It was only a matter of time. McDojo vitcim beaten up

[JowGaWolf]

That's not a mcdojo dude, that is what all sifu's/senseis tell their children students so they don't end up going around picking fights and becoming thugs. It sounds like the kid just took the message way too literally.

The school doesn't teach the application of the techniques. If you don't want kids to start fights then you just come out and say "Don't start fights." Guess what parents tell kids not to do? They say "don't start fights." The don't beat around the bush with it.

 

[Ironbear24]

The school doesn't teach the application of the techniques. If you don't want kids to start fights then you just come out and say "Don't start fights." Guess what parents tell kids not to do? They say "don't start fights." The don't beat around the bush with it.

So what do they do then? Just swing at the air?

 

[WaterGal]

That's not a mcdojo dude, that is what all sifu's/senseis tell their children students so they don't end up going around picking fights and becoming thugs. It sounds like the kid just took the message way too literally.

I think there's a difference between telling kids "only fight in self-defense", "try to resolve problems peacefully if you can", etc and telling kids "don't ever use your karate on another person".

 

[Ironbear24]

I don't understand why some places never teach application. That would be like me talking to you about how to cook pasole, giving you books to read about it, handling each ingredient but then I never teach how to actually put it all together.

What would be the point of that?

 

[Hot Lunch]

There have been discussion about the dangers of people thinking that they can do martial arts when they really can't. Today a Jow Ga parent mentioned to me that her friend's son is taking martial arts (for 7yrs) from one of these McDojos and he had his butt kick by a group of boys. When the Mcdojo parent asked her son why didn't he defend himself with what he learned from the Martial Art school, the son replied that the school taught them that it's not honorable to fight or to use karate to hurt people.

The Jow Ga parent asked the McDojo parent if her school had a day dedicated to use the applications or if the school actually taught the children how to use the techniques they were learning. The McDojo parent replied with a No.

7 years of martial art training and none of it was any use for this kid, because some instructor told that kid that it wasn't honorable to fight or to use karate to hurt people.

Something isn't adding up.

In the heat of the moment, the average person isn't thinking about the instructor saying "don't use this." You're in survival mode. The BS that the instructor said goes out the window.

A few scenarios I can think of:

1. Multiple attackers. There isn't much he can do there.

2. *For those of us who are Generation X and older, you'd better not let your parents find out that another kid physically assaulted you and you didn't fight back. Because the physical consequences you'd get from your parents were worse than what that kid did to you. Maybe this kid had old school parents and was afraid to fight back - so he was trying to find a way to point the finger at the instructor.

3. Martial arts training has its limitations. For example, Mike Tyson was known to have beaten up grown men when he was 12 years old, as he was highly developed for his age. And this was before he had ever trained in boxing. Even if Mike Tyson had never set foot in a boxing gym, if he lands a haymaker on you, you're going down. Your years of training in the dojo may help you evade or deflect his haymaker, but it won't stop you from going down just like everyone else if he does land it. And this kid may have been facing a similar situation.

*I'm not glorifying parents of the past for doing this; in fact, I think it did more harm than good - as some children would try to hide the fact that they were being bullied from their parents. Thus, the bullying continued and nothing got done about it.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

7 years of martial art training and none of it was any use for this kid, because some instructor told that kid that it wasn't honorable to fight or to use karate to hurt people.

Old saying said, "If one doesn't have 30% violence in nature, that person should not train MA - 武夫需有三分戾气".

 

[Fungus]

Old saying said, "If one doesn't have 30% violence in nature, that person should not train MA - 武夫需有三分戾气".

Some people also have a very looong fuse.

It would not occur to me to counter attack someone because of an insult or someone slapping me. For me it would take quite alot to cross the line and where it's game on, and by the time that happens it does not stop until either you or the opponent is down. Its the line you do all you can do not cross as there is a good chance you will regret yourself.

Fortunately so far, this never happened to me, and i want to keep it that way. So keep my anger under strict control, only the heavy bag gets to see it, and more so when I am alone in the bag room. Not in kumite.

I recall i was the same way as a kid, but felt confident that when i need to cross the line, the problem is more that i dont want to have regrets.

 

[O'Malley]

Some people don't train (nor teach) MA for self-defense. I don't think it makes them a McDojo, as long as the purpose is clear to everyone.

Would you expect your gymnastics classes to teach your son how to fight?

 

[HighKick]

Old saying said, "If one doesn't have 30% violence in nature, that person should not train MA - 武夫需有三分戾气".

One of the best lessons my GM taught me is (I am paraphrasing a bit) 'if something is all bad it is bad, if something is all good it is bad. Having some of both is how a person finds balance and quality in life.'

 

[HighKick]

Some people don't train (nor teach) MA for self-defense. I don't think it makes them a McDojo, as long as the purpose is clear to everyone.

Would you expect your gymnastics classes to teach your son how to fight?

I struggle with this as a school owner. If an entity represents themselves as an exercise program that uses martial art like moves as a form of exercise, no harm, no foul.

No, I would not expect a gymnastics class to teach fighting. Nor would I expect a MA's school to explicitly teach my son how to fight. A sparring gym? Yes, absolutely. This comment goes very deep, so think about it a moment.

Think about this, most all schools have people in class who are there just for the workout and are not at all concerned about the 'martial' parts of the style. As long as they are a good student/partner , support the rules of the school and represent the school well, again no harm, no foul.

 

[drop bear]

Some people don't train (nor teach) MA for self-defense. I don't think it makes them a McDojo, as long as the purpose is clear to everyone.

Would you expect your gymnastics classes to teach your son how to fight?

Your gymnastics class would want to be pretty clear if it didn't teach gymnastics though.

 

[Hot Lunch]

If an entity represents themselves as an exercise program that uses martial art like moves as a form of exercise, no harm, no foul.

IMO, this is only makes sense for martial arts that train in weapons that are either no longer in normal use (e.g., for cultural preservation or historical purposes) or are too cumbersome to be carried around by the average person.

Even if exercise is all I care about, if I'm going to punch and kick, I may as well get a secondary benefit from it (self-defense).

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Some people don't train (nor teach) MA for self-defense.

Many schools don't teach "self-defense". Those schools teach "how to fight".

 

[Buka]

Some people also have a very looong fuse.

It would not occur to me to counter attack someone because of an insult or someone slapping me. For me it would take quite alot to cross the line and where it's game on, and by the time that happens it does not stop until either you or the opponent is down. Its the line you do all you can do not cross as there is a good chance you will regret yourself.

Fortunately so far, this never happened to me, and i want to keep it that way. So keep my anger under strict control, only the heavy bag gets to see it, and more so when I am alone in the bag room. Not in kumite.

I recall i was the same way as a kid, but felt confident that when i need to cross the line, the problem is more that i dont want to have regrets.

I can’t be goaded into a fight. Part of that is how I was raised, another part of it is how I was raised in Martial Arts and part is from patience as a Police Officer.

But if someone slaps me, other than a drunk, a suspect, a woman, a child or a friend, I’m slapping back. I can slap harder than anyone I know. Been training different slaps for over forty years now. I love slaps.

 

[drop bear]

I can’t be goaded into a fight. Part of that is how I was raised, another part of it is how I was raised in Martial Arts and part is from patience as a Police Officer.

But if someone slaps me, other than a drunk, a suspect, a woman, a child or a friend, I’m slapping back. I can slap harder than anyone I know. Been training different slaps for over forty years now. I love slaps.

This would have goaded me.

 

[JowGaWolf]

This would have goaded me.

To be honest and realistic. I don't think you qualify for the " I think I can slap this guy in the face with a pizza and get away with it." victim.

I think many of us lost that look a long time ago, if we even had it to begin with. lol

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

But if someone slaps me, other than a drunk, a suspect, a woman, a child or a friend, I’m slapping back.

If someone slaps you, you take him down. That's just part of your training.

 

[Hot Lunch]

But if someone slaps me, other than a drunk, a suspect, a woman, a child or a friend, I’m slapping back. I can slap harder than anyone I know. Been training different slaps for over forty years now. I love slaps.

I'm glad to hear that Will Smith would've qualified for getting slapped back if you were Chris Rock.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I'm glad to hear that Will Smith would've qualified for getting slapped back if you were Chris Rock.

The only reality is that people hit others when they think they can get away with it. Will wasn't going to go up there and just hit anyone. Will and his family are dysfunctional all of them are messed up, they should have just had a normal life. All of that fame is toxic for them.

 

[Badhabits]

Your gymnastics class would want to be pretty clear if it didn't teach gymnastics though.

This is a real problem in TMA. There are a ton of people out there thinking they're being trained to fight, or self defense.....and they're not. They're doing "cardio-karate". A lot of them get really good at going through the motions. Which is fine if that's the goal. It's not fine when someone doesn't know the difference and really thinks they're being taught to fight/defend themselves.