Sokeship Council, Grandmaster or NOT????

[TimoS]

Is there any way to post images from my hard drive?

I think you need to be a supporting member to do that. You can send those images to me, I can post them (and hey, then maybe I can also verify sokes )

 

[kenpojujitsu]

I doubt that this partial translation of a copy of part of a photograph of some alleged document, that was compared to other unkown documents, will stand up in court if someone decides to sue over these claims.

Church has always been known as a liar and his students were always seen to be continuing the lies that he told. So whay someone would not suspect fraud in the "documents" I can not imagine.

But Mr. Power "staked his reputation" on it. So I will just stand behind the ISHH and his scholarship and presume Church to be a legitmate Soke.

And this kills the myth that there is no such thing as an American Sokeship Council. Church started the first one and ceritifed atleast a dozen people to be Soke. Plus his people lend support and credability to ISHH.

Thank you Soke Church, Soke Petit, ISHH and of course Guy Power Sensei, for clearing all this all up and making it possible for us all to become Soke too.

 

[James Kovacich]

I doubt that this partial translation of a copy of part of a photograph of some alleged document, that was compared to other unkown documents, will stand up in court if someone decides to sue over these claims.

Church has always been known as a liar and his students were always seen to be continuing the lies that he told. So whay someone would not suspect fraud in the "documents" I can not imagine.

But Mr. Power "staked his reputation" on it. So I will just stand behind the ISHH and his scholarship and presume Church to be a legitmate Soke.

And this kills the myth that there is no such thing as an American Sokeship Council. Church started the first one and ceritifed atleast a dozen people to be Soke. Plus his people lend support and credability to ISHH.

Thank you Soke Church, Soke Petit, ISHH and of course Guy Power Sensei, for clearing all this all up and making it possible for us all to become Soke too.

You really appear to "flip flop" your posts to fit your own agenda.
Quote:
I am an independent student of Kenpo-Jujutsu and Danzan Ryu Jujitsu.
I have no ranks or titles and no agenda other than to learn something.

Did you or did you not send this to Mr. Power at E-Budo??

 

[kamishinkan]

Actually, I am not a lawyer, but I think a copy of a document in a persons handwriting WILL stand up in court.

As far as Church being a liar......He was presumed to be a liar based on the statement by Kuniba sensei's son. It seems he was not the liar everyone tried to make him out to be. It seems we keep turning up more and more proof that backs his statements.

Church sensei was "verified" as it has been put as a "Soke" of his inherited system of Kamishin Ryu. These so called "Soke Boards" MAKE you a Soke of your own CREATED art. Seems to be a vast difference between creating your own art in America and inheriting an art.

I am not going to comment on the ISHH association that is just a dumb dragged out argument. It has been addressed over and over in this thread. I do not think the idea of association is going to work to discredit anyone.

Darrell Collins
Kamishinkan Dojo

 

[kenpojujitsu]

Except that we still do not have a document in Kuniba's hand writing.
There is also nothing that says that Church did not make up the Kamishin Ryu story.
Just the copy of the photograph of a document that addresses him as Soke. And the scholarship and insight of Guy Power who says it is Kuniba's handwriting.

That may be enough to sway a jury if it comes to it.

And finally, (I hope) now that Albert Church is officially a Soke (on the word of Guy Power, not Kuniba), his and Soke Petit's affiliation with ISHH makes them legit.

 

[TimoS]

Why don't you give at a rest already ?

 

[kenpojujitsu]

I am not flip-flopping to meet an agenda.
Like I said, I used to believe that Albert Church was a liar and was not a soke.

I accepted the scholarship of Guy Power and now accept him as a true soke.

It was a mistake in my judgement that was corrected.

Albert Church was Soke and so is Ted Petit. The case is settled.

 

[James Kovacich]

These so called "Soke Boards" MAKE you a Soke of your own CREATED art. Seems to be a vast difference between creating your own art in America and inheriting an art.

Darrell Collins
Kamishinkan Dojo

Being in America and a martial artist since 1973, I've seen my share "new arts." Wheres the problem? It seems it is traditional for new systems to evolve. Martial history is debateble but most systems names changed as our martial ancestors contributed to the arts.
http://www.scientific-streetfighting.com/TMA.html

Here in America Mr.Tarow Hayayshi Pioneerd "mixed martial art in the 1970's. Not for the public but for his organization. That was a new system. My brother-in-law was a black belt / professional fighter under Mr. Hayashi (RIP).
http://www.hayashismartialarts.com/free_form_combat.htm

What are the real issues amongst these boards? The word Soke?

 

[kenpojujitsu]

You really appear to "flip flop" your posts to fit your own agenda.
Quote:
I am an independent student of Kenpo-Jujutsu and Danzan Ryu Jujitsu.
I have no ranks or titles and no agenda other than to learn something.

Did you or did you not send this to Mr. Power at E-Budo??

No I did not send this to Guy Power.

 

[James Kovacich]

I am not flip-flopping to meet an agenda.
Like I said, I used to believe that Albert Church was a liar and was not a soke.

I accepted the scholarship of Guy Power and now accept him as a true soke.

It was a mistake in my judgement that was corrected.

Albert Church was Soke and so is Ted Petit. The case is settled.

Thanx for the answer.

 

[kamishinkan]

Originally posted by kenpojujitsu
...now that Albert Church is officially a Soke (on the word of Guy Power, not Kuniba),...

I think this document proves that he was always a "Soke". This on the WRITTEN WORD of Kuniba Sensei and on the translation of that document by Power sensei. I just like to keep it straight.

Darrell Collins
Kamishinkan Dojo

 

[TimoS]

No I did not send this to Guy Power.

True. That was your response to George Kohler's demands

 

[TimoS]

Here are the images Guy Power sent me. I had to resize them to fit them here, sorry about that

 

[ghp]

The second and third images are in fact about 200% larger than as they appear on this board; the first image is about the original size of the copy from which I worked.

After being cleaned of excess copy-black the second image was easier to read -- "easier" being a relative term. None of the copies are as desirable as would be a clean first-generation copy or scan of the document-- but it was the best I had to work with. Ergo, you will note many gaps in the text where I could not even begin to guess what the kanji might be.

Regards,
Guy Power

 

[George Kohler]

True. That was your response to George Kohler's demands

Yes, Jim did not respond to all of my demands.