Skip dan

[Flying Crane]

"comments were also made that give the impression that substantial amounts of money are charged for these tests, and that increases with each level one wishes to skip. I saw a comment of $2000"

What you have to understand is that the Kukkiown fees are exceptionally less than what folks were told. Only until recently with the internet and globalization did this become apparent. For many it was thought and told the fees the teacher charged were due to the kukkiwon. I know someone that trains, teaches and is past due for their next Dan but just wont pay what their teacher charges. Some schools its 600 for first 1200 for 2nd 1800 for third etc etc etc. Remember kukkiwon is around 70, 90 100 something (at work cant look for it). But its very little compared.
So to most folks the Kukkiwon charges were huge savings to what a Master would have charged them to come over to the Kukkiwon with their ranks or to test for.

Dave O.

well I don't know the particulars, I just saw the comment about $2000. Whether it's being charged by the KKW or the individual school, or the USAT or whomever, I think someone is getting fleeced and someone is doing the fleecing.

Could you clarifiy the roles that the KKW and the USAT play, and what is their relationship and interaction with each other and how does it affect membership? thx.

 

[troubleenuf]

The Korean Master in this area charges $4800 for 4th Dan, $5800 for 5th, and I know of one guy who was charged over $10,000 for 4th Dan by this same organization. All in the name of the mighty, now worthless (in my opinion), Kukkiwon certificate.

"comments were also made that give the impression that substantial amounts of money are charged for these tests, and that increases with each level one wishes to skip. I saw a comment of $2000"

What you have to understand is that the Kukkiown fees are exceptionally less than what folks were told. Only until recently with the internet and globalization did this become apparent. For many it was thought and told the fees the teacher charged were due to the kukkiwon. I know someone that trains, teaches and is past due for their next Dan but just wont pay what their teacher charges. Some schools its 600 for first 1200 for 2nd 1800 for third etc etc etc. Remember kukkiwon is around 70, 90 100 something (at work cant look for it). But its very little compared.
So to most folks the Kukkiwon charges were huge savings to what a Master would have charged them to come over to the Kukkiwon with their ranks or to test for.

Dave O.

 

[Flying Crane]

The Korean Master in this area charges $4800 for 4th Dan, $5800 for 5th, and I know of one guy who was charged over $10,000 for 4th Dan by this same organization. All in the name of the mighty, now worthless (in my opinion), Kukkiwon certificate.

I'm in the wrong line of work...

 

[clfsean]

I'm in the wrong line of work...

You -n- me both...

Time to set up the eBay House O'Certificates & Honoraries...

 

[Miles]

The Korean Master in this area charges $4800 for 4th Dan, $5800 for 5th, and I know of one guy who was charged over $10,000 for 4th Dan by this same organization. All in the name of the mighty, now worthless (in my opinion), Kukkiwon certificate.

Wow! Those are crazy high prices, but I guess if someone thinks it's worth it....

FTR, Kukkiwon charges $70 for 1st dan, $90 for 2nd dan, $120 for 3rd dan, $150 for 4th dan, $300 for 5th dan, $350 for 6th dan, and $450 for 7th dan.

 

[Flying Crane]

Wow! Those are crazy high prices, but I guess if someone thinks it's worth it....

FTR, Kukkiwon charges $70 for 1st dan, $90 for 2nd dan, $120 for 3rd dan, $150 for 4th dan, $300 for 5th dan, $350 for 6th dan, and $450 for 7th dan.

Looking for a way to put a positive spin on it, I suppose if you are an instructor, you could write this off as a business expense on your taxes? Altho I wonder if the IRS might look a little funny at a $10k write-off for a 4th dan test. They might start examining your books more closely than you'd like.

 

[terryl965]

Flying Crane the KKW (Kukkiwon) provides a certificate that is worldwide and if you have one, the rank is never question. The USAT (United States America Tae Kwon Do) hold the rights for the USOC, they are the only game if you have any desire to be an Olympic athlete for the USA Tae Kwon Do team. This needs to be changed in my mind to many politics and *** kissing to be a real player with them, but of course my opinion. I am behind the KKW but not the instructor fleecing the flock, the KKW has done alot for the betterment of TKD around the world. The USAT is an offshoot of the formal USTU and there corruption, which we could just have a good old fight off without all the games being played so the fighters can make the decisssion and not people with very little knowledge about the art and sport of TKD.

ONe quick note like Miles said the KKW fee's are small compared to what you get, those damm dis-honest instructors that try to make them look bad.

 

[dancingalone]

It just seems dishonest to charge your student an inflated price to get his KKW rank. If you need to make more money, why not just level with the student and tell him, you're charging him $200-$300 a month rather than wait for this KKW dan subterfuge.

 

[terryl965]

It just seems dishonest to charge your student an inflated price to get his KKW rank. If you need to make more money, why not just level with the student and tell him, you're charging him $200-$300 a month rather than wait for this KKW dan subterfuge.

Because these so called Master would not have these students, the worst is when they just lie about the fee's and blame other things instead of just being honest. What a business we have going on with Masters in the world.

 

[dortiz]

I have had some great teachers and truly love them. At the same time the thought of sitting in that office and pulling up the web page and saying "hmmmm thats odd"

Priceless.

Truth is I got way more great stuff than its worth and I cant start to figure it out or change anything now.

Hopefully with the world being a smaller place this stuff will slowly go away.

Dave O.

 

[KGTKD]

Wow! Those are crazy high prices, but I guess if someone thinks it's worth it....

FTR, Kukkiwon charges $70 for 1st dan, $90 for 2nd dan, $120 for 3rd dan, $150 for 4th dan, $300 for 5th dan, $350 for 6th dan, and $450 for 7th dan.

I made the $2000 comment and I wasn't specific enough, 2000 was a random number I came up with to include the cost of travel/expenses plus the fees to test. You had to pay for each dan tested, plus I believe (correct me if I am worng) a fee to the USAT for every Dan tested.

Our 1st Dan black belt test is 250 and it includes all the boards(27 of them)/the black belt with embroidery, kkw certificate, and a gift (usually a nice black v-neck tkd uniform).

When I paid for a 3rd Dan test, from my previous instructor (who never provided the KKW) it cost 600 plus I had to get the blackbelt/boards myself. LOL

 

[goingd]

that is true, my impression from the original discussion was that nobody got the highest skip that they requested, but many did skip some level or other. The thing is, comments were also made that give the impression that substantial amounts of money are charged for these tests, and that increases with each level one wishes to skip. I saw a comment of $2000, I don't know if that was the price per dan grade, or a total price including multiple skips, or what, but that's a huge amount of money. Myself coming from a school and organization that disallows charging for tests, and in fact will demote instructors who get caught doing so, I find this shocking. I can't imagine paying that kind of money for a test, but that's just me I guess. Apparently plenty of people are willing to do so.

But paying this kind of money opens another big can of worms. Are people REALLY passing because they had a quality test, or because the check cleared? And if the Board decides to NOT promote someone, be it the next dan grade or some higher skipped level, are they now owed a refund? That's a huge amount of money to toss around, for some Board member to arbitrarily decide to not give the promotion.

But then it was also stated that people unhappy about the results can petition and complain and challenge the decision.

This whole picture is just really really bizarre to me. I don't get it, but hey, who says it needs to make sense to me? To each his own. Personally, I'd never have any involvement with this kind of organization. Just way too many cans of worms and dysfunctional relationships and stuff.

I don't believe the Kukkiwon was offering any refunds for failed tests. I don't think that's right, though A LOT of people tested when they weren't ready, expecting that a cleared check was an automatic pass.

The Kukkiwon fees are not actually TOO high. First Dan is $70, second is $90, third is $120, and I'm not too sure what it is after that. Dan testing is the Kukkiwon's primary source of revenue being that they do not charge for things like school charters and other fees that have to be constantly renewed.

As to the protesting of results, I think the idea is ridiculous myself. I don't think that was anything official. It sounded like the USAT president was protesting the results on behalf of USAT's upset members. I cannot imagine that it will go anywhere. The Kukkiwon was fairly firm on their statements as to who passes and who doesn't.

 

[NPTKD]

All of this has made me skip dinner!