Taekwondo curriculum content and teaching methodology

[Daniel Sullivan]

The problem is Kids are not adults, even the law doesn't hold them to the same standard. Of course if you are under 15, you are still a child and should be treated as such. SO I do not have a problem with the current Poom/Dan system. While yes, if those student continue they can get 2nd Poom and 3rd Poom, most do usually get 2nd Dan after their 1st Poom.

Then they must be at least fifteen per article eight. http://www.kukkiwon.or.kr/viewfront/eng/promotion/regulations.jsp#

Just to be clear, I have no problem with the current system either, but if they eliminated the pum grades and maintained the age minimums for second dan and higher, I'd be okay with that as well.

We have only had 2 students who were 1st Poom and 1 who was 2nd Poom but, we are a more traditional school when it comes to training. We don't believe in promoting students every other year or 2 years. Are they reflecting and understanding their rank? What curriculum are they learning that can be learned in 12 months??

Be careful about how traditional you claim to be. Average time to first dan in Korea is and has been one year. Technically, your time in grade requirements are not traditional. I'm not criticizing your school for that, but don't call it traditional when its not.

The problem is you have 6, 9, 12 year olds running around as 3rd Dan, 4th Dan and its ridiculous, it waters down the meaning of achieving Black Belt.

Read the Kukkiwon requirements for third and fourth dan. You will find that they have age minimums of 18 and 21 respectively.

It shouldn't just be handed out like candy or a sticker for continuing with the martial arts.

I agree, but handing out black belts like candy is unrelated to the minimum age allowed to grade. I don't like belt factories, but you can have a belt factory with students of all ages. Its actually easier with adults; they don't need their parents to pay for their tests, and once you reach the grades you mention above, you're dealing with longer term students who are happy training at your facility.

Black belt is a serious rank and should be treated as such. Anyone who trained hard for it know what I mean.

First dan in the KKW is a beginning dan, signifying only that you have learned the basics. All ranks are 'serious' and all gradings should be treated as such. First dan is only 'super serious' if you are treating it as an end of journey event or if your ego is wrapped up in the achieving of first dan.

I can't respect a 10 year old kid who is 2nd Dan, when did he start training? In the womb?? I took over 7 years to get my 1st Dan, I know what it means to obtain it and what it means to be it. So, no...kids, children are not the same and should not be treated as such.

In KKW taekwondo, to go from first to second dan the student must be at least fifteen years of age. Simply eliminating the pum grade would mean children could earn a first dan but would be unable to promote to second or higher until the age of fifteen.

I strenuously object to any school, dojang, dojo, association that promotes kids (under 16) to full Dan, especially if it was earned in under 2-3 years. Think about it, most systems have 9 Gups for under belts, with a minimum of 6 months at each rank, which I think is very generous for training and learning new curriculum...it would be 3.5 years til you could be ELIGIBLE to test for 1st Dan. So, yeah I can't get behind little kids being promoted to full Dan black belt if they don't put the time in. Just like in school their is Kindergarten, then Elementary, then Junior HS, then HS...finally they get to go to college, then their is Graduate School and so forth....there are no shortcuts to success...only hard work and dedication...

As I said, the average in Korea is one year. More than a few people who live or have lived in Korea have related that to me over the years. In KKW TKD, first dan is considered a beginning rank. Nothing more.

I think that the major issue in many schools is not the age of the candidates but the integrity of the testing standards. I've seen ten year old pum holders display the crispness and correctness of form that one would expect in a first dan and I have seen ten year old pum holders who look like they're having a fit of epilepsy that is coincidentally in a palgwe formation. And I have seen a happy medium. Aside from the obvious differences in power, the adult first dan holders that I have seen run the very same gamut.

The difference isn't the age of the candidate but the integrity of the testing standards.

 

[irgordon]

I can agree with that, all I am saying is that we need good standards and it can't look like you have no idea what you are doing but call yourself a black belt. You mention Koreans but, they do things much differently in Korea and are much stricter in their approach to teaching, as opposed to the many American schools way of every 2-3 months passing on a mediocre performance as acceptable.

Granted, if you are just doing this for a business and not serious about having good martial art students, by all means, they can do what they want.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

You mention Koreans but, they do things much differently in Korea and are much stricter in their approach to teaching, as opposed to the many American schools way of every 2-3 months passing on a mediocre performance as acceptable.

With respect, this is not necessarily true. In Korea, a child (and presumably an adult) can earn a BB in a year, perhaps less. Judging from videos I've seen, as well as comments from first-hand accounts it would appear that, at least for some schools, quantity overrules quality.

 

[Markku P]

In my experience is that in Korea is much easier to get a black belt ( in general )

/Markku P.

 

[Jaeimseu]

It took me around 2 years to get my 1st dan in the US. In Korea, it can be done in a year or a little less. A student can test for the next rank about every 2 months. It takes 6 tests to get a black belt with a white, yellow, green, blue, brown, red, black belt color structure. A student could start at white belt 3 or 4 weeks prior to the next testing day and then reach black belt in about 11 months.

People often hear things about how things are much more serious in Korea, or something to that effect. The truth is that it varies from school to school and student to student. Some students train 5 days per week, while some train 2-3 times per week like most probably do in the USA. The majority of students train recreationally, while others train like crazy.

 

[Jaeimseu]

With respect, this is not necessarily true. In Korea, a child (and presumably an adult) can earn a BB in a year, perhaps less. Judging from videos I've seen, as well as comments from first-hand accounts it would appear that, at least for some schools, quantity overrules quality.

Yes, children and adults can do this. And I would say that the average quality is probably about the same as anywhere else. I would compare taekwondo in Korea to something like baseball or soccer in America. It's an athletic activity that nearly everybody participates in. The majority of participants are of average ability. That's why it's called average. Where Korea has the edge is that they have a much deeper pool of talented athletes in taekwondo than other countries.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

I can agree with that, all I am saying is that we need good standards and it can't look like you have no idea what you are doing but call yourself a black belt.

Which I am on board with, but that is separate from the age issue.

You mention Koreans but, they do things much differently in Korea and are much stricter in their approach to teaching, as opposed to the many American schools way of every 2-3 months passing on a mediocre performance as acceptable.

I don't know how it is done in Korea, never having trained there, but with only a year between white and black belt, you're probably testing at least every couple of months, if not more.

Granted, if you are just doing this for a business and not serious about having good martial art students, by all means, they can do what they want.

Business and good students are not mutually exclusive. A school that is successful on the business end simply means that the owner is making wise business decisions and nothing more.

Some schools that are lousy on the business end are also lousy on the instructional end. I can think of at least two in my area.

Also, sometimes instructors burn out. The school may have been a top flight school but after fifteen to twenty years, the grandmaster is burnt out and isn't consistently teaching. Standards slide, and if the trend isn't reversed, then the school eventually suffers financially.