Keysi Fighting Method/Defence Lab

[veritasAequitas]

No I said thereS no evidence that bJj is b better than no trAining, a thing that seems to hold true as no Scientific evIdence has been forth comming

How are you going to get that elbow strike?

 

[pdg]

Can someone tl;dr the whole dictionary argument for me please?

 

[jobo]

Any technique that you can apply in manner so controlled as to be stopped at any point.

I bend your fingers back - it'll hurt way before any damage is caused.

I put pressure on your elbow in the wrong direction - it'll hurt way before any damage is caused.

I grab your ear - it'll hurt way before I can start making a necklace.



If you're saying that you, personally, can't inflict pain without causing damage, then you lack control.

So the pain is caused by damage to the finger tendons, are are so saying bending the tendons to cause pain cause no damage at all to the tendons ?

 

[jobo]

I'll add all nerve pressure points to that list, when applied with any control.

Well they cause damage to the nervous system and of course the skin,

 

[jobo]

Can someone tl;dr the whole dictionary argument for me please?

GErry is making up his own definition And then telling people who use the,dictionary definition they are wrongand then saying it doesn't matter as dictionaries are only advisory and words mean anything he wants them to, but then if you make up your own definition of say "damage" he says your wrong as it's not in the dictionary

 

[jobo]

How are you going to get that elbow strike?

I'm Lay quietly And lUre him in, that's how I catch rabbits and fish

 

[pdg]

So the pain is caused by damage to the finger tendons, are are so saying bending the tendons to cause pain cause no damage at all to the tendons ?

Yes I am.

The body is built to feel pain before the point of damage is reached - it's a natural defence mechanism.

Put your hand near something hot - you feel heat. At a certain point it'll start to hurt, but no damage yet. That's the defence - stop doing that, it hurts.

Keep doing it and get more pain, and a blister. That's slight damage (although in itself a blister is a defence mechanism).

Push through that pain and you'll get an actual burn, and even more lasting pain.

It's not like touching a lightbulb you've just turned off will melt your arm off and leave a charred stump - but it'll hurt a little.

That's the same thing as bending your finger back. A bit of pain is your body telling you to stop the action (or comply if you will) before any damage happens. Self protection...

It's not such a binary system as you're trying to make it - you can easily have pain without damage.

Go on, tell me I'm wrong.

 

[jobo]

Yes I am.

The body is built to feel pain before the point of damage is reached - it's a natural defence mechanism.

Put your hand near something hot - you feel heat. At a certain point it'll start to hurt, but no damage yet. That's the defence - stop doing that, it hurts.

Keep doing it and get more pain, and a blister. That's slight damage (although in itself a blister is a defence mechanism).

Push through that pain and you'll get an actual burn, and even more lasting pain.

It's not like touching a lightbulb you've just turned off will melt your arm off and leave a charred stump - but it'll hurt a little.

That's the same thing as bending your finger back. A bit of pain is your body telling you to stop the action (or comply if you will) before any damage happens. Self protection...

It's not such a binary system as you're trying to make it - you can easily have pain without damage.

Go on, tell me I'm wrong.

JUSt moving a tendon I the normal run of things damAges it, stretching it, as you are definitely damageS it, tendons are not stretchy and now it's stretched that's damage

 

[veritasAequitas]

I'm Lay quietly And lUre him in, that's how I catch rabbits and fish

But how though?

Scientifically.

 

[jobo]

But how though?

Scientifically.

If pretend to have a Heart attack then when he came in to give the kids of life, wham. I've done something not that dissimilar with good result s

 

[pdg]

JUSt moving a tendon I the normal run of things damAges it, stretching it, as you are definitely damageS it, tendons are not stretchy and now it's stretched that's damage

Do a search for "tendon elasticity".

Seriously.

 

[jobo]

Do a search for "tendon elasticity".

Seriously.

If you hadn't gone past the elastic stAge , it wouldNt be stretched and no pain. So it's a self proving point, pain equals stretch equals damage, but just doIng press ups damages them

 

[veritasAequitas]

If pretend to have a Heart attack then when he came in to give the kids of life, wham. I've done something not that dissimilar with good result s

So I'm required to provide detailed, word perfect responses to you that you never deem good enough.

Yet you can't extend me the courtesy to explain a technique every white belt bjj knows?

Lol so you can't escape it good to know your limits.

 

[pdg]

If you hadn't gone past the elastic stAge , it wouldNt be stretched and no pain. So it's a self proving point, pain equals stretch equals damage, but just doIng press ups damages them

Press ups done wrong can damage certain tendons, but correctly executed causes no tendon damage at all.

They can cause minor damage to muscle fibres, but that's the point - minor damage to muscle fibre from overload is what causes strengthening and growth.

I haven't seen this stated yet, so I'd like to be the first.

You're talking crap.

I actually think you know you are and are trying to be clever with your arguments, but it's just making you look extremely ignorant.

 

[veritasAequitas]

If you hadn't gone past the elastic stAge , it wouldNt be stretched and no pain. So it's a self proving point, pain equals stretch equals damage, but just doIng press ups damages them

Cell telomere shortening isnt painful, yet that is damage? Neither is the low dosage of radiation damage you get from the sun every day.

 

[jobo]

Press ups done wrong can damage certain tendons, but correctly executed causes no tendon damage at all.

They can cause minor damage to muscle fibres, but that's the point - minor damage to muscle fibre from overload is what causes strengthening and growth.

I haven't seen this stated yet, so I'd like to be the first.

You're talking crap.

I actually think you know you are and are trying to be clever with your arguments, but it's just making you look extremely ignorant.

No it damages them, they get stronger through damage but it's still damage, just like stretching them with a finger bend is damage

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Can someone tl;dr the whole dictionary argument for me please?

Sure. Jobo doesn’t like that the term “pain compliance”, as commonly used in martial arts, isn’t just an amalgam of the definitions of those two words.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

So the pain is caused by damage to the finger tendons, are are so saying bending the tendons to cause pain cause no damage at all to the tendons ?

What level of damage is occurring. I’ve had that done many times with nothing more than temporary (maybe a few minutes) pain. Perhaps there are micro-tears like with some exercise.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Well they cause damage to the nervous system and of course the skin,

Do they?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

GErry is making up his own definition And then telling people who use the,dictionary definition they are wrongand then saying it doesn't matter as dictionaries are only advisory and words mean anything he wants them to, but then if you make up your own definition of say "damage" he says your wrong as it's not in the dictionary

Straw man. I never said the dictionary was wrong.