Good Cop / Bad Cop

[KP.]

So....during questioning, a person has his/her hands in their pockets and is acting nervous. The LEO asks them to remove their hands. So, your line of thinking is that if the person complies, that they're bowing down to the govt? Actually, by doing what the cop wants, it'll ease their mind, and the other person will run less of a risk of getting taken to the ground or a gun pulled on them. Why not take your hands out? Hiding something? Got a blade in your pocket you're just itching to pull out? Drugs maybe?

Why?

I mean that as a serious question. Why should the government be able to tell me how I can or can not stand in public? I know you probably don't think of yourself as the government, but you are. When the state starts thinking they have the right to tell people how they may or may not stand, we've pretty well given up any meaningful rights at all.

That said, I would think that a polite request of something like, "Would you mind taking your hands out of your pockets, it's making me nervous." Or something along those lines would be complied with by most people. And failure to comply with a simple request would (and should) make the officer a bit more alert, but is it against the law for someone to stand how they like while answering a question?

 

[KP.]

But, and here's the but. If you act suspicious, you get treated as such. In some areas, cops are so used to dealing with hostility, that they are automatically "on", until you turn them "off".

I'm suspicious at all times, never found anything I could do to help a cop turn it 'off.'

Troops in Iraq aren't exactly Mirandaizing when they stop people there.

Soldier's aren't the police, and it's a serious abuse of the soldier to ask them to pretend to be one. They don't have the training.

On the flip side, the police wanting to be soldiers is just as serious a problem. (towns owning apc's with .50 cal's mounted on them is a big clue that this isn't the USA I, at least, grew up in.)

I get stopped, my first goal is to show the cop I mean no threat. Once done, we can have a more productive and less painful encounter.

Never experienced a productive encounter, so can't speak to that.

Hey LEO's. Quick question. Ever been out walking in uniform and see someone catch a look at you, then take off as fast as they can? Seem supicious?

I do my best to not be where the police are as quickly as possible. Experience has taught me that that is the best place to be.

 

[MJS]

I would think that a polite request of something like, "Would you mind taking your hands out of your pockets, it's making me nervous." Or something along those lines would be complied with by most people.

On the other hand, unless the person is being arrested, why should they have to comply? Now I grant that that would (and should) make the officer a bit more alert, but is it against the law for someone to stand how they like while answering a question?

Sigh...why do I bother. In a number of your posts, you complain how people like yourself and others are treated. You paint all LEOs with the same brush. Yet, anyone with any common sense, would understand that this simple request will make things SO much easier. I guess you didn't read Bobs post. Or maybe you did read it, but still have that anti cop attitude and think that its a violation of 'your rights.' Its no different than turning on your interior light at night if you get stopped. I guess you don't think its right to put someone against the wall or a car when being searched. You know, God forbid you put the suspect in a position that limits his movement. Afterall, why not just have him turn around, so maybe while you're searching, he can take off running.

So, let me ask you....if you were a cop and made a stop and 3am, with a car that had 4 people in it. As you both pull to the side of the road, you notice the front seat and rear seat passengers making alot of movement. Would that concern you? After all, its not illegal to move in a car right? Then again, they could be hiding stolen items, a gun, or getting that gun from under the seat, so when you walk up, they blow you head off!

 

[MJS]

Why?

I mean that as a serious question. Why should the government be able to tell me how I can or can not stand in public? I know you probably don't think of yourself as the government, but you are. When the state starts thinking they have the right to tell people how they may or may not stand, we've pretty well given up any meaningful rights at all.

Since you made a last minute edit, I'll address this part. I could give a rats *** if someone stands on their head and spits nickles. However, in this case, an investigation is being conducted.

See, its this piss poor, cocky attitude that you carry, that brings on the trouble that you cry about all the time. So proud and good that you should be able to do what you want, when you want, **** everyone else and their opinion. Sorry, why is it so hard to co-operate just a little bit? Is that too much to ask?

 

[MJS]

I'm suspicious at all times, never found anything I could do to help a cop turn it 'off.'

Amazing.

Never experienced a productive encounter, so can't speak to that.

LMFAO! And why am I not surprised at this? A little hint...maybe start with changing your attitude.

I do my best to not be where the police are as quickly as possible. Experience has taught me that that is the best place to be.

There ya go again, painting with that broad brush.

 

[Drac]

Hey LEO's. Quick question. Ever been out walking in uniform and see someone catch a look at you, then take off as fast as they can? Seem supicious?

Yep..I'll record the plate in my notebook and keep it..No need to call it in unless I hear a call of a robbery having just been commited THEN I will call it in...

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Why?

I mean that as a serious question. Why should the government be able to tell me how I can or can not stand in public? I know you probably don't think of yourself as the government, but you are. When the state starts thinking they have the right to tell people how they may or may not stand, we've pretty well given up any meaningful rights at all.

That said, I would think that a polite request of something like, "Would you mind taking your hands out of your pockets, it's making me nervous." Or something along those lines would be complied with by most people. And failure to comply with a simple request would (and should) make the officer a bit more alert, but is it against the law for someone to stand how they like while answering a question?

Noon at a street corner is different than 4am. And, yes there are reasons they would tell you to move. Hanging out in front of a closed store at 2am, is suspicious. Its trespassing for one thing, store might have a history of break ins that would add to the suspicious nature, etc. Many parks close after a certain hour. I've been tossed out of a few when I was a teen...they were popular make out spots and the cops would patrol them. They are also highly vandalized, adding to the reasonable suspicion thing.

I'm suspicious at all times, never found anything I could do to help a cop turn it 'off.'

Don't be in places that require them to be 'on'.

Soldier's aren't the police, and it's a serious abuse of the soldier to ask them to pretend to be one. They don't have the training.

Very true. Which is why theres a thread open here discussing the possible use of combat troops on US soil.

On the flip side, the police wanting to be soldiers is just as serious a problem. (towns owning apc's with .50 cal's mounted on them is a big clue that this isn't the USA I, at least, grew up in.)

This isn't Mayberry. Barney didn't need to load his gun. A DC cop on the other hand, needs heavier gear to compete with the bad guys.

Never experienced a productive encounter, so can't speak to that.

Not familiar with your situation, so I can't say.

I do my best to not be where the police are as quickly as possible. Experience has taught me that that is the best place to be.

But fleeing is a suspicious act. You make yourself a target this way, IMO.

 

[KP.]

LMFAO! And why am I not surprised at this? A little hint...maybe start with changing your attitude.

Never once did an encounter was an encounter with the police initiated by me. And what attitude should I have when, for example, the first words I hear are "Hey boy . . ."

There ya go again, painting with that broad brush.

I didn't paint anything with a broad brush. Like I've said a few times, i've yet to have a decent encounter with the police. I'm sure such things happen. I hope that's the norm. But I'm not going to try and prove myself wrong, either.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Guy runs a stop sign, cop turns on his lights, hour long chase ensues, multiple cops involved, at the end, guy ditches the car, takes off running...

Tell me where the error was here?

Guy runs a stop sign, multi cop chase ensues, end result is driver pulls a weapon, unloads into his chest, dies on scene.

Again, where's the error?

Both real cases, both were discussed here previously.

 

[Drac]

Why?

I mean that as a serious question. Why should the government be able to tell me how I can or can not stand in public? I know you probably don't think of yourself as the government, but you are. When the state starts thinking they have the right to tell people how they may or may not stand, we've pretty well given up any meaningful rights at all.

That said, I would think that a polite request of something like, "Would you mind taking your hands out of your pockets, it's making me nervous." Or something along those lines would be complied with by most people. And failure to comply with a simple request would (and should) make the officer a bit more alert, but is it against the law for someone to stand how they like while answering a question?

I would love to see you but on a badge and a gun and encounter somone with your attitude and see how Officer Friendly you remain...

 

[KP.]

Noon at a street corner is different than 4am. And, yes there are reasons they would tell you to move. Hanging out in front of a closed store at 2am, is suspicious. Its trespassing for one thing . . .

I'm not talking about being on someone else's property. Or in any location someone is not legally allowed to be.

This isn't Mayberry. Barney didn't need to load his gun. A DC cop on the other hand, needs heavier gear to compete with the bad guys.

Police do not need a vehicle mounted .50, period. If there's something going down that needs that much firepower, it's time for the national guard.

But fleeing is a suspicious act. You make yourself a target this way, IMO.

I'm not running down an alley and jumping fences. I'm just going the other way.

But, speaking of 4am .. this is hillarious:

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/officer_13573___article.html/driver_marijuana.html

 

[KP.]

I would love to see you but on a badge and a gun and encounter somone with your attitude and see how Officer Friendly you remain...

"My job's stressful, but I have a gun so I get to be a jerk" is not a compelling excuse.

 

[elder999]

Police do not need a vehicle mounted .50, period. If there's something going

Depends a lot upon where they are policing. The cops and security guards in Los Alamos have vehicle mounted .50's. You don't often see them out and about-especially the cops, but they'e here. Drive by the guards range, and you might even see them firing it.....

 

[Drac]

"My job's stressful, but I have a gun so I get to be a jerk" is not a compelling excuse.

I mean the whole " Sir, please take your hands out of your pockets please" and their response to you is "Don't tell me how to stand"...

 

[The Last Legionary]

Officer "Excuse me good sir, might I have a moment of your time to engage you in some verbal discourse?"

Person "What the **** you be haslin me for pig?"

Officer "I say Sir, there is no need for that kind of attitude or language, Please contain yourself."

Person "Contain this mother ****er." grabs crotch

Officer "Sir I'm just attempting to discuss a matter of some urgency with you. Please, might I continue?"

Person "Continue this mother ****er" proceeds to urinate on the officers shoes"

Officer "I Say! How jolly well rude of you! Good Day Sir!" and walks away.

Person "You come back an I bust a cap in yo *** mother ****er."



The reason why we don't have English cops walking a beat in a NYC inner city neighborhood. If that was me, I would have grabbed the nice person, and made them lick my shoes clean.

 

[KP.]

I mean the whole " Sir, please take your hands out of your pockets please" and their response to you is "Don't tell me how to stand"...

If I were talking to a police officer and I was asked just as you stated, I'd do so without hesitation.

But to my knowledge, there's no law compelling me to, nor is refusal to do so a reason to be taken to the ground, as was suggested above.

 

[The Last Legionary]

"My job's stressful, but I have a gun so I get to be a jerk" is not a compelling excuse.

True.

But "I'm black, so all cop are out to get me" is equally lame.

But lets back up a moment. You said you were in the military.
What unit, when, where'd ya serve, etc.

Moving forward, maybe the problem is the huge ****ing chip on a rather large group of peoples shoulders, thinking that they are somehow entitled because up to 140 or so years ago their ancestors picked cotton and tobacco, and that respecting others is somehow beneath them as is proper grammar.

 

[Drac]

Depends a lot upon where they are policing. The cops and security guards in Los Alamos have vehicle mounted .50's. You don't often see them out and about-especially the cops, but they'e here. Drive by the guards range, and you might even see them firing it.....

We just got the M-16's for our cars....You outta see the APC that the Cleveland Police SWAT unit has..Sweet..

 

[Drac]

Better picture

 

[Rich Parsons]

Police do not need a vehicle mounted .50, period. If there's something going down that needs that much firepower, it's time for the national guard.

Hmmmm, I wonder about that.

I know that the LA for the 1984 Olympics had firearms on helicopters.

I know that some shootings in major crime cites are with semi-automatic weapons, with reports locally of a bad guy using one in each hand to shot at police. This was the reason it made the news, they used one in each hand.