14 Kempo
Grandmaster
Just have to luv new toys ... LOL
Any SKK combo's on youtube?
- Thread starter kempo
- Start date
Just have to luv new toys ... LOL
kidswarrior
Senior Master
Just a note from the resident lurker. I love reading about and watching what you guys are doing, your interpretations of the combos, etc. And would love to participate, but that would derail the whole thing since all of my SKK understanding has now been sifted through the experience of Kung Fu San Soo. Just wanted you to know why I lurk but don't usually chime in. 
14 Kempo
Grandmaster
Just a note from the resident lurker. I love reading about and watching what you guys are doing, your interpretations of the combos, etc. And would love to participate, but that would derail the whole thing since all of my SKK understanding has now been sifted through the experience of Kung Fu San Soo. Just wanted you to know why I lurk but don't usually chime in.
No worries, people say they can see a kung fu influence in our stuff. Once I get some up on youtube, you can tell me.
RevIV
Black Belt
Just a note from the resident lurker. I love reading about and watching what you guys are doing, your interpretations of the combos, etc. And would love to participate, but that would derail the whole thing since all of my SKK understanding has now been sifted through the experience of Kung Fu San Soo. Just wanted you to know why I lurk but don't usually chime in.
Put it out there anyways.. I see differences in combo's all the time. I like to see what they changed into. The SKK guys who switched to Kosho have made some nice changes to the techniques, some of which I would never of known which # it was unless they told me.
DavidCC
Master of Arts
I put a video up as well, at
combos 3 and 2. 2 is on there twice becasue I don't really have very good editing software, and I didn't think we had a good angle on the first take. Turns out angle on second take wasn't much better haha
Also my camera operator wasn't taking into account the lag time between pressing the GO button and when it starts, so the first few seconds are cut off :/
So anyway, in #3 the biggest difference we have is the kick at the end, something we changed after we left Geary. Although I do like the knee-on-stomach position for the punch that I saw... I explicitly "index" my foot before the kick, but Sensei Steiner doesn't necessarily teach it that way - he teaches to pivot the right foot as part of dropping the attacker. I practice with the explicit pick up/ turn / stomp action but under pressure that degrades into a pivot
Steiner Academy's #2 is quite different, discussed that before... and the way I do it is kindof different even than what Sensei Steiner teaches: I BAM my right shoulder with the initial block; I move my right hand directly back to an outward block after the inward (not continuing the downward circle through the inward block), I BAM my left shoulder after the hammerfist to the temple, I use a rising elbow instead of a ridge hand.
The most important of all these is the movement of the right hand after the inital block. Moving directly outward to the outward block does 2 things: it picks up any possible left punch to the head (when I teach this tech it is vs a right/left combo!) also it fixes a problem with movement of the shoulder: if you continue the circle through the inward block, CCW, down, out and back up with teh right arm, you 'go through' the same outward block position. BUT at the point where the arm reaches that outward block position, the orbit of the fist changes from a vertical CCW to a horizontal inward strike to the temple. Thrown with intent this puts a LOT of crazy stress on the shoulder joint to turn that orbit form vertical to horizontal.
Also that vertical CCW rotation does nothing to help with a left follow-up attack, in fact it could guide it into your head!
But moving the right arm fiorm the inward block, direclty to the outward, the shoulder joint STOPS before it then changes direction; also this gives a direct line against the incoming left punch.
oh, dang, sorry for the long post. I just meant to say "my video is up, what do you think" ROFL
combos 3 and 2. 2 is on there twice becasue I don't really have very good editing software, and I didn't think we had a good angle on the first take. Turns out angle on second take wasn't much better haha
Also my camera operator wasn't taking into account the lag time between pressing the GO button and when it starts, so the first few seconds are cut off :/
So anyway, in #3 the biggest difference we have is the kick at the end, something we changed after we left Geary. Although I do like the knee-on-stomach position for the punch that I saw... I explicitly "index" my foot before the kick, but Sensei Steiner doesn't necessarily teach it that way - he teaches to pivot the right foot as part of dropping the attacker. I practice with the explicit pick up/ turn / stomp action but under pressure that degrades into a pivot
Steiner Academy's #2 is quite different, discussed that before... and the way I do it is kindof different even than what Sensei Steiner teaches: I BAM my right shoulder with the initial block; I move my right hand directly back to an outward block after the inward (not continuing the downward circle through the inward block), I BAM my left shoulder after the hammerfist to the temple, I use a rising elbow instead of a ridge hand.
The most important of all these is the movement of the right hand after the inital block. Moving directly outward to the outward block does 2 things: it picks up any possible left punch to the head (when I teach this tech it is vs a right/left combo!) also it fixes a problem with movement of the shoulder: if you continue the circle through the inward block, CCW, down, out and back up with teh right arm, you 'go through' the same outward block position. BUT at the point where the arm reaches that outward block position, the orbit of the fist changes from a vertical CCW to a horizontal inward strike to the temple. Thrown with intent this puts a LOT of crazy stress on the shoulder joint to turn that orbit form vertical to horizontal.
Also that vertical CCW rotation does nothing to help with a left follow-up attack, in fact it could guide it into your head!
But moving the right arm fiorm the inward block, direclty to the outward, the shoulder joint STOPS before it then changes direction; also this gives a direct line against the incoming left punch.
oh, dang, sorry for the long post. I just meant to say "my video is up, what do you think" ROFL
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kidswarrior
Senior Master
RevIV said:
Thanks for the encouragement, guys. Sometimes I feel a little isolated. :uhyeah:
Will work on putting up some stuff in the next couple months.
RevIV
Black Belt
DavidCC,
thanks for the post I saw it the other day. Your #2 looks like one of my kempo punch tech. I also teach #2 off of 2 strikes but it is the Left then right punch.
One thing what does "BAM" mean? is it short for something or just a batman and robin way of expressing yourself? haaha
thanks for the post I saw it the other day. Your #2 looks like one of my kempo punch tech. I also teach #2 off of 2 strikes but it is the Left then right punch.
One thing what does "BAM" mean? is it short for something or just a batman and robin way of expressing yourself? haaha
RevIV
Black Belt
next couple months? c'mon you telling me I have to wait till next year to see them?
DavidCC
Master of Arts
BAM is a term taken from SL-4 kenpo - Body Alignment Mechanism. Use search, you will find some very good threads on it.
The specific BAM I am using here is to slap the front of the shoulder with the opposite hand - left hand to right shoulder on the first inward block in SKK #2 for example.
Why? What does it do? I can tell you what little I know, use Search to dig deeper...
It serves many functions:
-it trains the body to allow more powerful motion of the block, since the body wants to slow that motion to avoid injury, by slapping the front of the shoulder this trains the body that the shoulder is protected and using the antagonist muscles is not necessary
-It engages a balancing movement of the arms, travelling in opposite directions, which improives balance and power.
-It positions my left correctly for its next movement.
-It gives me a physical "cue" to not over-rotate my body, keeping it aligned.
-It amplifies the internal energy of the strike (which is inseperable from the above list but bears seperate mention for those who are into that sort of thing)
My understanding of the whys and what-fors of BAM is very limited... probably not much above 'monkey-see / monkey-do' but that is why I do it. Also another very good reason is "Doc said it was a good thing to do", the other reasons came after that one actually...
The second BAM in #2 is when the right hammer fist must change direction from an inward hammer to an outward whipping backfist. Instead of slowing the hand "in the air" to round it off or change direction, I let it continue through the target at full speed until it impacts my left shoulder, there it rebounds into the next strike.
Also I use a BAM in #3: the left inward block continues through the attacking arm, and BAMs my right shoulder in time with the right punch to the ribs. The left then bounces off the right shouklder and slaps the attackers right shoulder (a "negative BAM") and I grab their clothing in order to control that shoulder for the remainder of the technique. Also this same mechanism is very good in #22; see AOD videos on YT...
Look up PAM too, I am using those as well...
The specific BAM I am using here is to slap the front of the shoulder with the opposite hand - left hand to right shoulder on the first inward block in SKK #2 for example.
Why? What does it do? I can tell you what little I know, use Search to dig deeper...
It serves many functions:
-it trains the body to allow more powerful motion of the block, since the body wants to slow that motion to avoid injury, by slapping the front of the shoulder this trains the body that the shoulder is protected and using the antagonist muscles is not necessary
-It engages a balancing movement of the arms, travelling in opposite directions, which improives balance and power.
-It positions my left correctly for its next movement.
-It gives me a physical "cue" to not over-rotate my body, keeping it aligned.
-It amplifies the internal energy of the strike (which is inseperable from the above list but bears seperate mention for those who are into that sort of thing)
My understanding of the whys and what-fors of BAM is very limited... probably not much above 'monkey-see / monkey-do' but that is why I do it. Also another very good reason is "Doc said it was a good thing to do", the other reasons came after that one actually...
The second BAM in #2 is when the right hammer fist must change direction from an inward hammer to an outward whipping backfist. Instead of slowing the hand "in the air" to round it off or change direction, I let it continue through the target at full speed until it impacts my left shoulder, there it rebounds into the next strike.
Also I use a BAM in #3: the left inward block continues through the attacking arm, and BAMs my right shoulder in time with the right punch to the ribs. The left then bounces off the right shouklder and slaps the attackers right shoulder (a "negative BAM") and I grab their clothing in order to control that shoulder for the remainder of the technique. Also this same mechanism is very good in #22; see AOD videos on YT...
Look up PAM too, I am using those as well...
David, thanks for participating. It is interesting to see the differences in your combo's. Your #2 lookes like a white belt kempo I have..I put a video up as well, at
combos 3 and 2. 2 is on there twice becasue I don't really have very good editing software, and I didn't think we had a good angle on the first take. Turns out angle on second take wasn't much better haha
Also my camera operator wasn't taking into account the lag time between pressing the GO button and when it starts, so the first few seconds are cut off :/
So anyway, in #3 the biggest difference we have is the kick at the end, something we changed after we left Geary. Although I do like the knee-on-stomach position for the punch that I saw... I explicitly "index" my foot before the kick, but Sensei Steiner doesn't necessarily teach it that way - he teaches to pivot the right foot as part of dropping the attacker. I practice with the explicit pick up/ turn / stomp action but under pressure that degrades into a pivot
Steiner Academy's #2 is quite different, discussed that before... and the way I do it is kindof different even than what Sensei Steiner teaches: I BAM my right shoulder with the initial block; I move my right hand directly back to an outward block after the inward (not continuing the downward circle through the inward block), I BAM my left shoulder after the hammerfist to the temple, I use a rising elbow instead of a ridge hand.
The most important of all these is the movement of the right hand after the inital block. Moving directly outward to the outward block does 2 things: it picks up any possible left punch to the head (when I teach this tech it is vs a right/left combo!) also it fixes a problem with movement of the shoulder: if you continue the circle through the inward block, CCW, down, out and back up with teh right arm, you 'go through' the same outward block position. BUT at the point where the arm reaches that outward block position, the orbit of the fist changes from a vertical CCW to a horizontal inward strike to the temple. Thrown with intent this puts a LOT of crazy stress on the shoulder joint to turn that orbit form vertical to horizontal.
Also that vertical CCW rotation does nothing to help with a left follow-up attack, in fact it could guide it into your head!
But moving the right arm fiorm the inward block, direclty to the outward, the shoulder joint STOPS before it then changes direction; also this gives a direct line against the incoming left punch.
oh, dang, sorry for the long post. I just meant to say "my video is up, what do you think" ROFL
And your #3 finishes with a kick not a punch. Nice job!
Chris
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kidswarrior
Senior Master
Take a look at my age again.
I gotta get someone under 14 to help me do the tech part. Why, when I was 14 only the rich kids had transistor radios.... And eight track tapes weren't out yet--only four track. So, yeah, prolly the new year...
RevIV
Black Belt
Take a look at my age again.
Well you just made me almost spit out my drink.. Thats funny, well when you get your 8mm set up post it up.
kidswarrior
Senior Master
I suppose you think that's a joke? :rofl: Now where's that film canister I had recently... just saw it in..., '74, think it was....
14 Kempo
Grandmaster
I ain't falling for it, you aren't that old ... at least not that much older than am I.
kidswarrior
Senior Master
Thanks, Marlon. I learned #3 and #11 pretty much as you show them. Have changed a couple of things...again, will put it up when I can.
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kidswarrior
Senior Master
Yes, I too find denial comforting.
Nice job marlon, thanks!!
I like your turn to take down on three, I hadn't thought about 3 coming from 1 pinan before. Very Nice.
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DavidCC
Master of Arts
My teacher wanted to remove the finishes where we are standing over a prone attacker punching downwards... not to include the ones where we have control of a limb (10,17, etc), just the ones where we do not. However the knee-on-stomach variation is interesting and would be a good transition to groundfighting if you need to do that for some reason...
