Racism in Australia?

[Thems Fighting Words]

I believe Australia is one of the most tolerant countries around. Sure there's the occasional riot (partially motivated by race), but as a whole I've seen little evidence of violent racism outside of ethnic gang conflicts (which really only affect those in ethnic gangs). However I read a recent news article about an attack on an Indian student in broad daylight which got me to thinking. Is racism really on the rise? I've been told so by some and occasionally the world media criticizes Australia as racist. But I really just don't see this wonderful country of mine in that light.

Oh here's the story: http://www.theage.com.au/national/train-gang-bashes-indian-student-20090511-azbq.html

 

[mook jong man]

I think the place is probably no more racist than anywhere else in the world , and most people get a long really well . What seems to matter most is not where you come from , but whether you are a good bloke or not .
The scumbags that attacked the indian bloke on the train were just opportunists , he was probably the only one by himself and made easy prey.

They probably would have attacked anyone that looked like they couldn't put up a good fight , some peoples body language even says pick me I'm a victim.

I'm a white dude and I've had gangs eyeball me on the train , although I'm small in height I'm pretty solid , they have never picked on me , I think I must just project a demeanour of don't **** with me or I will hurt you.

I might not beat them all but some of them will definitely be going to the hospital.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

When I was in Perth many years ago, my best friend and I tried to drink our way through the various bars and pubs, and it was great. They loved us (American servicemen) and stood us round after round, very kind. They also spoke of the aborigines (is that still the correct term?) as 'bungs'. It was fairly clear there was not much love lost, and I never saw any aborigines in any of the pubs we crawled through. Niteclubs, yes.

I hope things have changed since then, but my takeaway was that things in Australia were not that much different than things in the US. No offense intended, I really enjoyed my time in Australia.

 

[Makalakumu]

I've read stories about landowners shooting aborigines from airplanes and about stealing a generation of children to force them into government schools. All of that is frightfully recent and sounds very much like my own country in some respects.

Don't get me wrong, I love Australia and would love to visit again, but there are some pretty strong racial attitudes there.

 

[Thems Fighting Words]

I've read stories about landowners shooting aborigines from airplanes and about stealing a generation of children to force them into government schools. All of that is frightfully recent and sounds very much like my own country in some respects.

Don't get me wrong, I love Australia and would love to visit again, but there are some pretty strong racial attitudes there.

I guess seeings as I came to Australia in the 1980s I was a decade too late to experience all that stuff. The "White Australia Policy" (stopping non-Europeans from entering) ended in 1973 and the "Stolen Generations" (taking Indigenous children from their parents to be raised by white Australians) officially ended in 1969. I don't know exactly when laws came in to stop landowners shooting Aborigines. I do know that because of the "Terra Nullius" idea, Aborigines for some time were not considered human but rather a native fauna species. But I think more modern shootings had to do with tresspass laws.

As a historian, I know that Australia (like elsewhere) has had a history of racism. But I believe that many such practices have greatly subsided in the last twenty or so years.

 

[mook jong man]

I've read stories about landowners shooting aborigines from airplanes and about stealing a generation of children to force them into government schools. All of that is frightfully recent and sounds very much like my own country in some respects.

Don't get me wrong, I love Australia and would love to visit again, but there are some pretty strong racial attitudes there.

A lot of those from the stolen generation can be considered the lucky ones . They were mostly taken away because both parents were alcoholics , the kids had malnutrition , didn't go to school , and dad wasn't averse to going the knuckle on mum when he was drunk .

For sure life wasn't always a bed of roses for these Koori kids because they ended up in government homes being abused by so called christians , but the same thing happened to young orphaned British kids that were sent out here after the war .

A lot of the Koori children were lucky and got adopted by white families who brought them up as their own , in a loving environment , with three square meals a day , a warm bed , not having to witness their mother getting seven kinds of crap beaten out of her by their father , and they got sent to school so they could have an education.

Todays Australia is pretty multicultural and tolerant at least in the cities , you might get some redneck attitudes in the country towns , but thats mostly because they have no experience of different people.

But even that is starting to change as the government tries to steer more migrants a way from settling in the major cities and gets them to settle in the some of the country towns which are dying out from lack of population.

I think on the whole we are pretty tolerant these days , you can come here practice any religion you want , wear any clothes you want , eat whatever you want . All we ask is that you have a go and try and become an Aussie and love the place as much as we do.

At least learn to try and speak English or even better speak it the way we do , mix with other Aussies , and don't form little ethnic ghettos where you just stick to yourselves , and don't try and force your customs and outdated attitudes towards women onto the rest of the wider Australian community.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Racism in a land down under?
Where women glow and men plunder?
Can't you hear, can't you hear the thunder?
You better run, you better take cover

There is racism of one form or another just about everywhere, I doubt Australia is exempt.

The Cronulla Riots 2005

 

[Empty Hands]

A lot of those from the stolen generation can be considered the lucky ones . They were mostly taken away because both parents were alcoholics , the kids had malnutrition , didn't go to school , and dad wasn't averse to going the knuckle on mum when he was drunk .

"A lot"? How many is that? How careful were the authorities to insure that only abused children were removed from their homes? According to the "Bringing Them Home" report, between 10 and 33% of children were removed between 1910-1970, varying from place and time. The "Aborigines Protection Amending Act of 1915" allowed removal without establishment of neglect or mistreatment.

Do you really believe then that "a lot" of those children were removed for their own good?

Your own defensive attitudes on the subject show that the scars of the past have yet to heal.

 

[mook jong man]

Racism in a land down under?
Where women glow and men plunder?
Can't you hear, can't you hear the thunder?
You better run, you better take cover

There is racism of one form or another just about everywhere, I doubt Australia is exempt.

The Cronulla Riots 2005

The background to that story is and if you live in Sydney then you would understand what led up to these events . For a very long time we have had groups of young Lebanese wannabee African American gangsters roaming around in cars intimidating young white Australian girls and targeting young white Aussie guys for gang bashings .

They use the rather childish and derogatory term " Skips " to describe white Australians as in Skippy the kangaroo . So a young white girl would be called a " Skippy Slut or something else that was degrading . These neanderthals have an absolute hatred for Australia and Australians , a lot of them carry guns and knives and they have no fear of police , they always travel around in numbers.

From what I understand the only people they fear are the Vietnamese gangs who are more ruthless than what they are but at least stick to only bothering other gangsters.

They are the type of people that if you have to stop next to them at the traffic lights you do not make eye contact at all and try not to attract their attention otherwise they're likely to get out and smash your car with baseball bats or worse.

The police seem to be quite impotent in dealing with them because they want to be seen as politically correct and not branded as racists.
This pressure cooker atmosphere had been mounting for a long time . Starting from a few years before when young Lebanese muslim males specifically targeted young white women and gang raped them , all the while telling them that they deserved it because they were Aussie sluts .

So the anger against these people had been building for a long time . These heroes will not fight you one on one , they tend to use their mobile phones to call up reinforcements so you end up getting bashed by at least 20 of them and stabbed.

With the riot at Cronulla beach that stems from the fact that the locals were sick of young Lebanese thugs coming in from their ethnic ghettos and harrassing the young women on the beach calling them sluts etc because they wore bikinis , intimidating young families with children.

When they bashed some lifeguards who challenged their antisocial behaviour , in the eyes of the community that was the straw that broke the camels back . They were no longer prepared to put up with the intimidating behaviour , the bashings , and the degrading insults to young women .

Australia had opened their arms to these people and gave them a home when their parents fled their war torn country , and instead of gratitude and loyalty to Australia we got insults and derision from these young thugs who preferred to call themselves Lebanese instead of Australian even though they were born here.

So is it any wonder the place erupted , Aussies are a pretty easy going lot but like anyone else if you push us too far we are going to strike back. But the worlds media portrayed it as though we were just a bunch of rednecks on par with the Klu Klux Klan victimising these poor middle eastern youth while conveniently leaving out the details of what led up to these events.

 

[mook jong man]

"A lot"? How many is that? How careful were the authorities to insure that only abused children were removed from their homes? According to the "Bringing Them Home" report, between 10 and 33% of children were removed between 1910-1970, varying from place and time. The "Aborigines Protection Amending Act of 1915" allowed removal without establishment of neglect or mistreatment.

Do you really believe then that "a lot" of those children were removed for their own good?

Your own defensive attitudes on the subject show that the scars of the past have yet to heal.

Sure some of them would have been taken for no good reason , but a lot would have been taken because their parents were unfit to look after them.

And don't tell me I have defencive attitudes champ , my best friend in primary school was an aboriginal boy , and I am friends with many part aboriginal people and they all say the same thing. Their biggest problems are the alcohol and getting " Sit down money ".

 

[Empty Hands]

Sure some of them would have been taken for no good reason , but a lot would have been taken because their parents were unfit to look after them.

Again, how many is "a lot"? Could 33% of aboriginal parents in some locations possibly be unfit?

And don't tell me I have defencive attitudes champ...

Of course you have defensive attitudes. Nearly every line of your posts here are minimizing or defending the indefensible practices of the past. If you weren't defensive, you might say something like "Yeah, we were bad back then, but thankfully things have changed." Instead, you defend it.

...my best friend in primary school was an aboriginal boy...

Are some of your best friends black too?

and I am friends with many part aboriginal people and they all say the same thing. Their biggest problems are the alcohol and getting " Sit down money ".

"They" all say? How many? What percentage? Do they have any data to back them up? What are the national numbers, and how do they compare to whites or other groups in Australia?

Without hard numbers and due consideration, nearly everything you write comes across as baseless stereotyping. Even if everything you said was true to the fullest extent however, it would still not justify wholesale policies aimed against the aborigines. Every situation is unique, and must be evaluated as such. You can't simply say "aborigines are bad parents" or "aborigines are alcoholics" and thus justify extreme racist policies of the past aimed against an entire community.

 

[Empty Hands]

So is it any wonder the place erupted , Aussies are a pretty easy going lot but like anyone else if you push us too far we are going to strike back. But the worlds media portrayed it as though we were just a bunch of rednecks on par with the Klu Klux Klan victimising these poor middle eastern youth while conveniently leaving out the details of what led up to these events.

Maybe they got that idea from some of the slogans on placards and t-shirts borne by the crowd: "We Grew Here, You Flew Here", "Wog Free Zone", "Ethnic Cleansing Unit", "Aussie Pride", "Save 'Nulla", "Lebs out", "**** off Lebs", "Lebs go home", "No Lebs". Or the fact that fascist political groups like the Patriotic Youth League were in attendance.

Or that thousands of people ended up chasing single individuals. You know, the same sort of behavior you condemn from the gangs.

I would have more sympathy for the anger of the preceding events if the mob hadn't turned its attention to single individuals with the right appearance rather than the actual gangs they dislike so much.

 

[mook jong man]

Again, how many is "a lot"? Could 33% of aboriginal parents in some locations possibly be unfit?



Of course you have defensive attitudes. Nearly every line of your posts here are minimizing or defending the indefensible practices of the past. If you weren't defensive, you might say something like "Yeah, we were bad back then, but thankfully things have changed." Instead, you defend it.



Are some of your best friends black too?



"They" all say? How many? What percentage? Do they have any data to back them up? What are the national numbers, and how do they compare to whites or other groups in Australia?

Without hard numbers and due consideration, nearly everything you write comes across as baseless stereotyping. Even if everything you said was true to the fullest extent however, it would still not justify wholesale policies aimed against the aborigines. Every situation is unique, and must be evaluated as such. You can't simply say "aborigines are bad parents" or "aborigines are alcoholics" and thus justify extreme racist policies of the past aimed against an entire community.

Of course we were bad back then , but you can't keep blaming the white man forever , at some stage you have to take responsibility for yourself. Do I still keep blaming the British for sending my ancestors out here in chains and giving them 100 hundred lashes for stealing a loaf of bread. Of course not , you have to forget about the past and get on with life .

Sure the Cronulla riots did not exactly cover us in glory , and a lot of innocent people were victimised by an out of control mob. There are a lot more worse racist countries than Australia , South Africa , Spain and Japan come to mind .

And before you start preaching to us , and bringing up our short comings why don't you sort out your own backyard first , after all weren't you the country that had institutionalised slavery.

 

[K-man]

I've read stories about landowners shooting aborigines from airplanes and about stealing a generation of children to force them into government schools. All of that is frightfully recent and sounds very much like my own country in some respects.

Don't get me wrong, I love Australia and would love to visit again, but there are some pretty strong racial attitudes there.

In past history there were many instances of whites murdering aborigines. However, the last masacre was in 1926, the Coniston Masacre, and it occured after white settlers took over aboriginal land in Western Australia. The aborigines killed a white man, possibly for 'stealing' an aboriginal woman and in the ensuing period police may have killed up to 100 aboriginal people. The official toll is 31. Whatever the number, there was outrage across Australia and steps were put in place to ensure that that type of outrage was never again committed.
As to the shooting of aboriginals from aircraft by landowners ... I have never heard of such an event, nor can I find any reference to it. If it did occur it would have been regarded as murder so I think in may be apocryphal.
The stolen generation is a whole different story. That was the removal of mainly children of white fathers who the authorities believed would have a better chance at life if they were taken and placed in 'care'. There are many stories where this was the case and the children did do well but there are many more stories of terrible outcomes. The children weren't taken because they had to attend school and they weren't taken because their mothers weren't caring for them. The were taken because of their colour.

Don't get me wrong, I love Australia and would love to visit again, but there are some pretty strong racial attitudes there.

There are rednecks in all countries. There is still intolerance but nowhere near as much as there was 50 years ago when I was a kid.
The main problem now is not with aboriginals, although there are still issues that need to be resolved, but with the people identified by 'mook jong man'. People who have no desire to integrate and who have imported the problems that they or their parents came to Australia to escape.
There are a few places I would avoid, particularly after dark, but on the whole I agree with 'Thems Fighting Words' ... I believe Australia is one of the most tolerant countries around. I don't feel uncomfortable in any neighbourhood or on any public transport. :asian:

 

[Thems Fighting Words]

Regardless of whether the Lost Generations scheme was wrong or right is always going to be open to debate. Instinctively today's generation feels that taking children away from families is wrong. However, the creators of the policy had what they considered the best for the children in mind.

As for the Cronulla riots. There were, as has been stated a large number of lead up events. The ethnic group in question fitted poorly to say the least and unlike other ethnic gangs were actively anti-Australian as opposed to just being segragationist. There were a large number of racists present but even more everyday Asutralians who just wanted to "recalim" their community.

 

[Xue Sheng]

The background to that story is and if you live in Sydney then you would understand what led up to these events . For a very long time we have had groups of young Lebanese wannabee African American gangsters roaming around in cars intimidating young white Australian girls and targeting young white Aussie guys for gang bashings .

They use the rather childish and derogatory term " Skips " to describe white Australians as in Skippy the kangaroo . So a young white girl would be called a " Skippy Slut or something else that was degrading . These neanderthals have an absolute hatred for Australia and Australians , a lot of them carry guns and knives and they have no fear of police , they always travel around in numbers.

From what I understand the only people they fear are the Vietnamese gangs who are more ruthless than what they are but at least stick to only bothering other gangsters.

They are the type of people that if you have to stop next to them at the traffic lights you do not make eye contact at all and try not to attract their attention otherwise they're likely to get out and smash your car with baseball bats or worse.

The police seem to be quite impotent in dealing with them because they want to be seen as politically correct and not branded as racists.
This pressure cooker atmosphere had been mounting for a long time . Starting from a few years before when young Lebanese muslim males specifically targeted young white women and gang raped them , all the while telling them that they deserved it because they were Aussie sluts .

So the anger against these people had been building for a long time . These heroes will not fight you one on one , they tend to use their mobile phones to call up reinforcements so you end up getting bashed by at least 20 of them and stabbed.

With the riot at Cronulla beach that stems from the fact that the locals were sick of young Lebanese thugs coming in from their ethnic ghettos and harrassing the young women on the beach calling them sluts etc because they wore bikinis , intimidating young families with children.

When they bashed some lifeguards who challenged their antisocial behaviour , in the eyes of the community that was the straw that broke the camels back . They were no longer prepared to put up with the intimidating behaviour , the bashings , and the degrading insults to young women .

Australia had opened their arms to these people and gave them a home when their parents fled their war torn country , and instead of gratitude and loyalty to Australia we got insults and derision from these young thugs who preferred to call themselves Lebanese instead of Australian even though they were born here.

So is it any wonder the place erupted , Aussies are a pretty easy going lot but like anyone else if you push us too far we are going to strike back. But the worlds media portrayed it as though we were just a bunch of rednecks on par with the Klu Klux Klan victimising these poor middle eastern youth while conveniently leaving out the details of what led up to these events.

So the answer to racism against White Australians is "Leb and wog bashing day"

A number of demonstrators wore clothing bearing racist slogans such as "We Grew Here, You Flew Here", "Wog Free Zone", "Ethnic Cleansing Unit", "Aussie Pride", "Save 'Nulla", "Lebs out", "**** off Lebs", "Lebs go home", "No Lebs",

NSW Deputy Police Commissioner Andrew Scipione afterwards said police believed representatives of neo-Nazi and white supremacist groups had been among the crowd.

Another Herald report stated that a woman and her husband were driving along Canterbury Road on the night of Monday, December 12, when they encountered carloads of men with Lebanese flags hanging out the windows and heard one man screaming, "Do it for Allah!"
At the same time, further carloads of young Middle Eastern men made their way to Maroubra, organised again by the circulation of SMS text messages. Armed with baseball bats, crowbars and bricks, they vandalised private property (including over 100 cars) throughout streets of Maroubra. Many residents took refuge in their homes, while others who tried to confront the gangs were attacked. A 22-year-old man was injured during the unrest, as he was bashed by baseball-bat wielding youths, who attacked his car

The SMH stated that an Australian man, Jake Schofield, was attacked by four Middle Eastern men on 11th Dec. 'All four men jumped from the car, stabbing J two times, striking J with a lump of concrete, and stomping on his head and body several times before stealing his phone and keys - J suffered serious injuries, including a fractured eye socket and nose, and two stab wounds. Two Middle Eastern youths were charged with armed robbery in company with wounding, malicious wounding with intent, assault occasioning actual bodily harm and affray. The two men to be charged, Wael Tahan and Mahmoud Eid, both 19, were allegedly among a group of men who jumped out of a car to attack a man with concrete blocks and stomp on his head - the men were on bail at the time of the alleged attack of Mr Schofield, accused of separate assaults

The SMH stated that an Australian man, Jake Schofield, was attacked by four Middle Eastern men on 11th Dec. 'All four men jumped from the car, stabbing J two times, striking J with a lump of concrete, and stomping on his head and body several times before stealing his phone and keys - J suffered serious injuries, including a fractured eye socket and nose, and two stab wounds. Two Middle Eastern youths were charged with armed robbery in company with wounding, malicious wounding with intent, assault occasioning actual bodily harm and affray. The two men to be charged, Wael Tahan and Mahmoud Eid, both 19, were allegedly among a group of men who jumped out of a car to attack a man with concrete blocks and stomp on his head - the men were on bail at the time of the alleged attack of Mr Schofield, accused of separate assaults

The SMH stated that late on Monday night, December 12, carloads of Middle Eastern men began arriving at Punchbowl Park - "more than a hundred men had armed themselves with guns, machetes, baseball bats, knives, chains and iron bars ... before departing they left their reasons written on the street, 'AUSSI TO DIE', 'INTIFADA', 'IT'S WAR', 'NEVER REST ASSIE DOG', 'YOUS CAME BY CHAINS U CONVICT DOGS', 'WE FEAR NO OZY PIGS' ... slogans identified the authors as being 'Leb' or 'Lebanese' ... There were also a number of crude Lebanese flags drawn on the roadway ... the next three hours, across Cronulla, Maroubra and Brighton-le-Sands, between one and two hundred young Lebanese men smashed scores of cars, stabbed or bashed several people and threatened a number of women with rape

If all that isn't based in racism I don't know what is.

So I am back to there is racism of one form or another just about everywhere, and it appears that Australia is not exempt.

 

[Empty Hands]

And before you start preaching to us , and bringing up our short comings why don't you sort out your own backyard first , after all weren't you the country that had institutionalised slavery.

Indeed. However, I've made no effort to defend or minimize the history of my country. And I also speak out and oppose current racist practices and attitudes in my country. I don't minimize or defend those either.

 

[Thems Fighting Words]

Indeed. However, I've made no effort to defend or minimize the history of my country. And I also speak out and oppose current racist practices and attitudes in my country. I don't minimize or defend those either.

I don't believe mook jong man or anyone else has attempted to minimize or defend the racist actions. Rather pointing out the reasons why such acts occured. I also believe that like myself, many individuals are getting sick of the "White Majority" being blamed for every act of racism in Australia, when in truth ethinic minorities are guilty of it as Xue Sheng's post clearly made evident. Oh and to make it clear. I am not a white Australian. I am an Asian immigrant. I have faced racism but the majority of it was from other immigrants and idiginous individuals as opposed to white Australians.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I don't believe mook jong man or anyone else has attempted to minimize or defend the racist actions. Rather pointing out the reasons why such acts occured. I also believe that like myself, many individuals are getting sick of the "White Majority" being blamed for every act of racism in Australia, when in truth ethinic minorities are guilty of it as Xue Sheng's post clearly made evident. Oh and to make it clear. I am not a white Australian. I am an Asian immigrant. I have faced racism but the majority of it was from other immigrants and idiginous individuals as opposed to white Australians.

Well the story showed a piece of the puzzle and it may very well be the case but the response was equally racist and although in most situations in most countries the response to racism tends to also be equally racist it does not make it right anywhere including Australia. And I have no way of knowing if there were not acts of racism perpetrated upon those of the story long before this happened. Basically I don't know if their racist response is not based on a previous racist situation they had to deal with.

Also there was some rather sever racism in Australia past as there was in the USA and that stuff does not go away quickly. There are places in the US I would not want to go if I where not white. And there are places I will not go because my wife isn’t. So I am guessing even though things may be better today in Australia than they were say 100 years ago I am betting there is still racism in Australia from just about every race that live there in one form or another to varying degrees.

And as a note my Brother-in-law was seriously considering immigrating to Australia (he was almost finished jumping through the hoops) back in 2005 and these riots made him reconsider and not go there and he is Chinese.

 

[mook jong man]

And as a note my Brother-in-law was seriously considering immigrating to Australia (he was almost finished jumping through the hoops) back in 2005 and these riots made him reconsider and not go there and he is Chinese.

Please tell him not to let one incident like that riot dissuade him from moving here , it was a disgrace , but it was an abberation . Things like that rarely happen here.

There are many chinese people and other asian people living here who love it and are making a good life for their families. And if he's into Kung Fu tell him to come to Sydney , we have many Sifu's from Hong Kong here from a plethora of different styles .

Only thing is the price of living here is expensive compared to the other states.