Why do Japanese arts use the Japanese language?

[jobo]

The last loan was Discharged in 2006. Let's do the math; 2006-1945 = 61 years. Again, Wow, just wow.

yea 61 years to pay back the" help" and its maths

 

[Gerry Seymour]

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[_Simon_]

There. This is why we don’t discuss politics—outside of martial arts politics—on this forum. Let’s get back on topic guys!

Yep! Okay, let's see here...

Why do Japanese arts use Japanese language...

I'm pegging maybe Koreans had something to do with it.....

 

[Dong xiao hu]

Every capoeira school in which I trained uses a lot of Portuguese terminology, both for the techniques, and in discussing strategy and spirit in the practice.

Besides being a martial art Capoeira is considered a cultural art as well. While training Capoeira you will be exposed to other related Brazilian culture. Not to mention at this point you are expected to learn to speak some Portuguese. After all the songs are in Portuguese.

Sent from my moto g(6) (XT1925DL) using Tapatalk

 

[hoshin1600]

I hear you geezer.
@hoshin1600, that may be an impression left by some in the more recent generations but it certainly is not the mainstream culture in America. You, like many others have gotten sucked into believing everything you hear/read from the "news" mediums you choose to listen to.

Honestly, that comment is very insulting.

i guess you all missed the part where i said my comment was "tongue in cheek". which by definition means that you do not believe in what you are saying. it was an attempt at making light of a previous and now forgotten comment. it was meant to be humorous, but it fell flat on people too serious for their own good.
and for the record i dont hear/ read the "news" any news left or right, on any medium. i find it all absurd and gross.

 

[Urban Trekker]

Good question.

Let's look at boxing. It has roots in Greco-Roman times, but the techniques and the rules during those times have since been lost.

Boxing as we know it today originated in the UK. Does this mean that those who train in boxing outside of the Anglosphere use English words to refer to boxing terminology?

Frankly, it doesn't appear that the British care about "owning" the martial art as other countries do about owning theirs.

I'm kind of curious as to why that is.

 

[O'Malley]

Depends on the language and the term.

The English word "jab" is commonly used in other languages (at least the ones I know).

The French use the English term "uppercut" while the Italian use the native term "montante".

Both ditched "hook" and use native terms ("crochet" and "gancio").

In aikido, I find that Japanese terms provide a common reference for techniques and concepts, which helps with cross-language communication.

 

[Saheim]

You have not been around a lot of Wing Chun folk then, talk to them about any of the forms; first the names used will be Cantonese (Siu Nin Tau, Chum Kiu, Biu Ji, Muk Yan Jong.) and every single movement in each of the forms is only referred to in the Cantonese.

Seung Guan Sau
Seung Tan Sau
Lop Sau
Sam Pai Fut or Praying Thrice to the Buddha (Slow) Section:
Tan Sau, Huen Sau, Wu Sa
Fook Sau, Tan Sau, Huen Sau, Wu Sau (Repeat 3x)
Pak Sau, Jek Cheung

And I am talking about Native English speakers

Yea, I train in WC and do not even know the English word for half our techniques. Some of them, sure- slapping hand, grabbing hand but most of them I only know by their Cantonese names.

It is weird tho. I always wonder if there is a boxing school, in Asia somewhere, where they try to speak as much English as they can...... and do so as poorly as I pronounce things in Cantonese

 

[KenpoMaster805]

Japanese used Japanese term in a traditional okinawan like shotokan goyu ryu and other japanese arts. when i was taking shotokan we used japanese term to bad i only went to high orange.

When i was taekwondo we used korean term even counting in korean and i only went to yellow

 

[Xue Sheng]

While that may be true, any time I've seen someone discussing Wing Chun, they use English terms (or the video is shot entirely in Cantonese and intended for people who speak Cantonese).

Not been my experience. Virtually all the Wing Chun people I know, and most are American, use the Cantonese terminology; Taan Sau, Fuk Sau, Yee Jee Kim Yeung Ma, etc.

 

[Steve]

Id say for the same reason we use French terms when cooking. Mirepoix is a shorthand for onions, carrots, and celery. Course, you sub bell pepper for carrots, and you have the holy trinity of Cajun cuisine... which borrows heavily from French roots. Same technique, but the native term is more specific. Made a leek and potato soup tonight, using the same technique as above, but it was closer to a German suppengrun...except instead of carrots, leeks, and celery root, I used leeks, fennel root, and yellow onion.

same technique, though. Point is, if I say mirepoix, you know it’s onion, carrot, and celery. If it’s not those exact veggies, it’s not mirepoix. Though if you and I both know what a mirepoix is, I can say, “like mirepoix, but with x instead of y.” And we are both on the same page. You could duplicate what I did no problem.

personally, I don’t have a problem with vocabulary. I do have issues with concerns about dilution of culture and other xenophobic acts. By Americans, brazilians, japanese or anyone else.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Depends on the language and the term.

The English word "jab" is commonly used in other languages (at least the ones I know).

The French use the English term "uppercut" while the Italian use the native term "montante".

Both ditched "hook" and use native terms ("crochet" and "gancio").

In aikido, I find that Japanese terms provide a common reference for techniques and concepts, which helps with cross-language communication.

Yeah. I've heard folks argue that using native-language terms makes learning easier. But I haven't found that students remember the term "pivot takedown" any faster than folks in other styles learn the term "shiho nage". It's even worse with some of our longer technique names ("two-hand grip from the rear, throw to the side", anyone?). New terms are confusing. Sometimes they are easier to learn and remember if they are in the native language ("let sweep" vs "osoto gari"), but that's not always the case.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Id say for the same reason we use French terms when cooking. Mirepoix is a shorthand for onions, carrots, and celery. Course, you sub bell pepper for carrots, and you have the holy trinity of Cajun cuisine... which borrows heavily from French roots. Same technique, but the native term is more specific. Made a leek and potato soup tonight, using the same technique as above, but it was closer to a German suppengrun...except instead of carrots, leeks, and celery root, I used leeks, fennel root, and yellow onion.

same technique, though. Point is, if I say mirepoix, you know it’s onion, carrot, and celery. If it’s not those exact veggies, it’s not mirepoix. Though if you and I both know what a mirepoix is, I can say, “like mirepoix, but with x instead of y.” And we are both on the same page. You could duplicate what I did no problem.

personally, I don’t have a problem with vocabulary. I do have issues with concerns about dilution of culture and other xenophobic acts. By Americans, brazilians, japanese or anyone else.

Agreed. And if a second term evolved in English for the same mix ("French mix", for instance), it would serve just as well. Like, literally just as well, since it carries no more information than mirepoix until you know what it means.

 

[Steve]

Agreed. And if a second term evolved in English for the same mix ("French mix", for instance), it would serve just as well. Like, literally just as well, since it carries no more information than mirepoix until you know what it means.

Language is a funny thing. I love how weird it is, and always have. We haven't even touched on context, where something like a roux can be a mixture of butter (or oil) and flour, and you cook it for a few minutes to make a white gravy for chicken fried steak, or 15 minutes or more until it gets dark and nutty for a gumbo.

 

[Unkogami]

because once your using a foreign word as part of your everyday language, your brain no longer considers it as foreign, it's just english ...

That is not exactly true.

 

[Gyakuto]

Part of learning any discipline is using the vernacular/terminology/jargon. It’s often a short hand for example “That cut requires kime’ rather than, “ensure you stop the blade at the correct height and tighten your muscles momentarily to impart the force of the blade into the target.” or “mushin” rather than “maintain a placid mind to avoid the exchange becoming a melee such that one can react to all external cues however small”. It also suggests an amount of study that using English perhaps doesn’t. In my own field I could say “Incise with the scalpel laterally to the angle of Lewis” rather than “make your cut a bit to the side of the ridge on the upper part of the breast bone”. I encouraged the use of technical terminology with my students even in everyday life to get them used to it and sounding professional and precise.

However, I have a friend who has language difficulties and uses English rather than Japanese. I feel his students suffer as a consequence when they meet trainees from other dojo.

 

[Hanzou]

I personally like the crazy names for some BJJ moves. There’s almost always some great story behind it. I especially like 10th Planet’s insane terminology.

 

[jmf552]

Two things I would say:

• If you know the Japanese you can work out anywhere. I worked out in a Karate' dojo in Italy once. I did not know Italian, but I knew the moves they were calling in Japanese.
• There are some terms in Japanese that have a deeper meaning than the English translation. I can understand "mushin" with the one word. I takes a paragraph to understand it in English.