‘That’ Person

[JowGaWolf]

I also teach a weapon art that includes swords and knives. Part of the role of a teacher (in my view) is to disabuse those notions, not disown those students.

I've done a lot of this during my years of teaching but it was mainly with certain people. Whenever they got that Hollywood kung fu vibe, I would step on it and I would step on any of the dreams that were tied to it lol. I teach Kung Fu. I do not teach Fight choreography. In this class fight choreography will get you hurt.

The reason I'm so hard on students about that is because I fell into same perception that kung fu is supposed to look like the moves so I kept trying to use it like that and failed. It took about 2 years for me to get that out my mind. I knew from the start it was incorrect but it didn't make it any easier to erase all that I had seen in martial arts movies and how people watching those moves and think that they understand the martial arts system by watching the movie. Since then, I don't watch many martial arts movies and I don't pay attention to the fight scenes like I did back then.

But it's like you stated "Address those inaccuracies not the person." The problem isn't the person. It's the perception that kung fu is what David Carradine is doing and is how it works in real life. When I was kid I remember seeing some kids trying to fight at Tai Chi slow speed. They said that their movements conserved energy lol. Gotta love the 70's and 80's mindset.

 

[ap Oweyn]

I've done a lot of this during my years of teaching but it was mainly with certain people. Whenever they got that Hollywood kung fu vibe, I would step on it and I would step on any of the dreams that were tied to it lol. I teach Kung Fu. I do not teach Fight choreography. In this class fight choreography will get you hurt.

The reason I'm so hard on students about that is because I fell into same perception that kung fu is supposed to look like the moves so I kept trying to use it like that and failed. It took about 2 years for me to get that out my mind. I knew from the start it was incorrect but it didn't make it any easier to erase all that I had seen in martial arts movies and how people watching those moves and think that they understand the martial arts system by watching the movie. Since then, I don't watch many martial arts movies and I don't pay attention to the fight scenes like I did back then.

But it's like you stated "Address those inaccuracies not the person." The problem isn't the person. It's the perception that kung fu is what David Carradine is doing and is how it works in real life. When I was kid I remember seeing some kids trying to fight at Tai Chi slow speed. They said that their movements conserved energy lol. Gotta love the 70's and 80's mindset.

Oh god, yeah. But at least your style was the style of heroes as well as villains. In the early 90s, when I was learning FMA, it was almost exclusively the style of Steven Seagal victims.

1. Grab two sticks
2. Six-count sinawali
3. Advance menacingly
4. Die

 

[Gyakuto]

Do I get an all white costume like the Dr.? I’m used to blues or greens. Padawan? I’m like the 6’1” 210 lbs 3rd grader who can’t fit the desk.

I’m sorry, I don’t really know who ‘pee’d her pants’ is…I’ve just heard others say something like that

 

[ap Oweyn]

<Gasp> he was Kung Fu!

He was awful. I don't know if you ever read his book Spirit of Shaolin. But he doesn't get it. He really doesn't. In it, he describes bushido as a martial art.

Yes I can see that, but what we’ve noticed is the motivation to wear all white and have white swords to more closely emulate their anime crush rather than become good at the art; it’s more like cosplay. I suspect they want to learn a bit so they can doing a flashy resheathing at ‘Comics-are-a-Con’…impress their mates.

Yeah, I get that. I'm sure that describes a lot of beginners. The thing is that it's hard to tell on the front end who's going to shift from that to a genuine interest in the art. What I do know is that the shift doesn't happen without someone taking an interest.

A very good point, well made!

Thanks Gyakuto.

I think you should look around and you’ll see it is and increasingly so. Money gives the most opportunities

I've been looking directly at it for more than a decade now. I also work in higher education, supporting students with barriers to participation. In the United States. Believe me, I'm keenly aware of the advantages of money. And the universe's propensity for kicking people while they're down. All the more reason not to give up on them.

It happens about once a quarter. We noticed Damascus steel-bladed swords (with white scabbards) appearing at these times and wondered if the same one was being passed around (one person said their’s cost them £600!), so we photographed unusual features and they turned out to be different sword…illegal swords!

Huh. Well, maybe you're doing a social good by teaching people to take swords more seriously then.

That’s what we did and there’d be much sighing, acceptance and they’d never come again. We saw one person walking home with their sword strapped to their back! He should be forcibly sterilised to clean the gene pool a little.

Ouch. Sounds like a self-correcting problem to me. You tell them that's not how this works. If they come back, there's hope.

As I said, why would such abstract ‘talents’ be preserved and passed on? Perhaps having longer arms for throwing further, eyes wider apart for better visual depth deeper glenoid fossae to protect the shoulder joints, stronger rotator cuff muscles…it’d take a while for those to appear in an individual population, but they probably would. But that’s physical advantage rather than neural. I forgotten my point now, but any excuse to talk about Darwin’s incredible fact!

I'm no expert on Darwin. But isn't that part of what sets us apart as humans? That we don't just preserve that which improves our literal survivability?

[quote[I want to be untalented and in your class![/quote]
Well I haven't got a class currently. But if I did, it would be a hell of a commute. About 3,000 miles by my calculations. (I live not far outside of DC.)

Is that what they peddle?

Confidence? Sure. You said yourself that you sought it out after minor bullying.

I think many of us here followed that kind of trajectory, but we carried on practising the MA to reach our lofty heights of…whatever.

I opted for "not abysmal" personally.

After 30 years of it, you want to give up, though.

Some days, yeah. And I have done for the time being, but that was more down to medical issues and lack of time.

If you have a gaggle of them, it really is a disrupter.

Upstream, someone suggested separate classes. I like that suggestion.

Or could it be disheartening to see a peer doing the same things as you but getting better than you?

Possibly. You've been a professor. You know better than most that students' reactions to adversity express themselves in different ways. I have no illusions that everyone will persist. I also have no illusions about being able to tell on the front end who will and won't. I've been surprised, both in martial arts and higher ed, by who does.

Yes…

This is the best post and you have persuaded me to revise my teaching ideas should I ever get the urge again (very unlikely). Fantastic @ap Oweyn!

I appreciate you reading that lot, Gyakuto. It's been good talking with you.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

in particular, the motivation. Stirring the pot is precisely the motivation for trolling.

The term comes from fishing, casting a wide net, saying provocative things in the hopes of stirring up faux controversy. I mean, you do you. I’m just glad you are aware you’re being manipulated.

Being manipulated? Not really. I would have to actually care. It’s not very provocative. He is just looking for debate. Careful with that axe, you might cut yourself while grinding it.

 

[Sammy Naur]

I don’t think he is angry. He likes to joke and stir the pot a bit. I believe he is doing that with this thread. He actively lifts weight and is an accomplished sword guy no matter what he is playing at here. Sorry to ruin the fun.

Thanks for the insight, I'm just not in the mood I guess.

People who italicize their own words, like what they're writing is super important.

Meanwhile some of us just want to have adult discussions and not get played with. The whole ape hooting around Tyson vs Paul has left me a bit raw, wanting to just not go online at all.

I'll give it a chance, I just wish people would be more positive about training, and less judgemental and self serving.

 

[Sammy Naur]

in particular, the motivation. Stirring the pot is precisely the motivation for trolling.

The term comes from fishing, casting a wide net, saying provocative things in the hopes of stirring up faux controversy. I mean, you do you. I’m just glad you are aware you’re being manipulated.

Oh lol, it's "trawling". Trolling comes from the troll under bridge, demanding something for passage. Trawling is dragging a catch net behind a boat.

But that made me laugh, I'm actually a fisherman, and have trawled waters in the Atlantic much of my life. Mostly around the Cape Cod and Gloucester waters.

 

[Steve]

Oh lol, it's "trawling".

lol. You’re right. Trolling is with lines. Trawling is with a net. Shows you how much commercial fishing I’ve done!

 

[Holmejr]

Dang! With the drop out rate at schools you’re pretty demanding! Hahaha.

I have a semi private student now that has had a couple strokes, his retention and recall are poor. He will probably never be a great or even good representation of the art, but the training is an excellent path of recovery for him. Yes, He takes up my precious time, but the reward is great. I don’t want him to give up.
In my school that I attend, we have a gentleman that is missing his right arm from birth. His left arm and hand are normal and he has a prosthetic device for the left. Instead of telling him that the art just isn’t for him, my teacher modified or created techniques that he could perform and basically fit the concept of the art we teach. He is limited obviously, but what he does do well, he does very well and I wouldn’t want to be on the receiving end of his defense. Is it the art we teach? Well, if the art is making a weapon out of the individual, then yes.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

lol. You’re right. Trolling is with lines. Trawling is with a net. Shows you how much commercial fishing I’ve done!

It’s still fishing. I’ve done some trolling, in the bar, online, under the bridge, and in the ocean too.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Thanks for the insight, I'm just not in the mood I guess.

People who italicize their own words, like what they're writing is super important.

Meanwhile some of us just want to have adult discussions and not get played with. The whole ape hooting around Tyson vs Paul has left me a bit raw, wanting to just not go online at all.

I'll give it a chance, I just wish people would be more positive about training, and less judgemental and self serving.

Nah, he is cheeky, but he is just playing for bites. Wants to see what will rise to the bait. I went with it, but he isn’t serious.

 

[Sammy Naur]

Nah, he is cheeky, but he is just playing for bites. Wants to see what will rise to the bait. I went with it, but he isn’t serious.

Any port in a storm I guess.

There is a statue in Gloucester devoted to the lost at sea. I've driven by it many times but every time I remind myself how many people don't understand what that really means, to be utterly devoured by the water.

I imagine this thread is kind of like that, to be utterly devoured by your own waters.

The best solution IMHO is a solid punch in the face. A wake up call, one of the healthiest thing to start your day.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Any port in a storm I guess.

There is a statue in Gloucester devoted to the lost at sea. I've driven by it many times but every time I remind myself how many people don't understand what that really means, to be utterly devoured by the water.

I imagine this thread is kind of like that, to be utterly devoured by your own waters.

The best solution IMHO is a solid punch in the face. A wake up call, one of the healthiest thing to start your day.

If you want to see what being devoured by water feels like, I suggest surfing in overhead waves, or while whitewater rafting, swim a class 4 rapid. Getting rag dolled and held under by waves or rapids are some of the most humbling experiences I’ve ever had.

 

[Sammy Naur]

If you want to see what being devoured by water feels like, I suggest surfing in overhead waves, or while whitewater rafting, swim a class 4 rapid. Getting rag dolled and held under by waves or rapids are some of the most humbling experiences I’ve ever had.

Sorry, surfing and rafting have nothing on saltwater fishing. Not even close, my friend.

Have you ever sailed into a squall to make your daily bread?

You think watersports are humbling? Try surviving a storm at sea.

Again, I apologize in advance if I come across harsh but damn, if you know anything about the sea, you'd never throw out surfing or rafting. That's landlubber games.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Sorry, surfing and rafting have nothing on saltwater fishing. Not even close, my friend.

Have you ever sailed into a squall to make your daily bread?

You think watersports are humbling? Try surviving a storm at sea.

I’m talking about the sensation of being devoured by the water, not being at sea in a boat. I have not worked as a commercial fisherman, I know a few, I have respect for the folks that do it.

 

[Prince_Alarming]

Actually, there is a kind of fishing called trolling as opposed to trawling. Trawling is saltwater fishing where you drag a huge net behind the boat. 'Trolling' is where you drag a lure behind a moving boat in the hopes of getting a bite, usually from a trout. When I first heard about it I thought it was going to be awesome, but I quickly found that your odds of actually catching a fish that way were pretty minimal.

 

[Steve]

Actually, there is a kind of fishing called trolling as opposed to trawling. Trawling is saltwater fishing where you drag a huge net behind the boat. 'Trolling' is where you drag a lure behind a moving boat in the hopes of getting a bite, usually from a trout. When I first heard about it I thought it was going to be awesome, but I quickly found that your odds of actually catching a fish that way were pretty minimal.

And to bring this back to the reason we are talking about trolling:

(Perhaps I should say, I have taken a controversial point of view to initiate conversation, play devils advocate etc.

This is internet trolling.

Many of you seem to understand this and are offering interesting points of view. Others seem to be unable to see that a view contrary to theirs isn’t necessarily wrong/immoral/unworthy)

This is a fool’s choice. Everyone knows you’re making stuff up to stir the pot. And it’s not that your position is wrong, unworthy, or immoral. It’s that everything you post is disingenuous.

And to be clear, the only real issue here is that it sure does make it hard to figure out what you actually think, and watching folks try to interact with you is an exercise in futility. You will take multiple positions in a thread and contradict yourself. And when pressed, you either get sarcastic, make a joke, or post a non sequitor.

All of this would be different if anything you write were sincere.

Alright, then. Carry on. I’m sure I’m the only one who finds it annoying.

 

[Sammy Naur]

Actually, there is a kind of fishing called trolling as opposed to trawling. Trawling is saltwater fishing where you drag a huge net behind the boat. 'Trolling' is where you drag a lure behind a moving boat in the hopes of getting a bite, usually from a trout. When I first heard about it I thought it was going to be awesome, but I quickly found that your odds of actually catching a fish that way were pretty minimal.

It's got to be done right, and it's typically not something casual fishers do.

It's worse than minimal otherwise, this is something at least in my experience associated with wealthy retired people who own small boats. They pack lunch, some beers, get underway, and head out. They find a spot, and set a few lines around the boat, and proceed to put on Yacht Rock on the satellite radio, paying no mind to whether or not any line gets a bite. It's more or less all about the process.

But to effectively troll you need to keep moving (something the retirees don't do, they drop anchor and party and come home with an empty cooler).

Trawlin, when you haul a ton of fish in one load, now that's an experience. And it's enough to make many people just barf. I think it must kind of be like the difference between all those people who love steak but have never been inside an actual slaughterhouse.

 

[Steve]

It's worse than minimal, this is something at least in my experience associated with wealthy retired people who own small boats. They pack lunch, some beers, get underway, and head out. They find a spot, and set a few lines around the boat, and proceed to put on Yacht Rock on the satellite radio, paying no mind to whether or not any line gets a bite. It's more or less all about the process.

But to effectively troll you need to keep moving (something the retirees don't do, they drop anchor and party).

Trawlin, when you haul a ton of fish in one load, now that's an experience. And it's enough to make many people just barf.

Back in the 80s, I had several friends work on commercial fishing boats out of Seattle. It was seasonal work, fairly dangerous, and physically taxing. But they would earn a lot of dough in just a few months to get them through college without debt. I can’t remember exactly how much they’d get, but I want to say it was in the area of $30k for 2 or 3 months work. That said, they were working 10 or 12 hours every day.

It’s a tough living. Hats off to those guys.
Their descriptions of the work was enough for me to know that it wasn’t for me. So I enlisted in the military.

 

[Sammy Naur]

I’m talking about the sensation of being devoured by the water, not being at sea in a boat. I have not worked as a commercial fisherman, I know a few, I have respect for the folks that do it.

Oh. Sorry.

I guess we were coming at it from different angles, you're talking about the nice sensations of watersports.

I've had to rescue people drowning so that's where I was going with that. Nothing like trying to pump water out of someone's lungs so they don't die from aspiration. It's literally the worst noise I've ever heard.