Sikhs killed in shooting at Temple in Wisconson

[billc]

Arson, sure, someone set the fire, but who? Remember the fires in the Black churches in the 90's...

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011...he_great_church_fire_propaganda_campaign.html

Fifteen summers ago, America's news media informed us that black churches throughout the South were being torched by white racists. The purported wave of arsons dominated the airwaves and generated thousands of newspaper articles. Pundits, politicians and preachers decried the terrorism and the hate it represented.
In fact, it never happened.
Here is the little-known story of how an obscure radical group teamed up with a leftist national church organization, an unprincipled President and a legion of compliant news outlets to create a media firestorm -- one based entirely on lies.

Conclusions
Before the propaganda campaign, the number of racially motivated church arsons in the South, a region with a population of over 90 million, was probably less than 10 per year. By comparison, more than 620 buildings were burned and more than 50 people were killed in Los Angeles during the 1992 Rodney King riots. Afterwards, many on the political left avoided placing any blame on the rioters. The Rev. Jesse Jackson went so far as to suggest that America "must invest in hope, or pay the price of despair." In contrast, the supposed church arson outbreak was condemned without qualifications or excuses across the political spectrum.
Viewed fifteen years later, the church fires campaign was a great success for its leftist creators. The CDR and NCC raked in huge financial rewards, effectively slandered white Southerners and conservatives, and duped the media into repeating their "white supremacist" fantasies. President Clinton benefitted as well.
And their disinformation is largely remembered today as if it was a real event.

If it was a crime against muslims I hope they catch the guy, if it was arson for insurance, I hope they catch them as well.

So now its okay to persecute minorities because other countries do it?

Why yes, that is exactly what I said, of course we should persecute minorities, and everyone else but especially vegetarians, and circus clowns, they aren't persecuted nearly enough. Why is it that when we show that America is definitely not the hot bed of hate that fuels the dreams of some people in this country we are accused of condoning hate not only in other countries but wanting that same hate here. The obvious point being that America is a great country to live in if you are a Muslim and want to be left alone in peace. You can't find a better country for religious tolerance, and I am proud of that fact and am defending that fact. The need to paint America as something that it isn't is always strange. Does it come from deep seated feelings of guilt on the part of some here on the study, or just not realizing the truth of what this country actually is as opposed to how you think it is.

 

[billc]

Yeah, you'll accuse me of excusing violence when I show that violence against Jewish people is much worse than against Muslims in this country and it doesn't get half the attention...

http://www.adl.org/main_Terrorism/ny_synagogue_plot_arrests.htm

Four New York residents have been convicted of plotting to attack two synagogues in the Bronx and to shoot down planes at a military base inNewburgh, New York.

American citizens James Cromitie (aka Abdul Rahman), David Williams (aka Daoud and DL) and Onta Williams (aka Hamza) and Haitian native Laguerre Payen (aka Amin and Almondo) were convicted of planting what they believed to be bombs in cars outside of the Riverdale Temple and the nearby Riverdale Jewish Center. They also plotted to destroy military aircraft at the New York Air National Guard Base located at Stewart Airportin Newburgh, New York.

All four of the men, who were fueled by their hatred of America and the Jews, were arrested on May 20, 2009, immediately after planting the inert explosives and charged in an eight-count indictment for conspiring and attempting to use weapons of mass destruction within the United States, conspiracy to acquire and use anti-aircraft missiles, and conspiracy and attempt to kill U.S. officers and employees. "These were people who were eager to bring death to Jews," Assistant U.S. Attorney Eric Snyder said at a court hearing the day after the arrests. "These are extremely violent men."

Violence against anyone for any reason other than self-defense is wrong, and the thing is, it is never condoned or allowed to go unpunished. Remember, a police officer died defending the people in that temple, the rest of the police waded in to help, the paramedics treated the Sikhs without regard for what their religion was.

For Emphasis...

America is a great country and if you like freedom of religion, it is a hard place to beat to practice your religion in peace. Any incidents of intolerance are random and are pursued. They are not condoned by the majority of the population or the government, which cannot be said for any muslim controlled country or many other countries that are secular in nature. So let's be real about the United States.

And to this sillyness...

In a separate question asking Americans to express their overall view about each of the four religions evaluated, Islam is the most negatively viewed. Nearly one-third of Americans (31%) say their opinion of Islam is "not favorable at all" versus 9% who say their opinion is "very favorable." This stands in contrast to Americans' views of Christianity and Judaism, which are far more likely to be "very favorable" than "not favorable at all," while Buddhism draws almost equally positive and negative opinions at the extremes. Gallup conducted the nationwide U.S. survey between Oct. 31 and Nov. 13, 2009, spanning the Fort Hood shooting in which a U.S.-born Muslim military doctor killed 13 people on the Army base on Nov. 5.

Considering how the people of muslim nations behaved when 9/11 happened, and when the cartoons of Mohammed were published, or when theo van goh made his movie about the abuse of muslim women, I would say that the response of your average American was exemplary. No riots or mass protests against muslims occurred after any of those events, considering 3000 citizens and them more at fort hood were killed. I am proud that the people of my country did not overreact, as they do overseas to the slightest provocation, and that we have not done what others have done under lesser circumstances.

Hmmm...how about some polling of the muslim community here in the states about their feelings for Jews and Christians or about Israel....I'm sure those results would be far more interesting...and yet, we all get along together without the level of violence seen in the rest of the world. This is a great country...

 

[elder999]

Well, since the gunman has been called a white supremacist by law enforcement, it may be that he wasn't out to shoot what he thought were Muslims-he may have just been out to kill some brown people.

Which seems soooo much better. somehow....

 

[billc]

As to church burnings, it happens to all races and religions...

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2010-02-10-church-fires-texas_N.htm

10 Texas church fires under investigation

Notice the date...

Updated 2/11/2010 12:37 PM

"It doesn't have to be a hate crime," Crowley said, noting that a variety of denominations and non-denominational churches were targets. Most, but not all, have predominantly white congregations.​

Just for perspective...

 

[granfire]

Well, since the gunman has been called a white supremacist by law enforcement, it may be that he wasn't out to shoot what he thought were Muslims-he may have just been out to kill some brown people.

Which seems soooo much better. somehow....

Makes it alright, don't you think....

</sarcasm>

 

[elder999]

View attachment $292956_212296258898844_848293710_n.jpg

 

[Wo Fat]

I say we treat these white supremacists/terrorists like an American version of Al Qaeda. Hunt them down and either kill them or lock them up in prisons here in the Deep South. And then proceed to integrate the prisons.

 

[granfire]

I say we treat these white supremacists/terrorists like an American version of Al Qaeda. Hunt them down and either kill them or lock them up in prisons here in the Deep South. And then proceed to integrate the prisons.

Well, the first part was pretty sensical, the rest was just silly....

 

[Wo Fat]

Well, the first part was pretty sensical, the rest was just silly....

Which part is silly? The part about hunting them down and killing them or the part about locking them up in integrated prison populations?

Our leaders are consistently talking about capturing/killing Al Qaeda. If we are to treat these aryan-type terrorists the same as we would Al Qaeda, then the seek-and-destroy goal is pretty consistent. No?

OK, maybe the integrated prisons part is a but much.

 

[elder999]

OK, maybe the integrated prisons part is a but much.

If only because prisons are pretty much integrated, and there's a lot more of us "mud people" than there are white guys......

 

[ballen0351]

Which part is silly? The part about hunting them down and killing them or the part about locking them up in integrated prison populations?

Our leaders are consistently talking about capturing/killing Al Qaeda. If we are to treat these aryan-type terrorists the same as we would Al Qaeda, then the seek-and-destroy goal is pretty consistent. No?

OK, maybe the integrated prisons part is a but much.

Because they are US Citizens and are protected by the Constitution Al Qaeda is not. We are free in this country to hate anyone for any reason.

 

[granfire]

Because they are US Citizens and are protected by the Constitution Al Qaeda is not. We are free in this country to hate anyone for any reason.

well, they are terrorists, as such subject to prosecution.

Alas, prison populations, how they are made up...they are pretty much integrated, and as such a fertile breeding ground for gangs and extremism....a moderate goes in a fanatic comes out.

And while we can hate anybody for any reason - or no reason, just because, our rights stop where the well being of the other person is concerned...inflicting lead poisoning on them is pretty much well past our rights to strongly dislike them.....

 

[ballen0351]

well, they are terrorists, as such subject to prosecution.

Alas, prison populations, how they are made up...they are pretty much integrated, and as such a fertile breeding ground for gangs and extremism....a moderate goes in a fanatic comes out.

And while we can hate anybody for any reason - or no reason, just because, our rights stop where the well being of the other person is concerned...inflicting lead poisoning on them is pretty much well past our rights to strongly dislike them.....

Who's a terrorist some one that's just a white supremest? That's protected free speech. If they commit a crime then I agree but until then your free to hate anyone you want. You can't force tolerance by law people don't work that way.

 

[WC_lun]

Considering how the people of muslim nations behaved when 9/11 happened, and when the cartoons of Mohammed were published, or when theo van goh made his movie about the abuse of muslim women, I would say that the response of your average American was exemplary. No riots or mass protests against muslims occurred after any of those events, considering 3000 citizens and them more at fort hood were killed. I am proud that the people of my country did not overreact, as they do overseas to the slightest provocation, and that we have not done what others have done under lesser circumstances.

Hmmm...how about some polling of the muslim community here in the states about their feelings for Jews and Christians or about Israel....I'm sure those results would be far more interesting...and yet, we all get along together without the level of violence seen in the rest of the world. This is a great country...

Again, doesn't matter what other places do when it comes to right and wrong.

Saw an interview with the son of the head of the Temple, then talked to a friend about his experiences since 911. He is brown skinned. Granted its the experience of only two people, but it seems racism is alive and well in the States. While most people are not racist, enough people are that it is still an issue. Ignoring it and pretending it doesn't exsist will lead to a road that increases the likleyhood of these type of occurances.

Seems there is information out now that indicates the white supremecist that did this disgusting thing thought it would be a catalyst for other white supremecist to do the same thing.

 

[Wo Fat]

Because they are US Citizens and are protected by the Constitution Al Qaeda is not. We are free in this country to hate anyone for any reason.

Nah. The white supremacist-turned-terrorist is as much an Enemy Combatant as the Muslim American radical-turned-terrorist. Zero sympathy for either.

The "freedom to hate" BS is little more than benign sympathy. What's more it's moot. We're talking about people whose violence is predicated on their hatred.

 

[Wo Fat]

Who's a terrorist some one that's just a white supremest? That's protected free speech. If they commit a crime then I agree but until then your free to hate anyone you want. You can't force tolerance by law people don't work that way.

There are plenty more terrorists who have yet to commit their first act of terrorism. Be they white, Muslim, Black, Asian, Latino, whatever. Can't be sympathetic to the white ones, while being ever-vigilant about the Muslim ones. American history proves it.

 

[ballen0351]

Nah. The white supremacist-turned-terrorist is as much an Enemy Combatant as the Muslim American radical-turned-terrorist. Zero sympathy for either.

The "freedom to hate" BS is little more than benign sympathy. What's more it's moot. We're talking about people whose violence is predicated on their hatred.

Has nothing to do with sympathy. Its has everything to do with the constitution. You are free to hate anyone you want until you commit a criminal act against that person or group. Foreign terrorist captured in foreign lands are not subject to our constitution. So I can hate y group of people I want as long as I don't commit a crime against them its fine. So just like I'm free to hate whoever I want (Steelers fans) your free to hate who you want

 

[Wo Fat]

Has nothing to do with sympathy. Its has everything to do with the constitution. You are free to hate anyone you want until you commit a criminal act against that person or group. Foreign terrorist captured in foreign lands are not subject to our constitution. So I can hate y group of people I want as long as I don't commit a crime against them its fine. So just like I'm free to hate whoever I want (Steelers fans) your free to hate who you want

Nice try, but white supremacists'--i.e., Wade Page--very beliefs include inevitable violence. I'm unclear as to why this isn't evident to you.

 

[granfire]

Who's a terrorist some one that's just a white supremest? That's protected free speech. If they commit a crime then I agree but until then your free to hate anyone you want. You can't force tolerance by law people don't work that way.

well, anybody who seeks to strike terror and fear is, no?
or who seek to interfere with legal activities by using violent and illegal methods and intimidation.

Shooting up a place is certainly a step up from sending hate mail...

(BTW, I feel the same way about PETA and their chronies, like ALF and ELF..)

 

[ballen0351]

Nice try, but white supremacists'--i.e., Wade Page--very beliefs include inevitable violence. I'm unclear as to why this isn't evident to you.

And I'm unclear why you think its OK to round up American citizens because they might do something. Regardless of race until they break the law they are free to believe and think what they want. White or black supremacy groups an it or pro abortion people. I'm more fearful of sovereign citizens movement because they activity target police but they still have the right to feel that way.