A Brief History of Taekwon-Do by General Choi

[puunui]

Fantastic. Do you have his lost mokuroku? I've seen a picture of Gen. Choi at the Shotokan. But not his dan certificates. Pax, Chris

He was never given any scrolls from Takeda Sensei. And that picture isn't of the Shotokan.

 

[chrispillertkd]

He was never given any scrolls from Takeda Sensei.

I'm sure he told you that

And that picture isn't of the Shotokan.

Did you ask Dr. Kimm why he misidentified it, then?

Pax,

Chris

 

[puunui]

I'm sure he told you that

Never spoke to GM Choi. But he's not listed in the books either. Those things were for paying students. Takeda Sensei's son I don't believe is listed in the books nor did he receive any scrolls either. Have you actually studied Hapkido, or is your experience limited to what is shown in General Choi's books?

Did you ask Dr. Kimm why he misidentified it, then?

Never spoke to Dr. Kimm about that photo. But there are lots of photos of the Shotokan from that era. That looks more like a high school class picture more than a shot of students at the Shotokan.

 

[chrispillertkd]

Never spoke to GM Choi.

Oh, I meant Takeda Sensei :lol:

Never spoke to Dr. Kimm about that photo. But there are lots of photos of the Shotokan from that era. That looks more like a high school class picture more than a shot of students at the Shotokan.

Maybe you should ask him about it next time you chat.

But oddly, in your previous post you said it wasn't the Shotokan. Now you're saying it "looks" like a high school class picture "more than" a picture taken in the Shotokan. I thought you knew.

Of course, Gen. Choi was finishing high school when he first went to Japan before he was able to enter college but that's obviously irrelevant :lol:

And of course it looks like a group of younger students (although high school or college I couldn't say). The issue was what building it was in, no?

Pax,

Chris

 

[puunui]

But oddly, in your previous post you said it wasn't the Shotokan. Now you're saying it "looks" like a high school class picture "more than" a picture taken in the Shotokan. I thought you knew.

I think it is a reading comprehension issue. Try reading it again and maybe again. Every time I see your name on a post, I keep hoping I am going to read something that shows original effort, or personal experience, or something, anything, that came from you, instead of someone else. I guess I have to wait a little longer. The ten fold thing really does serve as a bright line between the haves and have nots. I can instantly tell which side of the line people fall on just by reading their posts. And I think everyone else can see it too, now that it has been pointed out to them.

 

[chrispillertkd]

I think it is a reading comprehension issue. Try reading it again and maybe again.

:lol: If you say so, brother. Frankly, I have noticed that your posts aren't exactly marked by good prose. Reading your stuff is a bit like reading someone who has nothing better to do than tell people who awesome they are :lol:

Every time I see your name on a post, I keep hoping I am going to read something that shows original effort, or personal experience, or something, anything, that came from you, instead of someone else.

Oh, I sure that's exactly what you hope for when you read my posts, Glenn :lol:

Of course if you bothered to actually read my posts you'd see that stuff :lol:

I guess I have to wait a little longer. The ten fold thing really does serve as a bright line between the haves and have nots. I can instantly tell which side of the line people fall on just by reading their posts. And I think everyone else can see it too, now that it has been pointed out to them.

Wow, it must be awesome to be as awesome as you are, Glenn. Maybe one day the rest of us will be able to judge the kind of people others are simply based on some posts they make on an internet forum :lol:

I think, however, the most awesome thing about you is that you can type the kind of things in your posts such as the one to which I'm replying and apparently take them seriously (and expect others to do so, as well) :lol:

Pax frater,

Chris

 

[puunui]

:lol: If you say so, brother. Frankly, I have noticed that your posts aren't exactly marked by good prose. Reading your stuff is a bit like reading someone who has nothing better to do than tell people who awesome they are :lol:

If that's how you comprehend my posts, then frankly that is your problem.

Oh, I sure that's exactly what you hope for when you read my posts, Glenn :lol: Of course if you bothered to actually read my posts you'd see that stuff :lol:

I do try to read your posts. But I also have to admit that I often times don't finish.

Wow, it must be awesome to be as awesome as you are, Glenn. Maybe one day the rest of us will be able to judge the kind of people others are simply based on some posts they make on an internet forum :lol:

I don't know about all of that, but I do think people can see the difference between my posts and yours.

I think, however, the most awesome thing about you is that you can type the kind of things in your posts such as the one to which I'm replying and apparently take them seriously (and expect others to do so, as well) :lol: Pax frater,
Chris

Ok, note to self, don't take chrispillertkd's posts seriously. Got it kid.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

If you two want to get personal, take it to PM please.

Daniel

 

[puunui]

If you two want to get personal, take it to PM please.
Daniel

It's not personal for me, but it's obviously personal for him. One question for you though, who have you learned more from, chris or I? Because to me, that's what it should really be about, learning.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

It's not personal for me, but it's obviously personal for him. One question for you though, who have you learned more from, chris or I? Because to me, that's what it should really be about, learning.

Its personal when your post is a critique of Chris and his is one of you. Whether or not either of you take it personally is another matter.

While I very much appreciate your insights, I make it a practice to avoid directly comparing the overall value of one site member's posts to those of another site member.

Daniel

 

[dancingalone]

<shrugs> The moderators are obviously giving both gentlemen some leeway. I'm sure they'll step in when they feel it necessary.

 

[puunui]

While I very much appreciate your insights, I make it a practice to avoid directly comparing the overall value of one site member's posts to those of another site member.

That's good answer.

 

[chrispillertkd]

If that's how you comprehend my posts, then frankly that is your problem.

It's not really a problem, Glenn. It's a simple matter of reading your posts. Oh, you have some interesting things to say about KKW Taekwon-Do, sure. But you certainly have lots of things to say about yourself too :lol:

I do try to read your posts. But I also have to admit that I often times don't finish.

I'm sure you don't Why would you want to form a judgement about something that you've actually read?

I don't know about all of that, but I do think people can see the difference between my posts and yours.

Of this I have little doubt :lol:

Ok, note to self, don't take chrispillertkd's posts seriously. Got it kid.

:lol: Hey, that's fair enough. I don't take anything youwrite seriously :lol: And thanks for callingme kid. It's been twenty years since I've been called that :lol: Of course that was by people who actually know me and not by people who "can instantly tell which side of the line people fall on just by reading their posts" :lol:

Pax frater,

Chris

 

[chrispillertkd]

It's not personal for me, but it's obviously personal for him.

:lol: No, not really. I find you amusing more than anything, Glenn. That hardly qualifies as me taking anything you post "personally" :lol:

Pax brother,

Chris

 

[bluewaveschool]

Hey, we've made it a page and a half without some KarateMom/Puunui bickering. Got to be some kind of record.

 

[puunui]

Hey, we've made it a page and a half without some KarateMom/Puunui bickering. Got to be some kind of record.

Seems chrispillertkd has taken up the baton on that one. Someone told me the issue seemed to be jealousy, and someone else said it was more envy. Personally, I think it is envy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Envy

 

[chrispillertkd]

:lol:

Pax,

Chris

 

[d1jinx]

You know, a while back we had some nice discussions with the Author of A Killing Art...

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85330&highlight=Alex+Gillis

He is/was a member of MT... perhaps someone could entice him to hear his side and perspective... again...

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=68516&highlight=Alex+Gillis

EVERYBODY COMES TO MT!

http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/member.php?u=19785

 

[KarateMomUSA]

Actually there is no real proof of his Taekkyon connection. In fact there is supposedly a recording of him stating he never learned it or someone high up in the Taekkyon food chain saying he never learned. it. As for his Karate it is still speculative in some circles to what rank he received overall.

Yes there is no real proof of anyone's connection to Taek Kyon. It was a folk game that had all but disappeared in Korea. It means push shoulder. The Taek Kyon Master that was made a human cultural asset by Korea for keeping this folk game alive stated that he couldn't even find 1 person that he could demonstrate with. The later Taek Kyon leaders that revitalized this Korean tradition went on record saying that no one from TKD consulted them & that they had not played a part in helping to create TKD, any form or style of TKD.
What we know about Taek Kyon comes only from south Korea, post 1945. North Korea has went on record saying Gen Choi's calligraphy teacher whereabouts were unknown due to the Civil War.
Gen Choi was simply exposed to Taek Kyon by his calligraphy teacher. He incorporated the use of the legs in his original TKD, via "foot technique sparring".
There was also no independent verification of any of the Koreans who studies martial arts abroad & were involved with the TKD movement, except 2. However you rarely here about the others, just people ragging on Gen Choi. There is however independent verification that Gen Choi taught karate in Japan at a YMCA.

Grandmaster Hwang Kee & Gen Choi are often dogged by many, possibly because they did not unify into the KKW. Their training history is often called into question. It is a double standard, but regardless, as what they accomplished was truly amazing & appreciated by so many more that try to detract from them.
History will set the record straight.

 

[KarateMomUSA]

Quote: Originally Posted by bluewaveschool
Hey, we've made it a page and a half without some KarateMom/Puunui bickering. Got to be some kind of record.

Seems chrispillertkd has taken up the baton on that one. Someone told me the issue seemed to be jealousy, and someone else said it was more envy. Personally, I think it is envy.

I am sorry as I don't look at these exchanges as "bickering", nor have I posted anything negative or attacked anyone in any way. I will not get personal & I will continue to post with courtesy.
I am disappointed however that the tones of some posts are not fitting with the martial art spirit.
I also remain open minded & wish more would. I am not on any side, but am simply looking to learn more. I have come to understand that a mind is like a parachute, it works BEST when it is OPEN!