Shawn Obasi & Emin Boztepe friendly Chi-sau

[Argus]

Well I'll just call a spade a spade. IMO Emin is better, pure and simple. Obasi doesn't have a chance with Emin. Emin is shutting him down before it ever begins. You don't see the other two doing that.

I think you're comparing apples and oranges.

In the first video, they're not competing. Obasi isn't trying to "fight" Emin, and he isn't trying to win; he's just letting Emin demonstrate on him and teach.

In the Randy Williams video, he's just trying to over power Williams.

Honestly though, I think you should be clear about your intentions. If you want to learn, go ahead and do Chisau. But if you just want to fight, just fight. Don't confuse one for the other.


Edit: I just noticed there were 5 more pages of posts that I didn't read...

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

My problem with Emin... He looks great in seminars. He is commanding in videos. He talks a good game. But, I still can't get out of my mind the video of him and William Cheung wrestling. What a joke that two Wing Chun Masters could not execute basic Wing Chun principles in a REAL fight that Emin provoked. Very laughable. It's hard to take Emin seriously based on that. After all, fighting is what it's all about, not seminars and produced videos. I have seen no evidence that Emin can take care of himself in a real fight.

Ok, I've just started re-reading this thread. And ya'll are being rediculous. SO a 20 year ago video is your basis for your assumption? Thats your detective work? GTFO. Emin was a WELL KNOWN Full contact fighter.

Sounds like this thread needs a K bomb, and im here.

 

[Tames D]

Ok, I've just started re-reading this thread. And ya'll are being rediculous. SO a 20 year ago video is your basis for your assumption? Thats your detective work? GTFO. Emin was a WELL KNOWN Full contact fighter.

Sounds like this thread needs a K bomb, and im here.

I give my honest opinion and you tell me to get the **** out? Well, show me some evidence that might change my mind. And I'm not talking about scripted, controlled seminars where he has complete control. Can you do that? I will change my mind if you can do that. In the mean time you can get the **** out.
I left you a rep and I feel bad because I forgot to sign it. Just want you to know it's from me.
So why don't you do YOUR detective work and show me something that might change my mind.

 

[geezer]

I give my honest opinion and you tell me to get the **** out?...
I left you a rep and I feel bad because I forgot to sign it. Just want you to know it's from me.
So why don't you do YOUR detective work and show me something that might change my mind.

Hey Tames, (if I can jump in for a minute) in my honest opinion Emin is for real, not just for show. Even today ...and he must be in his 50s. But I can't prove it, so if you don't agree, that's your right. Giving out rep, good or bad is your right too. Whatever, but I have to say that you did the right thing posting here to take credit. I've had people give me bad rep a few times and I was OK with that. But anonymous bad rep really stinks.

 

[Tames D]

Hey Tames, (if I can jump in for a minute) in my honest opinion Emin is for real, not just for show. Even today ...and he must be in his 50s. But I can't prove it, so if you don't agree, that's your right. Giving out rep, good or bad is your right too. Whatever, but I have to say that you did the right thing posting here to take credit. I've had people give me bad rep a few times and I was OK with that. But anonymous bad rep really stinks.

Thanks Geezer. I appreciate your post, I think
I just don't like being insulted for giving my honest opinion. If I'm wrong, I have no problem admitting it. But my opinion of that video is that the "fighters" in that video didn't represent fighting very well. Pretty pathetic. I know I hurt Jeff's feelings but all I'm asking is that he show me evidence that Emin can fight in a real altercation, or allow me my opinion without the insults.
Oh btw... I don't give out neg rep much. Only about 4 or 5 times ever. But I will take ownership.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

You didn't so much hurt my feelings as piss me off. I don't care about REP, I just care about my thread; Which was supposed to be people enjoying what I percieved as good WT from the three sifu's and a comparison of them with Shawn Obasi.

"A lot of people talk big-time smack about Obasi, which I hope we don't see in this thread. But reguardless, I'm just really glad to see someone from our martial family getting in the ring " .... Is what I said in the OP.

Ya'll came in here just bashing. There's a more diplomatic way of doing it than just scoffing at Emin's skill. My big problem that ya'll came in and started bashing when all the proof you want is just by going to an Emin workshop next time he's in the state and rolling with him, or if you really want; Challenging him. I'm tired of the no-balls and all talk people who can bash safely from behind their keyboard. You didn't just insult a video; You insulted a promoter of the art, a skilled practioner, and a lifetime martial artist, and in my opinion that is DESPICABLE.

You'll notice when I reference Sifu Kwok, Sifu Williams and Obasi, I use a healthy amount of respect. Even though I don't think much of their skill, I can still maintain my opinion with a certain amount of decorum. You apparently can't, and there is my problem.

So next time you want to come into MY thread; How about you try to keep it light, because thats what I want in my threads. Just easy going discussions with EDUCATED insight or honest questions. Not a bunch of BS. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't apperciate me going into your threads and just bashing. I'm not saying anyone is perfect (and god knows i've done this myself)...

So how about we start fresh and just be nice on here, if not just send me an email and we can figure it out; Off the message board.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

Oh, and thank you for owning up to the REP thing. I do apperciate your honesty sir!

All the best,

Jeff

 

[Tames D]

You didn't so much hurt my feelings as piss me off. I don't care about REP, I just care about my thread; Which was supposed to be people enjoying what I percieved as good WT from the three sifu's and a comparison of them with Shawn Obasi.

"A lot of people talk big-time smack about Obasi, which I hope we don't see in this thread. But reguardless, I'm just really glad to see someone from our martial family getting in the ring " .... Is what I said in the OP.

Ya'll came in here just bashing. There's a more diplomatic way of doing it than just scoffing at Emin's skill. My big problem that ya'll came in and started bashing when all the proof you want is just by going to an Emin workshop next time he's in the state and rolling with him, or if you really want; Challenging him. I'm tired of the no-balls and all talk people who can bash safely from behind their keyboard. You didn't just insult a video; You insulted a promoter of the art, a skilled practioner, and a lifetime martial artist, and in my opinion that is DESPICABLE.

You'll notice when I reference Sifu Kwok, Sifu Williams and Obasi, I use a healthy amount of respect. Even though I don't think much of their skill, I can still maintain my opinion with a certain amount of decorum. You apparently can't, and there is my problem.

So next time you want to come into MY thread; How about you try to keep it light, because thats what I want in my threads. Just easy going discussions with EDUCATED insight or honest questions. Not a bunch of BS. I'm pretty sure you wouldn't apperciate me going into your threads and just bashing. I'm not saying anyone is perfect (and god knows i've done this myself)...

So how about we start fresh and just be nice on here, if not just send me an email and we can figure it out; Off the message board.

I have to admit that you make a good point. My evaluation of the video didn't belong in your thread, and as a result I caused a disruption. I apologize for that. I will stand by my evaluation however, but I was wrong for sidetracking and disrespecting your thread.

 

[jeff_hasbrouck]

I have to admit that you make a good point. My evaluation of the video didn't belong in your thread, and as a result I caused a disruption. I apologize for that. I will stand by my evaluation however, but I was wrong for sidetracking and disrespecting your thread.

Thank you sir, I do very much apperciate it. Let's all just have good times

 

[WahFist]

Hi Geezer,

I was googling about Emin Boztepe and saw this old thread: Shawn Obasi & Emin Boztepe friendly Chi-sau

I started training WT in LA in '94 with a German buddy of mine. Sifu Emin would come by and train with us fairly frequently. I learned what was then the new anti-grappling components of Lat Sao directly from him.

What I don't see in the videos that you shared is a detail that Sifu drilled into us at the time--the key to the headlock defence is footwork. There is a circle step from the outside that kicks into the aggressor's leg on his 'head lock' side. This is what makes the straight arm (which we also learned as a shoulder lock) so disruptive to the attacker's balance.

We also learned another aspect, Emin would grab us in a headlock and completely break our posture. His headlock was not around the neck--it was more of a catch wrestling 'facelock' where he trapped our head and would crush our nose or face with his forearm.

We learned that when your balance has been completely broken that you can't use the inside circle step. Instead, we were taught to drop our hips and turn toward the attacker (with our outside leg now in front of our attacker) as we used the seeking arm to disrupt his balance. As we regained posture, then we would use circle step to disrupt his leg that was closest.

Since then I started practising BJJ, but still, I prefer the WT headlock defence to my failsafe BJJ go to the ground methods.

I realize this advice is five years late, but I thought you might appreciate as I know these techniques were developed by Emin and he is out on his own now.

-WahFist

 

[geezer]

WahFist -- Welcome to MartialTalk! Thanks for the input. I hope you hang around and continue to contribute.

BTW are you still actively training WT?

 

[wingchun100]

The Shaun Obasi dude tends to lean a bit so that would make him susceptible to being pivoted.

I have heard this about him too, although I have never met or done Chi Sao with him.

 

[paitingman]

I am pretty sure there is (or used to be) a video of Shawn Obasi talking about him chi saoing with Boztepe and explaining why he was grunting like that or something haha. I think I remember him talking about having a hurt back and just trying to be a good demo partner at the seminar. Obviously a pretty different attitude than with Williams.

 

[paitingman]

Here it is!
The video's long, but he actually comments on each chi sao video in this thread. It's just cool to get his perspective and he has something good to say about each sifu.

 

[wingchun100]

I am pretty sure there is (or used to be) a video of Shawn Obasi talking about him chi saoing with Boztepe and explaining why he was grunting like that or something haha. I think I remember him talking about having a hurt back and just trying to be a good demo partner at the seminar. Obviously a pretty different attitude than with Williams.

Yeah, the grunts were a little over the top. I was wondering if there was a reason for it.

 

[Anarax]

I'm unsure if this is flirting with fraud busting territory

Here it is!
The video's long, but he actually comments on each chi sao video in this thread. It's just cool to get his perspective and he has something good to say about each sifu.

I've seen a lot of Shawn's videos and more times than not he comes off as a bully with something to prove. Years ago a WC instructor gave some constructive criticism on facebook about his Chi Sao. Shawn's response was going to the guys school and record him challenging him. Shawn challenges the instructor to......... "Chi Sao". Shawn muscles his way through it trying to overpower the guy and show him up. After the exchange Shawn uploads a video bragging about how much stronger and better he was than the WC instructor. Here's the video

Here's him bragging

Here's another video that shows his disrespect

 

[paitingman]

I'm unsure if this is flirting with fraud busting territory


I've seen a lot of Shawn's videos and more times than not he comes off as a bully with something to prove. Years ago a WC instructor gave some constructive criticism on facebook about his Chi Sao. Shawn's response was going to the guys school and record him challenging him. Shawn challenges the instructor to......... "Chi Sao". Shawn muscles his way through it trying to overpower the guy and show him up. After the exchange Shawn uploads a video bragging about how much stronger and better he was than the WC instructor. Here's the video

Here's him bragging

Here's another video that shows his disrespect

idk what this has to do with my post or the chi sao videos we were discussing in this thread

 

[paitingman]

I'm unsure if this is flirting with fraud busting territory


I've seen a lot of Shawn's videos and more times than not he comes off as a bully with something to prove. Years ago a WC instructor gave some constructive criticism on facebook about his Chi Sao. Shawn's response was going to the guys school and record him challenging him. Shawn challenges the instructor to......... "Chi Sao". Shawn muscles his way through it trying to overpower the guy and show him up. After the exchange Shawn uploads a video bragging about how much stronger and better he was than the WC instructor. Here's the video

Here's him bragging

Here's another video that shows his disrespect

However, I can't really argue too much with the videos you shared and points you raised haha. I've seen those clips and thought something similar as well.
I just question their relevance right here.

 

[Anarax]

However, I can't really argue too much with the videos you shared and points you raised haha. I've seen those clips and thought something similar as well.
I just question their relevance right here.

The thread has both "Shawn Obasi" and "Chi-Sau" in the title, thus posting videos of Shawn and his Chi Sau isn't irrelevant. He himself even addresses what happened between him and Randy Williams, thus posting other videos(from his own Youtube Channel) of that behavior is also relevant.

 

[paitingman]

The thread has both "Shawn Obasi" and "Chi-Sau" in the title, thus posting videos of Shawn and his Chi Sau isn't irrelevant. He himself even addresses what happened between him and Randy Williams, thus posting other videos(from his own Youtube Channel) of that behavior is also relevant.

Of course, we all see what you're saying. I just don't see the relevance in the light, friendly, lets-keep-away-from-bashing discussion the OP reminded us he was trying to have in this thread just a few posts up from ours