Why Kids Get Bullied?

[MA-Caver]

Studies Reveal Why Kids Get Bullied and Rejected

Kids who get bullied and snubbed by peers may be more likely to have problems in other parts of their lives, past studies have shown. And now researchers have found at least three factors in a child's behavior that can lead to social rejection.
The factors involve a child's inability to pick up on and respond to nonverbal cues from their pals.
In the United States, 10 to 13 percent of school-age kids experience some form of rejection by their peers. In addition to causing mental health problems, bullying and social isolation can increase the likelihood a child will get poor grades, drop out of school, or develop substance abuse problems, the researchers say.
Rest of the article (worth reading) :http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience...nce/studiesrevealwhykidsgetbulliedandrejected

Growing up I was bullied a lot. Skinny white kid with nerdy glasses because he loved to read more than he liked to play sports. Going to school on a day to day basis was a trial in-of-itself... particularly when the current bully points at you and says "I'll get you tomorrow" and says it with such conviction that one would have preferred to break their own leg so to get OUT of going the next day. Yet later on found out that it was just idle threats... sometimes.
I don't know about the study's findings on misreading body language cues as being accurate. In my own experience living in a home where non-verbal language was the norm (deaf parents), I caught on to potential threats more often than my nerd counterparts did... (remember back in my day GEEKS were called NERDS).
The long term affects I would have to agree with because I did and still do experience the ones listed at one time or another or to some degree or another.
What helped me of course was the study of MA... at the time ANY MA I could learn, just so to keep those bastards away from me or at least attempt to give them what they were trying to give me. Fighting back at least has helped my own self-confidence and self-esteem from being totally blasted to the far regions of the galaxy (see, told you I was a nerd). Also what helped was escape into the books and movies I so loved.

The article also goes on to say...

When children have prolonged struggles with socializing, "a vicious cycle begins," Lavoie said. Shunned children have few opportunities to practice social skills, while popular kids are busy perfecting theirs. However, having just one or two friends can be enough to give a child the social practice he or she needs, he said.
Parents, teachers and other adults in a child's life can help, too. Instead of reacting with anger or embarrassment to a child who, say, asks Aunt Mindy if her new hairdo was a mistake, parents should teach social skills with the same tone they use for teaching long division or proper hygiene. If presented as a learning opportunity, rather than a punishment, children usually appreciate the lesson.
"Most kids are so desperate to have friends, they just jump on board," Lavoie said.

I was likewise one of those "last to be picked" or not even considered at all types. I learned to deal with that by learning to enjoy my own company and having just a very small circle or clique of friends to hang out with. This quasi-isolationism did help me hone certain other skills and helped my own drive to be really good at whatever it is that I chose to do.
I do wish at times that my older brother who was a social king and had lots of friends and all that had included me into his own activities so I could at least learn more of the gregarious type of social skills than the interpersonal one-on-one type skills that I have now.

Each child is different I think and know that a lot will agree here. What a study of 4800 students may not always apply to a single kid. Of course studies like this do help a better understanding of possible causes and/or solutions to a child's erratic behavior. They would have to be individually tailored to the child by the parents and teachers/counselors.

Reading this article brought to mind of certain comedians who lament how children are reared today. One in particular (Carlos Mencia) talks about how if you got in trouble in school "back then" the parent would ask one question... "What did you do?" in a tone that indicated that it was their fault. He goes on to say that now parents will raise hell about a bus-driver kicking a kid off the bus for being unruly or a teacher sending a kid home early for fighting or giving a low grade because he didn't study the night before, etc etc. It spoils the kid(s) and makes them less than what they COULD be.
I think that is something I could agree with. The times that I got sent home from school or whatever... my dad would ask that same question..."what did you do?" When I explained he pointed out my faux pas and not the other kid/teacher/adult.

I think that kids learning how to deal with bullies and how to prevent further bullying should be addressed more than the whys and wherefores they're being picked on. It's one of the reasons why I'm a strong advocate of MA-training for kids so that they can at least have the confidence to stand up to the O'Doyles in the worlds.

Thoughts? Comments?

 

[Marginal]

So it was your fault you got bullied?

 

[Gordon Nore]

Interesting read, Caver. I will have to look into the article and its sources later, but thanks. It's of interest to me as an elementary teacher, but I can relate to the life-long affects of being bullied, something that I didn't realize until I was into my forties.

 

[Carol]

Heck, I still run in to issues with not being able to pick up on nonverbal or (sometimes worse) indirect cues. I don't run in to this professionally because I have to be precise in my communications others, and others generally have to be precise with me.

Outside of work though, I've had a few tense moments with my friends or my former husband that usually ends up with me asking "Can't you just tell me xxxx specifically?"

 

[seasoned]

So it was your fault you got bullied?

As a former "I got bullied myself guy" yes sometimes it is our fault, and other times we just get caught up in a period of time, and become a target by kids with big problems. The big thing I learned after adulthood was the ones that got bullied had no where to go but up, while the hard core bullies had no where to go but down.

 

[Jenny_in_Chico]

I was socially marginalized as a kid. My parents divorced when I was 6, my mom remarried when I was 8, and there were 4 moves during that time that put me into new schools. I was introverted, preferred reading to socializing, and I was clearly more intelligent than the other kids and also was clearly uninterested in pleasing them or my teachers. I had few social skills, and was bullied a bit until I purposely cultivated a persona of aggression around age 12, by hanging out with the stoners and metal heads. I didn't turn into ME until grad school, where I finally came into my own and blossomed like a flower. I attribute the personality change to my experience in teaching as a grad student...I'm a really good teacher, I enjoy it, and I found that when I was the center of attention and holding forth about a subject in which I was an expert, my confidence grew tremendously. Also, something that Ralph said made me consider this second source of social skills...but I studied chimp and gorilla social behavior for 5 years as an undergrad and then for my MS degree, and learning to read body language and non-verbal cues from great apes is a really good foundation for learning to read human behavioral cues.

 

[searcher]

I was one of the guys who got bullied and most of the time it was my fault. I hated getting picked on, so I started training. Then the 2-3 bullies became 4-5+ depending on how well I handled myself. I have to admit that if it weren't for the bullies, I would not have worked as hard on being able to defend myself. I owe them a ton.

I really wanted to get back at them, but they have done themselves in. Most of them are ate up on drugs and at least 1 died here a few years back. I see them around once in a while and I can tell you that I could care less about getting back at them. I feel like I am at a level to where they would stand no chance against me. So I choose to be me and not become the bully.

 

[jks9199]

Let's see...

Kids who don't fit in and have trouble relating to their peers get bullied.

Shocking discovery. I bet people who climb tall things fall down and get hurt more often.

Anyone wanna bet that bullies are also kids who have trouble fitting in and relating, too... and express it by beating up on others?

There are basically three ways I see for folks who don't relate well. A few become comfortable being themselves, and march to their own beat. (Interestingly, when you think of a lot of standouts in various fields... you see some of these traits.) A lot find a way to disappear -- if they aren't getting bullied. Others simply attack anyone that seems vulnerable...

Note that this is different than the almost herd-like way a group can turn on someone who seems different or doesn't fit in. While some would classify that as bullying, I think the dynamic is different enough to separate them.

 

[Blade96]

This issue speaks to me loudly and personally and I will write why. First of all, i dont even know why i was bullied. I didnt suck at sports, (except tennis in fact people liked it when i was the soccer goalie for example because it was hard to get the ball past me lol) i was a pretty good student at school, I was bright and well read, and I loved hockey. I also wasnt an ugly looking person like medusa or anything. or had a disability anyone would make fun of.

I'm a victim of bullying. formost of my life i was called everything in the book by students and teachers as well. I was isolated, shoved out in special ed classrooms, called a cri du chat child, retarded, autistic, a fetal alcohol syndrom person (that was said about me at university) and I have suffered every possible form of abuse you can think of short of actual rape. well I guess you could say i was raped figuratively if not literaly. I didnt have friends (i still have trouble making them ) and no one stood up for me. I tried to commit suicide several times. I didnt complete high school because i quit to avoid the abuse. I had nightmares, I cried all the time, I literally lived a life of fear and hate. Its where I learned hate. and how to hate.

I still suffer socially. I cant really date or get a lot of friends. Do one know how hard it is to have no one to love, and no one who loves you? and family who you cant talk to about it they just say 'get over it' To this day I dont like myself and see myself as unlikable because I have trouble making friends.

I dont think bullying is talked about enough in society and taken as seriously as it should be. Bullies have an incredible amount of power, and people cant deal with that on their own. (ask a survivor of domestic violence. Thats a type of bully who does it to his/her partner.)

It is a sad that kids cant go to school and feel safe, where the only things they have to worry about ia hating math class and finding a date for the prom. Kids should have to worry about those normal teenage things and not feel afraid. I had none of those things. I lived in a world where you could go to school and never come home again. (Reena Virk comes to mind) Actually had a teenager who threatened to fire a rifle at me. Another one tried to set me on fire with a cigarette lighter.

It is a basic democratic right to feel safe in school and when this happens its a violation of people's rights. It is persecution.

I have a university degree though now. and i train in the MA. But honestly the only time I really feel happy with life is when i'm at my Shotokan dojo.

I dont believe its anyone's fault their rights got violated in such a persecuting way. I attended a rally some years ago led by a womna wh's teen got beat up by bullies and all you could see was his red eye (he got beat up so bad the blood pooled behind his eye and made his eye turned red) I went up to him and gave him hugs. It wasnt his fault he got beat up.

Unfortunately blaming the victim is all too common in our ridiculous society.

and you know what? when people say you have to love yourself before you can learn how to love others I say well its pretty hard to give a damn about yourself when nobody has ever given two damns about you. and thats how its pretty much been for me in life.

 

[Bruno@MT]

Interesting discussion. I had some issues as a kid as well, but never got really beaten up. Looking back, I realized that most of my problems were caused by me not having a clue, which was partially because I was being overprotected, and partially because I was a natural born nerd

Anyway...
Just this weekend I went snowboarding, and when we arrived at the resort, we had to wait an hour because the lift was out of service. While we were waiting, people kept coming in so pretty rapidly the place was packed, and ther were various groups of kids there as well.

The group near me were pretty loud and obnoxious. They were also picking on the lowest individual on the totempole, shoving him, annoying him, and hitting him against his ski helmet. Most of the bystanders were annoyed as well.

At a certain moment they kept hitting him hard so when the biggest of the pack wanted to hit him again, I grabbed his shoulder, pulled him back and told him to calm down, which he did somewhat. The group still kept bullying the guy though. I did not intervene anymore at that point for the following reasons:

1) the kid was there by his own choice, hanging with that group of kids (there were other groups from the same school or whatever). He should learn that choosing the wrong friends is stupid and he'll never get accepted anyway. I had to learn the same lesson in my youth, and the kid has to figure it out as well.
2) they weren't really hurting him at that point so it wasn't strictly necessary. He should learn that if he doesn't stand up for himself or leave, his situation is not going to improve.
3) if I broke it up for him, the humiliation for him would be bigger, and there is a chance it would be worse afterwards (I have known this to be the case).

The 2 biggest aholes were standing near me and my wife though, and I placed myself deliberatly between them and her. I had just traveled 12 hours through the night in a bus, with very little sleep, and I hadn't had coffee yet. I was in the rare state that my wife calls 'grumpy'. When they shoved against me I could ignore it. Had they shoved my wife... the results would have been rather unpleasant for all involved including me.

 

[Bruno@MT]

Unfortunately blaming the victim is all too common in our ridiculous society.

and you know what? when people say you have to love yourself before you can learn how to love others I say well its pretty hard to give a damn about yourself when nobody has ever given two damns about you. and thats how its pretty much been for me in life.

I have been bullied myself (though not nearly as bad as you). While the bullies were the ones to blame, they chose me as the victim because I did not understand the social cues and did not know the 'laws of the jungle'.
In fact, at a certain point someone came along who was even dorkier than me. This increased my relative position enough that I was generally left alone.

It took me a lot of time but eventually I learned how to interpret body language and non verbal communication and that helped immensely.

 

[Blade96]

Reena Virk apparently was also blamed for her murder and bullying. From Wiki:

"The best-selling book about the case, "Under the Bridge" by Rebecca Godfrey, details some of the motives that may have led to Virk's death. Two of the girls convicted in the initial beating allege that Virk stole a phone book from Nicole Cook and started calling Cook's friends and spreading rumors about her. Cook stubbed out a cigarette on Virk's forehead during the attack. Another girl, M.G.P, was allegedly angry with Virk for stealing her boyfriend. Virk once lived with the two girls in a youth group home. It is suggested she may have done those things in order to assert herself as "tough."

I'd like some of you who blame victims to go up to a domestic violence survivor and say this to their faces that they're reponsible for their bullies actions.

victims dont stand up for themselves because they CAN'T. In my case I was physically small, my bully was big and tough and usually surrounded by his followers, wheras I was isolated and had no friends around. As for walking away, I couldnt do that either, as I was always stalked by them. I didnt understand a lot of social cues either. Am I to blame because i couldnt walk away or stand up for myself or simply cause i had less social skills than my peers?

 

[Bruno@MT]

I hope that was not @me. I don't blame the victims. I was one myself ok? I know what it feels like to be in that place and I feel I know what I am talking about. I was small too. I didn't hit puberty until I was 13 and I was the smallest kid in the class, girls included. I didn't start growing until my 4th year in high school.
ll repeat it again: the victims are not to blame.

I was only pointing out that
a) victims get picked by the bullies because of certain traits, like being helpless and not fitting in.
b) victims can stop being victims if they understand the reasons they got picked on and change those traits.

Ok put it like this: suppose there is a sniper in the city who shoots people at random, like a couple of years ago. Now suppose for some reason he only shoots at people wearing red shirts. If you wear a red shirt and get shot, then it is really not your fault. It's the sniper's fault. He is an ******* and HE is to blame and it is really not your fault and you didn't deserve this. However, if you understand that you get shot at for wearing a red shirt you can wear a green shirt and be safe. That does NOT mean the shooter is in the right, it just means that you will not be the one he's shooting at.

Or as my mother said when I was learning to drive a car: whether the big truck has right of way or not does not matter. If you get under the wheels you are dead. Sure the truck driver will be blamed afterwards but that won't do you any good. So don't ever assert your right of way unless you know for sure noone will drive into you.

 

[seasoned]

This issue speaks to me loudly and personally and I will write why. First of all, i dont even know why i was bullied. I didnt suck at sports, (except tennis in fact people liked it when i was the soccer goalie for example because it was hard to get the ball past me lol) i was a pretty good student at school, I was bright and well read, and I loved hockey. I also wasnt an ugly looking person like medusa or anything. or had a disability anyone would make fun of.

I'm a victim of bullying. formost of my life i was called everything in the book by students and teachers as well. I was isolated, shoved out in special ed classrooms, called a cri du chat child, retarded, autistic, a fetal alcohol syndrom person (that was said about me at university) and I have suffered every possible form of abuse you can think of short of actual rape. well I guess you could say i was raped figuratively if not literaly. I didnt have friends (i still have trouble making them ) and no one stood up for me. I tried to commit suicide several times. I didnt complete high school because i quit to avoid the abuse. I had nightmares, I cried all the time, I literally lived a life of fear and hate. Its where I learned hate. and how to hate.

I still suffer socially. I cant really date or get a lot of friends. Do one know how hard it is to have no one to love, and no one who loves you? and family who you cant talk to about it they just say 'get over it' To this day I dont like myself and see myself as unlikable because I have trouble making friends.

I dont think bullying is talked about enough in society and taken as seriously as it should be. Bullies have an incredible amount of power, and people cant deal with that on their own. (ask a survivor of domestic violence. Thats a type of bully who does it to his/her partner.)

It is a sad that kids cant go to school and feel safe, where the only things they have to worry about ia hating math class and finding a date for the prom. Kids should have to worry about those normal teenage things and not feel afraid. I had none of those things. I lived in a world where you could go to school and never come home again. (Reena Virk comes to mind) Actually had a teenager who threatened to fire a rifle at me. Another one tried to set me on fire with a cigarette lighter.

It is a basic democratic right to feel safe in school and when this happens its a violation of people's rights. It is persecution.

I have a university degree though now. and i train in the MA. But honestly the only time I really feel happy with life is when i'm at my Shotokan dojo.

I dont believe its anyone's fault their rights got violated in such a persecuting way. I attended a rally some years ago led by a womna wh's teen got beat up by bullies and all you could see was his red eye (he got beat up so bad the blood pooled behind his eye and made his eye turned red) I went up to him and gave him hugs. It wasnt his fault he got beat up.

Unfortunately blaming the victim is all too common in our ridiculous society.

and you know what? when people say you have to love yourself before you can learn how to love others I say well its pretty hard to give a damn about yourself when nobody has ever given two damns about you. and thats how its pretty much been for me in life.

Martial arts is not the cure all, but I found it to be very satisfying. It gave me much of what was missing while I was a kid. Although I didn't experience nearly as much as you while growing up, the things that happened still had a lasting effect into my adult years. The statement you made above is what I would like to address. All through my formative years, I cared more about what other people thought, and I work hard at trying to please them, then myself. It wasn't until I took a long hard look at life that I discovered that trying to please other people was a dead end road. Martial arts helped me to focus on myself, it helped me to look within. With the kata and sparing, I found that the better I got, the better I felt about myself. You have to build from within, and it begins with looking within, and this is the door that MA opened for me. Focus on yourself, get good in MA and as you start to give back to your follow students you will form the bond with people that eluded you as a kid and young adult. Some 40 years later I can say it worked for me, and might for you. I may not love everyone, but I can honesty say I like most people. The most important thing is, it took not giving a damm about what other people thought to bring me to the point in life where I understand myself and in turn understand others better.

 

[Omar B]

I moved around a lot as a kid because my parents divorced and the nature of their jobs involved a lot of travel. Hell, I went to 4 different high schools!

People's tried stuff with me all the time during the first week or so of school, usually I solved that with a sound thrashing and problem solved. Heck, my first day in a NY high school 3 guys tried to steal my watch when I was changing back from guy. 3 guys also went to the nurse that afternoon.

 

[Blade96]

I moved around a lot as a kid because my parents divorced and the nature of their jobs involved a lot of travel. Hell, I went to 4 different high schools!

People's tried stuff with me all the time during the first week or so of school, usually I solved that with a sound thrashing and problem solved. Heck, my first day in a NY high school 3 guys tried to steal my watch when I was changing back from guy. 3 guys also went to the nurse that afternoon.

I had to do that once. with a girl who was trying to bully me. (btw everyone called her vampire because she used to literally bite people.) In grade 8 or 9 it was, and she was giving me trouble on the school bus. She wasnt big or strong, and she didnt really have friends either. I beat the crap out of her. She never touched me again.

Sometimes I wish i could have done that with the male bullies. But I wasnt able to.

 

[Jade Tigress]

I read the article yesterday. Found it interesting but disagreed with the use of the term "bullied". The article seemed to describe what I think of as being shunned.

I think at some point in everyone's life they experience being shunned for some reason. Heck, you can have a group of teenage girls that are the best of friends and all of sudden you hear about one of them being shunned for no apparent reason.

Bullying is a bit different I think. A bully seeks a victim to pick on and typically continues to focus on said victims for a duration of time intending to cause fear. It goes beyond the getting picked last thing which is more like shunning.

My story is similar to Jenny's. My mom divorced and we moved every single year, more often than not right in the middle of the school year, which put me in new schools constantly. Friendships were already formed and I was always the new kid, never around long enough to form friendships.

So I was ostracized, but I don't recall ever actually being bullied, where someone threatened me. I wasn't pushed around in the halls, I didn't have books knocked off my desk, etc. It was more like I didn't exist.

Anyway, whether it's called bullying or shunning, the causes behind it is an interesting study. I think shunning is a more natural group response to those who fail to pick up on certain social cues, (though I was quite observant), and bullies have their own social inadequacies that they are compensating for by being a bully.

 

[Gordon Nore]

As a teacher, I see parents and kids struggle with issues that sometimes are bullying and sometimes are not. Bullying by nature is persistent. Virtually all children will at one time or another be a victim or perpetrator of mistreatment of others. Thus there is bullying behaviour -- whether it's shunning, physical abuse, name calling, etc. It's wrong behaviour, of course, but it's not necessarily bullying.

That's enormously complicated for a child to figure out. Kids will often express their frustrations in the most global terms. "They're all bullying me." or "He hates me." Sometimes -- make that, a lot of times -- it's a one-off incident, or a misunderstanding. From my perspective, as a teacher, I have to follow up on all of them, so that actual bullying doesn't slip through.

Additionally, it's very complicated for youngsters who get labeled as bystanders. Kids get mixed messages, sometimes being told not to get involved in other people's business, then castigated for witnessing bullying and not doing anything about it.

 

[Gordon Nore]

So I was ostracized, but I don't recall ever actually being bullied, where someone threatened me. I wasn't pushed around in the halls, I didn't have books knocked off my desk, etc. It was more like I didn't exist.

Anyway, whether it's called bullying or shunning, the causes behind it is an interesting study. I think shunning is a more natural group response to those who fail to pick up on certain social cues, (though I was quite observant), and bullies have their own social inadequacies that they are compensating for by being a bully.

Educators and psychologists tend to include shunning under the category of bullying. In my observation, girls socially alienate each other more so than boys. It's also a very effective device for manipulating or extorting their target. The classic example I ran into in middle school is one girl telling another, "Tell your email password. I won't tell anyone, I promise." The girl knows she shouldn't do it, but the fear of being alienated over-rides other fears of what might go wrong when personal information is shared.

I was bullied mostly in grades seven and eight -- that's another post in itself. There were times when I laughed or went along with it out of fear of being excluded, or in the hopes that it might abate if I didn't make waves.

A part of that experience that has remained with me are the relentlessly stupid things adults told me: "They're just jealous." "If you don't show signs of weakness, they'll respect you." I used to think, why would I want the respect of people who are so cowardly as to gang up to pick on someone?

 

[Jenny_in_Chico]

I was never bullied in school. My 2 experiences with bullying are:

1. When I was 8, I moved to a new neighborhood, and made friends with a girl. Her best friend was jealous, and would follow me around and threaten me. I was scared, and tried to avoid her. The girl I was friends with was a terrible friend, and would mentally bully me within our friendship (to the point of tears), which actually causes me shame today. I can't believe I was so desperate for friendship that I put up with it! After a few months I dropped her and became friends with the other girl (which is SUCH a little girl thing to do). Even though she was the initial aggressor, she was a much better friend than the first friend.

2. When I was 12, older high school girls targeted me and my best friend for aggression, but they never actually touched us. They would drive past, threaten us, spit at us, etc. Eventually they stopped. Now I wish that I had fought back, despite my fear, because in retrospect I think I could have taken them.

Interestingly, I was never bullied by boys, and I think that at that time in Texas (30 yrs ago) it was just not seen for boys to bully girls. Now is probably a different story.

From these experiences I learned a valuable lesson: the unpleasantness of fighting back or causing a scene is much to be preferred over the remembered shame of doing nothing.

"Cowards die many times before their deaths. The valiant never taste of death but once." from the play "Julius Caesar" by William Shakespeare.