up moves.
The real problem was the footwork that was being used was not properly combined with the proper width SKK stance. The footwork used did not match the zones that are required for all strikes, kicks, jujitsu and judo moves. These zones, when properly applied, will keep you in the power curves for all types of impacting. They will also keep you within the "throwing boxes" for your Judo. They will also keep you within the proper range so that your motion will match your opponents motion, this is a must when a jujitsu move is applied.
When footwork is used if the width of the stance is changed it will change the distance that you travel.
Ex. When appling a shuffle, if you use a standard neutral stance then use the really wide "Kung Fu" stance the distance that you travel will be different.
When many presets were being developed the footwork and stance width were not properly matched.
:ultracool

 

[JTKenpo]

Interesting variation. If I'm reading it right, it sounds similar to 14Kempos version.




Welcome back!

Yeah, I read it and thought the same thing. It just makes the technique so much easier to apply.

Thanks.

 

[Jdokan]

So, an inverted triangle then? Is there a corresponding upper triangle? Thanks. Just haven't heard it put this way before.

Another triangle we use is shoulder/shoulder/navel...

 

[DavidCC]

We have a technique we know as "Knife #9". Atack is a slashing attack to the leg or lower body.

step fwd with right foot, using a scissor block to trap the attacking right arm (right arm low, left high). Guide their arm upwards ccw, as their arm passes their neck, strike down on the back of the neck with knife hand as you kick their right leg up and out, the combined motion sweeping them to the ground on your right side. Continue the leg motion into an axe kick to the left ribs.

that kick is a nightmare

 

[JTKenpo]

We have a technique we know as "Knife #9". Atack is a slashing attack to the leg or lower body.

step fwd with right foot, using a scissor block to trap the attacking right arm (right arm low, left high). Guide their arm upwards ccw, as their arm passes their neck, strike down on the back of the neck with knife hand as you kick their right leg up and out, the combined motion sweeping them to the ground on your right side. Continue the leg motion into an axe kick to the left ribs.

that kick is a nightmare

I like the base of the tech but I have two questions. 1st I'm not seeing the scissor block stopping a slash, could you expound on that (could just be having a bad day)? 2nd how do you control the knife and where is the disarm (wrist flex with the right hand?)?
Ok I lied, three questions, when I follow the technique they land on my left side?

 

[DavidCC]

I like the base of the tech but I have two questions. 1st I'm not seeing the scissor block stopping a slash, could you expound on that (could just be having a bad day)? 2nd how do you control the knife and where is the disarm (wrist flex with the right hand?)?
Ok I lied, three questions, when I follow the technique they land on my left side?

The block is like a "V", right arm low, straight, left arm bent and intersecting, so the slashing arm is caught mid-forearm ideally. Then controlling their arm circling it clockwise (I mis-typed that in my orig post) to your right side. No disarm just control of the weapon arm.

I think the CW/CCW disrepancy might answer question 3

 

[JTKenpo]

The block is like a "V", right arm low, straight, left arm bent and intersecting, so the slashing arm is caught mid-forearm ideally. Then controlling their arm circling it clockwise (I mis-typed that in my orig post) to your right side. No disarm just control of the weapon arm.

I think the CW/CCW disrepancy might answer question 3

Yup CW puts him on my right. Good tech, I would personally use the block against a thrusting knife (straight in attack) but would then have to change the footwork too.

 

[RevIV]

This is a great thread and its killing me that i do not have the time to respond to anything yet but the 12 hour karate days are killing me this week. so keep this one going and then i will be the johnny come lately and respond to the first post -- as long as it is not about combo #6

 

[JTKenpo]

This is a great thread and its killing me that i do not have the time to respond to anything yet but the 12 hour karate days are killing me this week. so keep this one going and then i will be the johnny come lately and respond to the first post -- as long as it is not about combo #6

Aaahhh sounds like someone is running summer camp.

 

[RevIV]

Aaahhh sounds like someone is running summer camp.

oh yes, and my favorite day is still 3 away... Friday we head to Water Country. def. not as many people doing the camp this year. in the past we have had 50 kids, this year only 10.

 

[DavidCC]

Yup CW puts him on my right. Good tech, I would personally use the block against a thrusting knife (straight in attack) but would then have to change the footwork too.

I do like the arm work in this tech but that leg-hock-to-axe-kick is no friend of my 42 year old hip joints :/

 

[JTKenpo]

oh yes, and my favorite day is still 3 away... Friday we head to Water Country. def. not as many people doing the camp this year. in the past we have had 50 kids, this year only 10.

Yeah, I decided to take this summer off from camp. I'm sure I will do it back up next year.

 

[marlon]

Marlon,
Most of the early impacting presets were done in a way that put you outside the power curve of a strike or kick. This did cause some of the problem for proper follow up moves.
The real problem was the footwork that was being used was not properly combined with the proper width SKK stance. The footwork used did not match the zones that are required for all strikes, kicks, jujitsu and judo moves. These zones, when properly applied, will keep you in the power curves for all types of impacting. They will also keep you within the "throwing boxes" for your Judo. They will also keep you within the proper range so that your motion will match your opponents motion, this is a must when a jujitsu move is applied.
When footwork is used if the width of the stance is changed it will change the distance that you travel.
Ex. When appling a shuffle, if you use a standard neutral stance then use the really wide "Kung Fu" stance the distance that you travel will be different.
When many presets were being developed the footwork and stance width were not properly matched.
:ultracool

thanks. i found that footwork was left out of my early kempo training and i really developed it when i started teaching and had to answer questions that i guess i was too slow to ask for myself when i started. Shihan I is very good with footwork so along with drawing from my other martial arts background i have his knowledge as well. How did you develpo your footwork. I think it is an essential part of kempo training and i thank you for pointing it out

Respectfully,
Marlon

 

[RevIV]

For me, I'd have to say that one of them was #19. Everything, IMHO, was fine right up until the part where you flip them over. On a smaller person, sure, I could see this working, but on a large person...I'm just not seeing it. Personally, after the elbow to the back, I'd rather drop a few more elbows or perhaps some knees to the head.

Well, thats a start! Anyone have any that drove them crazy?

So like I said, i will start from here. after the elbow down we just grab onto the guy and throw them backwards,.. get the idea of the old west and someone getting thrown out of a salloon. We work this tech. off of being backed into a wall and when we bend them over from the bladder kick we grab on and put their head through the wall.

 

[RevIV]

I have a problem with any of the combo's that you spin in front of the person

so we have, 12, and then 38, are you refering to 21 and 26 where you go to the side, kindof in front?

 

[RevIV]

#26, I do the elbow and the groin strike simultaneously. It makes sense to me to do it that way, but my instructor insists that the elbow should lead the groin strike. I get what he is saying, getting my arms swaying (like a monkey), but I really like a simultaneous high/low strike on the center line. It has a stunning effect and it leaves the BG vulnerable for the sweep ...

I agree with your instructor, its a timing issue on when you are going to scoop out the leg and with how much momentum of the left arm scooping that ankle.

 

[RevIV]

could you explain this more, please? I have seen this problem with students who do not touch thier partner, but if you do and step accordingly everything should match up. Combo #39 is a great example of this.

respectfully,
Marlon

Marlon, does your #39 have a kick in it? mine does not? your qoute was in question of Lawdogs kicking distance.

 

[RevIV]

Yeah, I decided to take this summer off from camp. I'm sure I will do it back up next year.

My 6 week old baby told me she wanted a car so i had to run the camp to start putting money away..hahah