Would you train under a fat and out of shape JKD guy

[Joab]

I don't think it matters at all. He can still be a good teacher even if he is out of shape. We all have our problems.

 

[chinaboxer]

"Would you train under a fat and out of shape JKD guy?"

heck yeah! then i would finally have someone else who would appreciate all you can eat Korean BBQ after training as much as i do!

 

[Gordon Nore]

Sammo Hung had a great tag line in the short-lived TV series Martial Law. He used to say, "I'm not out of shape, just fat." Hung proved that to be the case in every action scene.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Is this for personal training? i.e. work out.

Is this for competition?

Is this for Self Defense?

If for competition, then training with people in teh same weigth class is good. Sometimes a weight class bigger is good as well. But 120 to 140 lbs guys usually do not train competition with 300 lb guys.

But for self defense, I would think people should train with all shapes and sizes and skill sets for their own defense. If someone significantly large in length and width than you gets on top of you and just has to lay there to physically prohibit you from moving and or breathing then one needs to be aware of this and what options if any do they have.

But these are specifics and may not be what you want 100% of the time.

Find an isntructor who teaches in a style you can understand and learn from. Some people learn from hearing, others from watching parallel and others in mirror, while other need to feel it and others need to have it done to them and or do it to others. Some need to hear it three or four times and some need to do it or have it done numerous times, et al.

 

[David43515]

Since my training goals are just self defense, heck yeah I`d train with a fat teacher. I`m a fat bastard. I`ve been a teacher. I`ve bounced professionally. And I sparred regularly.

I`ll be the first to admit I don`t have the wind to spar nonstop for a couple hours the way a competative boxer does. But real fights don`t last a couple hours. I`ve got more wind than the collage weightroom nuts that used to come to the bar. Most of them thought smoking 2 packs a day made them grown ups.

Don`t make the mistake of automatically assuming fat = lazy,slow,unintelligant, or incompetant. Yang Cheng Fu became grossly overweight as he got older. And he was still beating China`s top fighters in challenge matches. There`s a reason flyweights don`t knock out heayweights.

 

[Laoshi77]

Sammo Hung had a great tag line in the short-lived TV series Martial Law. He used to say, "I'm not out of shape, just fat." Hung proved that to be the case in every action scene.

Sammo also said: "I may look like an elephant, but I move like a monkey".

If the JKD guy can teach and fight well then that is all that matters.

I've studied with people in China who we might suggest are fat but on close inspection are actualy solid and could bounce you around with very little movement at all. Of course I'm talking highly skilled Taijiquan and Qigong people here; to judge a person by how they look is an example of the world we live in. We are often too inclined to think about things from a material perspective.

 

[sfs982000]

I'm sorry everyone, fat is a bad choice of words. I really was thinking grossly out of shape.

Well as the old saying goes "never judge a book by it's cover". Besides round is a shape

 

[James Kovacich]

True. That reminds me of a (American) guy a I used to work with. He said something like. I wouldn't go to a martial art school not run by an Asian because evryone else is faking it.

 

[David43515]

Ask you friend if he eats pizza that`s not made by Italians or buys coffee made by anyone other than Turks or Columbians. He`s an idiot.

 

[blindsage]

I used to train in Kyokushin with a guy who was a brown belt when I started. He was pretty fat. Not he's a big guy with a little extra around the middle but in pretty good shape fat, but wow he's round fat. And it was not because he was inactive, but because of genetics. He regularly taught and sparred. He also had some of the best defensive technique I've ever come across. He was extraordinarily difficult to hit in full contact sparring. I might not train with every fat guy I came across, but I would train under him.

My current sifu talks about his sifu being pretty round in the middle. He also talks about it being solid, and given the quality of what my sifu learned from him, I wish I had been around before he died regardless of his stomach size.

Quality is quality regardless of size and shape. If you think you have to look like Bruce or a fitness model to either be in good shape, or be able to fight, you have a hard lesson coming. I hope there's video.

 

[James Kovacich]

While doing BJJ several years back. There was a huge (maybe 280-300lb.) guy inour class who worked construction and didn't take a shower befrore class.

WOW! Sorry about off topic, but nobody wanted to roll with him.

 

[Jimi]

I know this example is not of a JKD practioner or instructor, but think about this. K-1 Champ Mark Hunt is a heavy weight that if not seen in the ring as a fighter and if you were to see him on the street not knowing who he is as a fighter, many would consider him fat, out of shape and yet he bangs out in full contact. Us Super HeavyWeights carry a lot of power with the extra mass. I know when sparring in the past, even w/ a beer gut, I turn my waist over for a power (Thai, Burmese) low round kick to the thigh I uproot even HeavyWeights.

I guess I would not agree that simply because an Instructor is Large, Fat, Over Weight, he can not nor doesn't have the right to teach or instruct. Super Heavy Weights can fight too, thats why we have our own division. Divisions of fighting or instruction should not be decided by physec(sp?) alone.

Not every Martial Artist will be as fit as Bruce Lee, Billy Banks or Jean Claude. Fitness is not always funcational depending on the individual, I have seen men who are very Gym fit, sculpted, hairless, lol, oiled up and pumped but could not fight their way out of a wet paper bag.



But, I do agree that anyone instructing who is grossly out of shape will have difficulty getting any cred even w/ a youth full of fighting experience. I would not want to train under a JKD Instructor who was grossly out of shape although if he had good knowledge, principle, and skill to offer I could reconsider, but on the same token, I would like to learn to cook from a grossly out of shape chef. LOL. Kidding.

If all coaches/instructors were to be tossed out due to current (aged or health issues) shape, many great coaches would never have helped others. I believe someone mentioned Cus earlier. Ok, old fat man, step aside for the fit young 22yo, he is the head trainer now, lol. That is why there is the generalization of youth in fighting and age in coaching, and it is true, if a coach gets results, then being out of shape is acceptable to an extent. No you are too fat to fight or coach, it is all light weights here, move along big boy.

James, I think I am w/ you on this, your restating the issue as GROSSLY OUT OF SHAPE is a bit different then just heavy, or (LOL) big boned.

 

[turbo1975]

Sammo Hung had a great tag line in the short-lived TV series Martial Law. He used to say, "I'm not out of shape, just fat." Hung proved that to be the case in every action scene.

He proved that he could act not Spar w/resistance or fight! Totally not the same thing.

 

[ap Oweyn]

He proved that he could act not Spar w/resistance or fight! Totally not the same thing.

But there are successful fat fighters.

 

[James Kovacich]

This isn't one of them.

 

[Steve Grody]

When one of Dan Inosanto's friends said he shouldn't study with so-and-so (who Dan thought had interesting material) because Dan could surely kick his butt, Dan said "Well, that's like saying I shouldn't talk to Angleo Dundee, Ali's trainer because he's a old guy now and surely I could kick his butt!" So indeed, if the guy can give you good training in some regard, that's all that matters.

stevegrody.com

 

[dungeonworks]

When one of Dan Inosanto's friends said he shouldn't study with so-and-so (who Dan thought had interesting material) because Dan could surely kick his butt, Dan said "Well, that's like saying I shouldn't talk to Angleo Dundee, Ali's trainer because he's a old guy now and surely I could kick his butt!" So indeed, if the guy can give you good training in some regard, that's all that matters.

stevegrody.com

Good point and I agree!

 

[Drac]

Fat does not always equal out of shape. There are a lot of fat people out there who are incredibly muscular and who have amazing cardio and endurance. Although I myself am fat (and my cardio needs improvement), my muscular development and strength is exceptional, and I am a fast and lethal striker.

Of course, there are also lots of fat peope who are, indeed, out of shape. But the two are not mutually exclusive.

I remember when I first showed up to teach in the police academy..A couple of the younger and more muscular cadets doubted the fat grey haried cops teaching abilities, until they got slammed when they attemped to get fancy..It drove home a valuable lesson to NEVER under estimate anyone..

 

[sgtmac_46]

Wouldn't it kind of go against some of what JKD represents?

I don't know......i'm of a mixed opinion.....someone made a point in another thread that lots of winning Wrestling and Football coaches are out of shape and fat.......does that mean that can't impart champion skills on to their players? Obviously not!

I think when we look for a teacher, we should be looking on whether he can make US better.........

 

[sgtmac_46]

When one of Dan Inosanto's friends said he shouldn't study with so-and-so (who Dan thought had interesting material) because Dan could surely kick his butt, Dan said "Well, that's like saying I shouldn't talk to Angleo Dundee, Ali's trainer because he's a old guy now and surely I could kick his butt!" So indeed, if the guy can give you good training in some regard, that's all that matters.

stevegrody.com

Yeah, see that's exactly the thing.......only in TMA's do expect teachers and coaches to be able to do EXACTLY what they can get us to do.

In wrestling and boxing we accept that trainers and coaches are old and out of shape.......and yet those same coaches can impart ASTOUNDING skills on their charges.