From Okinawa to Korea

[Jaeimseu]

stuck with what he learned

IMO for those who chose to stay with what they knew it was more about sticking with what they learned - not having to learn new stuff as opposed to "Not Liking" something they would only have passing familiarity with. Therein was part of the Geniuss of KKW TKD . accepting all systems and taking the long view of gradually switching to a single system whereas General Choi required all to learn a single system from the early days. (Yes, I am aware there were a very few exceptions)[/QUOTE]

I’m guessing it’s a combination of not wanting to learn new stuff at the expense of the old stuff along with the inclination to think that the way you learned something originally is the best or “right” way.

During the decade I lived and taught in Korea, several times we had visitors from North America who did non-standard Kukkiwon poomsae. I was amused (and a little frustrated, tbh) on a few occasions when the visitor would ask why we did a poomsae “wrong.” There we were, less than 10 miles from Kukkiwon, 25-30 people doing poomsae the same way, and the visitor takes this in and comes to the conclusion that he is doing it “correctly.”


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[Earl Weiss]

I
nation of not wanting to learn new stuff at the expense of the old stuff along with the inclination to think that the way you learned something originally is the best or “right” way.
During the decade I lived and taught in Korea, several times we had visitors from North America who did non-standard Kukkiwon poomsae. I was amused (and a little frustrated, tbh) on a few occasions when the visitor would ask why we did a poomsae “wrong.” There we were, less than 10 miles from Kukkiwon, 25-30 people doing poomsae the same way, and the visitor takes this in and comes to the conclusion that he is doing it “correctly.”


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I experienced the same thing in 1990 attending my first IIC with General Choi. I had been training for 18 years with some of the highest ranks in the world. When he did something different that what I had learned my a silent but loud voice in my head said "that's wrong." Of course that could not be correct and referring to the texts I saw how I had learned stuff wrong, 90% of the time the text clearly showed it. The other 10% you could see how stuff got changed as it passed from person t person and was also misunderstood.
When I got back to the club I was teaching with many Black Belts who had been training 10 years plus and a list of 150 things to fix people were not happy that they hd to fix stuff. I thought they would be happy to learn what the rest f the world was doing. So, I learned an important lesson. Make changes gradually . Kind of sneak in a cooule a week.

 

[Michele123]

So my daughter and I will be competing in another tournament in a couple weeks. I’m a bit more nervous about this one because of my new rank. Rather than being a white belt who has learned the material for the next two ranks, I’m new to this rank and don’t know much of the material. I haven’t been able to get to a class since my test because classes have been canceled due to snowstorms!

Anyhow, I didn’t get to spar last time because I had to come home to put the baby down for a nap. This tournament is closer so I’m hoping I actually get to spar but... we don’t spar during normal classes at my gym. There was a sparing seminar I attended a couple months back and that was it. Taekwondo has very restrictive sparing rules. Most punching and doesn’t score and no other striking techniques score. When I was in karate that’s what I did primarily. Now I have to figure out how to just kick a ton while bouncing around. I’m not sure how I’ll do but I’m probably going to be embarrassed. If it were anything goes, I know I could hold my own but kicking only is tough.

My daughter has actually wanted to practice her form with me a few times so that’s good. I hope she is able to do better at the tournament than last time. (Not medal-wise, just execution of the form and confidence)


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[_Simon_]

So my daughter and I will be competing in another tournament in a couple weeks. I’m a bit more nervous about this one because of my new rank. Rather than being a white belt who has learned the material for the next two ranks, I’m new to this rank and don’t know much of the material. I haven’t been able to get to a class since my test because classes have been canceled due to snowstorms!

Anyhow, I didn’t get to spar last time because I had to come home to put the baby down for a nap. This tournament is closer so I’m hoping I actually get to spar but... we don’t spar during normal classes at my gym. There was a sparing seminar I attended a couple months back and that was it. Taekwondo has very restrictive sparing rules. Most punching and doesn’t score and no other striking techniques score. When I was in karate that’s what I did primarily. Now I have to figure out how to just kick a ton while bouncing around. I’m not sure how I’ll do but I’m probably going to be embarrassed. If it were anything goes, I know I could hold my own but kicking only is tough.

My daughter has actually wanted to practice her form with me a few times so that’s good. I hope she is able to do better at the tournament than last time. (Not medal-wise, just execution of the form and confidence)


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Ah nice, yeah I reckon just don't take the tournament as seriously maybe, have a bit of fun with it and enjoy it, and see what you can learn from it. Whenever any tendency comes up within yourself of how you'll look or whether you'll look embarssing on the day, it's worth letting it come up and just really questioning it, asking "Is that really true?" And even following that line of thought of looking embarrassing to it's absolute end: "What would happen if I looked embarrassing? What would people think of me? What would happen if they thought that? How long would they think it for? Would it still matter 10 minutes from now? 30? A day? Month? 5 years?"

It just helps to really put it in perspective and see that not everyone is going to look at everyone without judgement, and moreso that judgement isn't real, and doesn't last very long anyway, and has no effect if you question the belief in it.

If you go into it with a fresh mind, and an intention to just be relaxed about it, have fun with it, enjoy the experience and learn from it, it's so much more rewarding and freeing from the burdens of what others think. You're there for your own reasons, and as awkward as it might be as a new rank, if you take it lightly and as a cool new experience, I'm sure all those nerves will wash away when you're there having fun.

I'm also competing in a few weeks on short notice, haven't really prepared much, have only done one sparring round with someone last night and there probably won't be another opportunity to, but I'm really relaxed about this one and just gonna really focus on just enjoying the experience of being part of an event like this. It's a surreal feeling when you're out there on the mats and in that atmosphere!

Ah I thought TKD tournaments did score for punching but that kicking tends to score more, ah there ya go!

And great that you're daughter is keen on practicing too

 

[Michele123]

Thank you Simon for your thoughtful comments. I’m a perfectionist and it’s my own standards. I don’t think other people will remember much how I perform after they go home. But I will. I like to be the best at everything, or at least better than one would normally expect of someone at my rank/time studying/whatever. Perhaps I need to look at that. But it is what drives me to excel and I like to excel so... *shrug*

Ah I thought TKD tournaments did score for punching but that kicking tends to score more, ah there ya go!

Oh. Yeah punching can occasionally score. But it is very specific. The punch has to be to the torso front or sides and the punch must be coming from over your back leg. No other strikes can score. (Elbows, knees, palms, non of that)

When I studied karate, there were no such restrictions. We didn’t point spare, we were self-defense focused. No restriction on targets or techniques. If it worked, use it. I liked to get in close so my opponent couldn’t kick or swing well and pummel them with elbows and knees. That would never fly in TKD.


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[_Simon_]

Thank you Simon for your thoughtful comments. I’m a perfectionist and it’s my own standards. I don’t think other people will remember much how I perform after they go home. But I will. I like to be the best at everything, or at least better than one would normally expect of someone at my rank/time studying/whatever. Perhaps I need to look at that. But it is what drives me to excel and I like to excel so... *shrug*



Oh. Yeah punching can occasionally score. But it is very specific. The punch has to be to the torso front or sides and the punch must be coming from over your back leg. No other strikes can score. (Elbows, knees, palms, non of that)

When I studied karate, there were no such restrictions. We didn’t point spare, we were self-defense focused. No restriction on targets or techniques. If it worked, use it. I liked to get in close so my opponent couldn’t kick or swing well and pummel them with elbows and knees. That would never fly in TKD.


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Ahh yep, yeah I have perfectionist tendencies as well. That's true that it can be helpful and fosters attention to detail and wanting to do your best and with integrity, it's only an issue when it creates dysfunction within your life. Which it absolutely has for me, and has really been far more harmful than good. But yeah seeing how it operates in your life and if it's brings about alot of anxiety at things not being perfect, then it becomes an issue.

My technique is really spot on from what others have told me, but I can be too critical when it's off and also far far too tense in my movements, wanting it to be peeeeerfect. So in my case it's good and bad, and I'm trying to be aware of where it serves me and benefits me, and where it's destructive. Where it's just completely unneccesary (putting far too much pressure on myself, pushing myself too hard etc), and where it can help (developing skills, knowledge, confidence etc). But anyways I won't push anything haha it's up to you how far you wanna delve into that .

Ah yep makes sense, it's tricky to spar under different conditions like that, but keen to see how you go! It'll go really help develop your kicks hey

 

[pdg]

I thought TKD tournaments did score for punching but that kicking tends to score more, ah there ya go!

punching can occasionally score. But it is very specific. The punch has to be to the torso front or sides and the punch must be coming from over your back leg.

That depends on your ruleset...

We spar for points, but it's continuous (no break after scoring, just see who got most at the end of the round).

We also score head punches (less points than kicks) using either hand, and things like backfists (not spinning, must clearly sight target). Sometimes, hooking punches are allowed, sometimes not, depends who is running the comp.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Ah I thought TKD tournaments did score for punching but that kicking tends to score more, ah there ya go!

There are rulesets and there are rulesets...
Under Olympic sparring rules, a narrow range of punches to the torso can theoretically score. They're worth one point, same as a kick. Kicks to the head and spinning/jumping kicks are worth 2 or 3 points respectively.
That's the theory. In practice, it's fairly uncommon to see punches scoring under Olympic rules.
On the other hand, we score punches exactly the same as kicks, and with the same targets. As a result, our sparring looks very little like sparring done under Olympic rules. You will regret sparring with your hands down, for one thing.

 

[JR 137]

Thank you Simon for your thoughtful comments. I’m a perfectionist and it’s my own standards. I don’t think other people will remember much how I perform after they go home. But I will. I like to be the best at everything, or at least better than one would normally expect of someone at my rank/time studying/whatever. Perhaps I need to look at that. But it is what drives me to excel and I like to excel so... *shrug*



Oh. Yeah punching can occasionally score. But it is very specific. The punch has to be to the torso front or sides and the punch must be coming from over your back leg. No other strikes can score. (Elbows, knees, palms, non of that)

When I studied karate, there were no such restrictions. We didn’t point spare, we were self-defense focused. No restriction on targets or techniques. If it worked, use it. I liked to get in close so my opponent couldn’t kick or swing well and pummel them with elbows and knees. That would never fly in TKD.


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The great thing about MA competition is it has a better equalizer than practically every other physical competition - ranks. Unless you’re competing in an open division somehow, everyone you’ll be competing against will more or less be in the same boat. Early kyu/gup ranks last what, 3 months or so? So I’m willing to bet there’ll be several people who’ve just promoted too, and have about the same amount of sparring experience as you.

Go in and fun fun with it. Don’t take it nor yourself too seriously. Easier said than done though.

2 years ago, I competed for the first time in almost 20 years. I took a 15 year break from karate, and had been back for about about 16 months. It was our organization’s 40th anniversary tournament, and honestly only did it because my daughters (5 and 3 at the time) wanted to see me compete. Like you, I couldn’t just walk in and not care about how I did; I trained really hard for it. A lot of kept me motivated and focused was feeling that I couldn’t control how good or bad the competition would be; all I could do was try to outdo myself. If I did far better than I thought I could do, I’d be happy regardless of where I placed. I wasn’t competing against anyone but myself.

If you go in with that mentality, you should do fine. Do better than you thought you could do, and the scoreboard and everyone else’s opinions don’t matter.

I’ve always been a bit too competitive. At nearing 42, I’m just a bit too competitive with myself. It pretty much always works out well in the end. And if it doesn’t go exactly how I wanted, I still live to fight another day. And can improve.

 

[Michele123]

There are rulesets and there are rulesets...
Under Olympic sparring rules, a narrow range of punches to the torso can theoretically score. They're worth one point, same as a kick. Kicks to the head and spinning/jumping kicks are worth 2 or 3 points respectively.
That's the theory. In practice, it's fairly uncommon to see punches scoring under Olympic rules.
On the other hand, we score punches exactly the same as kicks, and with the same targets. As a result, our sparring looks very little like sparring done under Olympic rules. You will regret sparring with your hands down, for one thing.

Yes. Our competitions use modified Olympic rules. Basically Olympic rules except no face strikes.


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[Kinghercules]

[/QUOTE]
I’m guessing it’s a combination of not wanting to learn new stuff at the expense of the old stuff along with the inclination to think that the way you learned something originally is the best or “right” way.

During the decade I lived and taught in Korea, several times we had visitors from North America who did non-standard Kukkiwon poomsae. I was amused (and a little frustrated, tbh) on a few occasions when the visitor would ask why we did a poomsae “wrong.” There we were, less than 10 miles from Kukkiwon, 25-30 people doing poomsae the same way, and the visitor takes this in and comes to the conclusion that he is doing it “correctly.”


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Here's the thing...the KKW dont run the world.
I find it funny that many TKD people dont know that TKD existed before the KKW did and yall act like the KKW is the REAL DEAL. When its not. Its just the biggest association of TKD practitioners.

You have to keep in mind that many schools in the USA taught TKD before 1973. Ive even seen some people put on their websites saying that if a person doesnt have a black belt from the KKW then they are fake black belts. Im like really!! What about all those Koreans that were black belts before the KKW was created and came to the USA to teach? There are different styles/schools of TKD just as there are different schools of karate. The KKW is more sport orientated whereas most of the old school TKD schools in the USA were more street orientated. The forms for the KKW were created to move away from the Japanese influence on Korean martial arts. So there are many TKD schools in the USA that still do the Japanese forms and some even do both. Another thing that people dont realize is that many Americans learned from Korean masters that out ranked those who formed the KKW. So of course they gonna think that that you're wrong when there instructor was more than likely a black belt when the founders of the KKW were still Gups.

 

[Michele123]

I’m struggling with a few things right now. First, we have a tournament coming up this weekend and I’ve only been just taught my form a week ago.

Second, $$$$ Taekwando is soooo expensive! In my old style, my Sensei taught because he loved it and it was his passion to help others. Tuition was just a suggested donation thing to help pay for the building we met in ($3/week was asked) and testing fees were $20 total for the belt, certificate, and association fee. In the Taekwando I study there is a high monthly tuition fee, double the testing fee, then at Black belt it tripled and more for each Dan test. On top of that there are tournaments that you are highly encouraged to attend. Plus, at black belt level there are extra black belt classes that, I assume, must also have an extra fee. I have spent more on Taekwando in six months, than I did on karate for six years!

Third, and I don’t know if this is because of my prior experience, but Taekwando material is so *easy* and there is so *little* material between ranks. When I was in karate, I worked hard. I went to two 2 1/2 classes each week and practiced up to two hours a day (plus occasionally getting together with other students outside of class). I progressed faster than your average student then as well, but not this fast. When I studied karate, we also had a lot of falling classes (monthly at a minimum) grappling (judo and jujitsu folks came in for that), and of course a variety of strikes in addition to kicks. *every* class began with us, in rows by rank, going through our 12 basic techniques to refine them.

Right now I’m feeling like Taekwando is martial arts “lite” with a premium price tag.

Yet, I love martial arts and the only other option in town is a McDojo that teaches “Americanized Taekwando” that they call karate.

Is it normal to feel like your previous style is superior to your new style?


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[TrueJim]

I think what you're experiencing will vary a LOT from school to school. At the school I attend, I do think the monthly fees are a bit high, but the color-belt testing fees are actually quite low! I think if you shopped around, you'd find local schools that have a very different fee structure from what you're seeing...it can vary a lot.

When I first studied taekwondo in a college club, the curriculum was very linear: you didn't start practicing Y until you've mastered X. At the school I'm at now, they first introduce you to X, but while you're still getting a handle on that, they also introduce you to Y. My initial reaction was to feel suspect that this was actually a good approach, but now that I've lived with that approach for a few years, I see the virtue in it.

Bottom line: I think your observations are valid, but really valid only for the school you're at now. I think if you looked around, you'd see that the experience can vary quite a lot from school to school.

 

[pdg]

In any competition we do, we're only expected to compete with the pattern we've already graded with, not a 'new' one. It seems a bit off to me to expect you to be at competition standard with something you've not practiced much...

How long have you been doing TKD and how many tests have you had? You mentioned 6 months and in that time I'd just done 2 gradings, and that was minimum time in grade.

I've been doing it 2 years now, and I'm 3rd kup - and that's also with every grading at minimum elapsed time...

I'll let you convert the currency yourself, but I pay just under £70 per month for up to 9 hours per week (that's for me and both my kids too).

Each grading is about £30 (all inclusive), minimum of every 3 months from 9th - 4th kup, then 6 months min 3rd to 1st kup. 1st dan is about £100 (I think), but that's done elsewhere and you have to have been 1st kup for a minimum of 12 months.

We don't have any in between grade mini tests or extra belt stripes or anything either...

Our classes seem much like you describe your old ones - we all line up in rank and do fundamental techniques at the start, a bit of pattern work, then move on to other stuff (different techniques, sparring, etc.)

I'm not in the least saying all the schools around here are like that (I know of another near where everything is over double the price and I've heard nothing good about the quality), but it does illustrate a bit of a difference.

 

[Michele123]

Thank you for your comments.

I think what you're experiencing will vary a LOT from school to school. At the school I attend, I do think the monthly fees are a bit high, but the color-belt testing fees are actually quite low! I think if you shopped around, you'd find local schools that have a very different fee structure from what you're seeing...it can vary a lot.

Can I ask what testing fees are? Here they are $40/Test. My old school was $20. I’ve heard that the Dan tests are multiple hundred dollars, each one being a huge jump from the previous. I don’t know if it makes a difference, but the Taekwando school I currently attend is a KKW school.

When I first studied taekwondo in a college club, the curriculum was very linear: you didn't start practicing Y until you've mastered X. At the school I'm at now, they first introduce you to X, but while you're still getting a handle on that, they also introduce you to Y. My initial reaction was to feel suspect that this was actually a good approach, but now that I've lived with that approach for a few years, I see the virtue in it.

Yes. That’s how my current school does it. It’s just that there seems to be very few material between grades. A form and a couple sets of drills (each drill has 5-12 sets in it). My karate school had much more material between grades.

Bottom line: I think your observations are valid, but really valid only for the school you're at now. I think if you looked around, you'd see that the experience can vary quite a lot from school to school.

I’m sure you are right. It’s probably a case of simply being uncomfortable with the different.

In any competition we do, we're only expected to compete with the pattern we've already graded with, not a 'new' one. It seems a bit off to me to expect you to be at competition standard with something you've not practiced much...

My instructor asked if I was comfortable with it. I said I was and it was left at that. I am comfortable with it. But other than the night I was taught it, no one has watched me do it and I prefer to have more feedback. I know I have the techniques right, but what about the little things? I’m not entirely certain of timing (which techniques and movements should be quick verses slow, or does this not exist in Taekwando?). At the last tournament, everyone did the form they were working on for their next rank. So that’s the norm here.

How long have you been doing TKD and how many tests have you had? You mentioned 6 months and in that time I'd just done 2 gradings, and that was minimum time in grade.

I've been doing it 2 years now, and I'm 3rd kup - and that's also with every grading at minimum elapsed time...

I started the end of October, so not quite 6 months. I’ve had three tests so far but the last two were the same night (double test). The first was a test for white belt as here the first rank is no belt. So 7th kup for me.

I'll let you convert the currency yourself, but I pay just under £70 per month for up to 9 hours per week (that's for me and both my kids too).

that’s basically what it is here for me and my daughter. Two hours for me plus one for her per week. As she gets older the tuition won’t change but she will have more time.

Each grading is about £30 (all inclusive), minimum of every 3 months from 9th - 4th kup, then 6 months min 3rd to 1st kup. 1st dan is about £100 (I think), but that's done elsewhere and you have to have been 1st kup for a minimum of 12 months.

The kup grading is nearly the same as ours. I don’t remember the exact cost of the Dan grading, just dropping my jaw when I heard it. I’m fairly certain it was much more than yours.

We don't have any in between grade mini tests or extra belt stripes or anything either...

We don’t either except for the really little kids.

Our classes seem much like you describe your old ones - we all line up in rank and do fundamental techniques at the start, a bit of pattern work, then move on to other stuff (different techniques, sparring, etc.)

In my current school, we only line up to bow in (and, in the opposite order my old school did. It messes with my head. My old school had the highest rank on the student’s right. This school it is on the student’s left. It doesn’t matter but it seemed weird to me at first)

I'm not in the least saying all the schools around here are like that (I know of another near where everything is over double the price and I've heard nothing good about the quality), but it does illustrate a bit of a difference.

The other school near me is a McDojo. You pay $3,000 upfront tuition and don’t pay tuition again until you get to 4th kyu (testing fees and tournaments are mandatory and extra). Then another fee until 1st Dan. So in this context my current school is fine. It just feels so expensive after my old school. Add to that sparring equipment can only be used if purchased through the school, sometimes it feels like being nickel and dimed to death.

The thing that startled me the most is that all the first dans that earned their rank last June are preparing to test for second Dan this June. In my old karate school, there were YEARS between Dan testing. In addition my old school’s dans had much crisper techniques than this school does. I just can’t see all of them being up for promotion.

I had earned first Dan at my old karate school. I know what it took. Even then I felt like there was so much I should be better at before wearing the belt. Here I feel like my techniques are crisper than most of the 1st Dans. They know more techniques in this style, sure, but how they do them looks like it leaves a lot to be desired IMHO. But maybe that’s part of the problem when comparing styles. Maybe I’ve just gotten a big head in the last 20 years. *shrug*

I don’t really have any other options nearby so I’ll continue to train because this is better than the other options (McDojo or nothing). I do like the school, the instructor, and the other students at this school. Still, I hope to get back into something related to shotokan again someday (my old style was an offshoot called Shutokan).

 

[pdg]

that’s basically what it is here for me and my daughter. Two hours for me plus one for her per week. As she gets older the tuition won’t change but she will have more time

The 9 hours is what's available to me (that's all the school is open for), any time the kids do is in addition to that.

 

[WaterGal]

I’m struggling with a few things right now. First, we have a tournament coming up this weekend and I’ve only been just taught my form a week ago.

When we have color belt students in this position, we tell them to compete using their previous form, the one they just tested on recently and are very confident with. There's enough disparity between schools with what belt colors are used and when they start the Taegeuk forms at that it shouldn't be a problem. Now, if you're a red belt and want to put on a yellow belt and compete with Taegeuk 1, that's not right, but if you're just learning Taegeuk 2 and want to compete with Taegeuk 1 that should be fine.

Second, $$$$ Taekwando is soooo expensive! In my old style, my Sensei taught because he loved it and it was his passion to help others. Tuition was just a suggested donation thing to help pay for the building we met in ($3/week was asked) and testing fees were $20 total for the belt, certificate, and association fee. In the Taekwando I study there is a high monthly tuition fee, double the testing fee, then at Black belt it tripled and more for each Dan test. On top of that there are tournaments that you are highly encouraged to attend. Plus, at black belt level there are extra black belt classes that, I assume, must also have an extra fee. I have spent more on Taekwando in six months, than I did on karate for six years!

Some of this is isn't about the style of martial arts, it's just the difference between a commercial school and a club. A commerical school often has very high expenses. We pay thousands of dollars a month in rent, thousands in payroll, hundreds in advertising, utilities, payment processing fees, cleaning supplies.... it all adds up. Someone teaching a couple hours a week at the rec center has very little overhead, so if they're just teaching for fun, they don't need to charge much at all.

As an aside, the black belt classes might not cost extra. I know we don't charge any extra for ours. They're where you learn the black belt curriculum, they're what you're paying for with your tuition payments once you get to black belt. But I can't speak for every school everywhere.

Third, and I don’t know if this is because of my prior experience, but Taekwando material is so *easy* and there is so *little* material between ranks. When I was in karate, I worked hard. I went to two 2 1/2 classes each week and practiced up to two hours a day (plus occasionally getting together with other students outside of class). I progressed faster than your average student then as well, but not this fast. When I studied karate, we also had a lot of falling classes (monthly at a minimum) grappling (judo and jujitsu folks came in for that), and of course a variety of strikes in addition to kicks. *every* class began with us, in rows by rank, going through our 12 basic techniques to refine them.

Some of that may be because of your prior experience. Some of that is probably the school. Some of that is probably the style - KKW TKD tends to view black belt as, like, "you've got a good handle on the fundamentals", while many other arts view it as a very high rank. So KKW TKD schools often move through the color belt ranks more quickly than some other styles do, to try to get you to black belt where you do the "good stuff".

 

[TrueJim]

Can I ask what testing fees are? Here they are $40/Test. My old school was $20.

We are also a Kukkiwon/WT school. We're at $25, I believe. (It's been a while since I had to do a color-belt test.)

I’ve heard that the Dan tests are multiple hundred dollars.

That's not atypical. At our school, the dan test is several hundred dollars, and if you fail: (a) there's no refund, and (b) you're not allowed to test again for another year. One reason we do it this way is to prevent parents from pushing to have their children tested before the children are ready.

But also, dan tests at our school are done by a committee of relatively high-ranking masters from schools other than our own (to enforce quality), and we pay for their travel and lodging if necessary.

At our school, the cost goes up by $100 at each dan level. I don't know what the rationale for that is.

there seems to be very few material between grades

I'd say there's not a lot of material between our grades either. One poomsae, one kicking combination, one breaking technique, and some test questions (like technique names). So then the test consists of those three things, plus sparring, plus review of basic techniques. So there's only 6 sections to our color-belt tests: basic techniques, poomsae, kicking combination, breaking technique, test questions, sparring (not in that order).

no one has watched me do it and I prefer to have more feedback

Coming from an old-school background myself, my reaction was similar. Our school seems to have the teaching philosophy of teaching in "layers" -- maybe yours does too. Like as a white belt you learn the white belt form, but there's not much concern about HOW you perform it. Then at yellow belt you learn a new form, but also revisit the previous form and clean up some of the techniques, and so on and so on at each belt level, until by black belt you're still performing the white belt form but now with excellent technique. As opposed to my long-ago instruction, where you didn't learn a new form until the old forms was perfect. This newer style of teaching took some getting used to.

 

[Michele123]

Some of this is isn't about the style of martial arts, it's just the difference between a commercial school and a club. A commerical school often has very high expenses. We pay thousands of dollars a month in rent, thousands in payroll, hundreds in advertising, utilities, payment processing fees, cleaning supplies.... it all adds up. Someone teaching a couple hours a week at the rec center has very little overhead, so if they're just teaching for fun, they don't need to charge much at all.

Hmm. Good point. But at my old “club” we had 4-5 hours of training a week. At this commercial school, there are only two hours of training available per week for adult classes (instructor has a day job). There is also only the one instructor here so no payroll.

Thank you for the rest of your comments as well. I don’t have a response but it gives me something to mull over.


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[Michele123]

But also, dan tests at our school are done by a committee of relatively high-ranking masters from schools other than our own (to enforce quality), and we pay for their travel and lodging if necessary.

All your comments were very helpful, thank you. But I wanted to respond to this in particular. This actually makes a lot of sense. The Dan tests here are together with the whole association. It never occurred to me that there would be a cost besides a belt and a piece of paper (certificate).



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