OP
OP
Yep. That's very close. I haven't tried wrapping the leg.
:asian:
Anti-grappling.
- Thread starter K-man
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:asian:
OP
OP
Hanzou
Grandmaster
He didn't say a grab, he said a strike.
Its about the worst thing you could do for several reasons. The main one being that the person you're striking in side control has a much more dominant position than you have, so if you start trying to punch him, he'll start punching you back, or he'll begin to apply nasty pressure tactics like jamming the blade of his forearm across your neck, adjusting his weight so he is compressing your chest, or smashing your head into the ground with his elbow.
If he is a submission grappler, he can easily apply arm locks or chokes once you start trying to punch. Your punch has next to no power backing it, so even if you hit his temple (which in of itself is a longshot), you have an incredibly low chance of knocking him out. And that's assuming that he hasn't trapped your arm at this point. Worse, if you're against a skilled grappler, he'll let you start punching, to make the trapping easier. Some of the nastiest chokes in side control comes from trapping the arm against your opponent's neck, and you trying to punch his temple makes that trap a lot easier.
This is why its curious that there are no anti-grappling vids for side control. Side control is a far more dominant position than the guard, and a lot more grapplers use it than just Bjj. Of course, given the laughable guard passing stuff, the absence of side control escapes doesn't surprise me. And if you think I'm giving grapplers too much credit, ask Steve, Tony, Drop, or Brian what its like to grapple against someone who has never grappled before. It's like they've fallen into an ocean and you're a shark.
The ironic thing about all of this is that there are comparatively simple ways to get out of side control using grappling. I don't know why you guys insist on making things hard for yourselves.
If you're a grappler yes. But isn't the point of anti-grappling for non grapplers to use different tactics?The ironic thing about all of this is that there are comparatively simple ways to get out of side control using grappling. I don't know why you guys insist on making things hard for yourselves.
A non grappler is never going to out grapple a grappler, so rather than using grappling techniques they need something else. Even if you do grapple to supplement your other skills you are never going to be as good as someone who only grapples (in the same way that they will never match a boxer for stand up striking).
OP
OP
OMG! Quick, take this down. Get someone to remove it ... immediately! Rener Gracie is saying that a big problem with BJJ is that the ring is different from the street. That can't be right. He said guys training for the ring have no consideration for a street fight, no consideration for punching. "Ridiculous drills that are not street applicable". Surely that can't be right. It is heresy!
"In sport you don't have to keep it real ... just grapple". Is that right? Surely not! "If people don't remember that sport is different from street .. it's not the same. People learning sport are being confused in thinking they are getting ready for a fight, but they are not. It's possible these days with sport in the BJJ world to get a purple belt or more, and go out in a fight and get beat up."
How can that be? :hmm:
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Yes but according to Hanzou if you have never kicked someone in the neck hard enough to break it you don't know it will work in real life. You and I know it will work. Hanzou isn't so sure.
In this specific case if it doesn't work. It doesnt matter. I won't cost you anything. But if you are counting on the guy dying. I would be hesitant.
So there is kind of two points to that debate.
OP
OP
I reckon there's a huge market for BJJ tee shirts. If you are wearing one absolutely no one would dare fight you and your opponent if you were attacked would immediately roll over and give up because nothing can beat a good grappler.He didn't say a grab, he said a strike.
Its about the worst thing you could do for several reasons. The main one being that the person you're striking in side control has a much more dominant position than you have, so if you start trying to punch him, he'll start punching you back, or he'll begin to apply nasty pressure tactics like jamming the blade of his forearm across your neck, adjusting his weight so he is compressing your chest, or smashing your head into the ground with his elbow.
If he is a submission grappler, he can easily apply arm locks or chokes once you start trying to punch. Your punch has next to no power backing it, so even if you hit his temple (which in of itself is a longshot), you have an incredibly low chance of knocking him out. And that's assuming that he hasn't trapped your arm at this point. Worse, if you're against a skilled grappler, he'll let you start punching, to make the trapping easier. Some of the nastiest chokes in side control comes from trapping the arm against your opponent's neck, and you trying to punch his temple makes that trap a lot easier.
This is why its curious that there are no anti-grappling vids for side control. Side control is a far more dominant position than the guard, and a lot more grapplers use it than just Bjj. Of course, given the laughable guard passing stuff, the absence of side control escapes doesn't surprise me. And if you think I'm giving grapplers too much credit, ask Steve, Tony, Drop, or Brian what its like to grapple against someone who has never grappled before. It's like they've fallen into an ocean and you're a shark.
The ironic thing about all of this is that there are comparatively simple ways to get out of side control using grappling. I don't know why you guys insist on making things hard for yourselves.
OP
OP
I wouldn't be relying on any one technique to win a fight. That is the premise of kata bunkai. If the first technique fails here is the next.
:asian:
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
There are a few options from there. In general it is good to fire a combination of techniques at a guy until one sticks.
He went the wrong way inside guard though. That was super high risk.
OP
OP
In future, please pay attention. I order you to write one hundred lines as your punishment.
:s132:
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Actually this will lead on from the bear strike to the temple escape. Now if you fire that one off and it does nothing you are still trapped in side control.so if you are relying on that. Would say make bloody sure you can knock dudes out before you rely on that as your side control defence.
Otherwise you need a proven side control escape.
But if you are in side control and are smacking them in the head with bear knuckle. Who cares? If it doesn't work you still have him trapped. And I am sure you will figure something out eventually.
Rener was referring to those BJJ folks who only train for sport grappling tournaments, as opposed to those who train BJJ for street self-defense or MMA. The latter group train extensively for handling punches, the former do not. (To be fair, an advanced BJJ competitor who only trains for grappling tournaments can still be dangerous, just as a wrestler or boxer or judoka can, however they have some important gaps in their self-defense preparation.)
BTW - I don't think any of the BJJ folks on this board are primarily oriented towards grappling competition.
I was hoping for a spanking.
drop bear
Sr. Grandmaster
Just to be clear, you are advocating that the person on the bottom of side control defend by punching to the temple and neck (using the specialized fist formations you mentioned)?
Yeah, Hanzou is right on this one, bad idea. I'll make the same offer I did regarding punching the groin from bottom of mount. If anyone wants to stop by 4 Seasons MMA in Lexington, KY and start under my side mount, you are welcome to punch me as hard as you like, wherever you like, with whatever fist formation you like from that position and see where it get you.
(RTKDCMB - I realize that's an impractically long trip for you to make. Maybe you can find someone in your neck of the woods who will let you give it a try.)
Before you ask - yes, I have been hit in the temple and the neck before. Remember that I have plenty of full-contact sparring experience.
And no, it's not that I think BJJ is better than any other martial art. I just know that position well enough to know what works from there and what doesn't.
OP
OP
Mate, the tongue was firmly in the cheek with my post. I have absolute respect for good BJJ, and for good practitioners across the board. We all have our limitations and we all have our strengths. The secret is to know our limitations.
:asian:
OP
OP
Mmm! OK, Tez is in the UK. I'll see what I can arrange.
Sprawls.
Best punishment ever.
A bit like a burpee.
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