Question?

[IFAJKD]

yeah, but I have found good results with herbs and teas, I just started to explore this area. Enjoy it alot. ddj has worked for me but as you say the recepies do vary. Why reinvent the wheel if anyone knows of one that is ligit I would like to know.

 

[TLH3rdDan]

its the mc dojo infection taking over that is poping out all these 10 year old 3rd dan black belts i personally feel that they should not be allowed to test till they are 18 and should have some sort of junior program for them... as far as young martial artists with high ranks im 23 and a 3rd dan and i can assure you that i worked my *** of for my rank.. and i work my students just as hard... my black belt test was 12 straight hours of pure hell... hour long full contact sparring sessions countless pushups and situps and throwing punchs and kicks till i could not keep count along with performing every kata and demonstrating countless self-defense techniques... by the end of the day when my sifu handed me that belt and said congratulations welcome to the true begining i knew i had earned it... and that is exactly the way i test students now... not as hard core for under black belt...

 

[kenpo_cory]

Originally posted by Rob_Broad

If there was to be anything added to make it harder I would have to say a personal form. Utilizing a full breakdown of every technique and transition. Along with a breakdown of the hows and whys. [/B]

This is exactly what my instructor requires starting at blue belt. It has forced me to really research the principles behind american kenpo, in addition to learning how one move flows correctly to the next.

 

[Klondike93]

Originally posted by GouRonin

Should black belt and subsequent degrees of it be harder to obtain?

I see all these multiple ranked people and many of them are so young. I saw a TKD 8 year old kid who was a 3rd degree on TV.

Myself, I think black belt should not be given out until 18. Before that they should have a junior program or something. I know that kids are school's bread and butter but maybe they can have the same belts but with a stripe or something.

But on top of that it seems that everyone has a black belt these days and many people can't fight their way out of a wet paper bag. Is it too easy now? Jeff was telling us what it was like in the old days.

I consider black the point when people become serious students but how can an 8 year old kid have 3rd degree? He's 8 fer cryin' out loud!

I think if you get your rank easy you will give it out easy. Far too many grandmasters for my liking.

:soapbox:

I agree with you, but I think 16 is ok to promote to black belt. Under that should be some sort of junior program and when they reach 16 or 18 they should have to complete an adult black belt test.
So I wonder what he was a 3rd degree in? Mickey D's martal arts?

:shrug:

Chuck

 

[tshadowchaser]

What system or style are we doing this ranking in? Is the rank in a sport TKD system or a street system, or a system founded by former Navy Seals who only know how to kill and cripple.
Yes I know not all TKD people are into sport. I remember meeting the ROKs.
If we are talking the sport im sorry but I could care less because they are only going to get killed in the street anyway. Hell, what they do should not be allowed to be called a martial art. Now if we are talking the system that truly teaches how to maim and kill Kids should not be allowed in .
I don't like teaching kids but I will. But I let them know that they will not reach black till their 18 (16 if exceptional in mind and ability) and there are many things I will not show them till they are old enough to understand what death and the takeing of life is all about.
Yes I know some kids in other places kill and are at war all their lives but not where I live. If it comes to that I willchange my teaching ways and teach how to kill to all I teach.
Shadow

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Let the 8yr old 3rd Dan got 30 minutes with Gou. Certainly a 3rd Dan can handle 1 Kenpoist.



What is the price to become a black belt? $3.00 wholesale + S/H.

What is the price of a Dan? $1 for the certificate.

What is the price of experience? It is priceless.

:asian:

 

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by TLH3rdDan
as far as young martial artists with high ranks im 23 and a 3rd dan and i can assure you that i worked my *** of for my rank.. and i work my students just as hard... my black belt test was 12 straight hours of pure hell... hour long full contact sparring sessions countless pushups and situps and throwing punchs and kicks till i could not keep count along with performing every kata and demonstrating countless self-defense techniques... by the end of the day when my sifu handed me that belt and said congratulations welcome to the true begining i knew i had earned it... and that is exactly the way i test students now... not as hard core for under black belt...

Why? Did that 12 hours of hell make you a black belt suddenly? Hmm...I would be just as happy if one day after putting in a lot of time and working hard at what I'm doing if my teacher tossed me a black belt and told me to start wearing it.

Why do people still need to have these marathon tests of sparring, punches, kicks, sets, kata, and blah blah blah? When I box we'd work out. That was it. As if one day of doing something can compare to years of use of it. Over that time you have done thousands of kicks and punches, you've done the kata a zillion times, tons of sparring, countless sit ups.

If I was asked to do all of that I'd ask "Why?" and they'd better have a good reason for it.

Vlad explained there is a difference between "activity" and "action" and I agree for the most part. An action occurs when it is needed. It is spontanious. An activity is a response to itself and is unecessary. So any busy work like doing things that don't need to be done for 12 hours straight seems to be an activity.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[D.Cobb]

Originally posted by GouRonin

Why do people still need to have these marathon tests of sparring, punches, kicks, sets, kata, and blah blah blah?

If I was asked to do all of that I'd ask "Why?" and they'd better have a good reason for it.

Quite often you will find that it is not what you do on the day that counts, but how you carry yourself in between times.

For example, our gradings are roughly 5 hours long, we start the day with a run, as a group. We then go through 5 different work stations each timed to fit into the available time. The trial black belts go for longer in each area, thereby giving the lower ranks time to rest and have a drink.

In between times we are watched more closely than during our activities. If we look beaten or run down we will lose points, but if we carry ourselves like we can still do it all again then we gain brownie points toward our grading.

It doesn't matter if you can't get through the hard stuff as long as you give every ounce of yourself on the day. It's hard, but sooooo gratifying at the end. Kinda like hitting your foot with a hammer to make yourself feel better, because it feels so good when you stop.

Hope this sheds some light.
--Dave

 

[arnisador]

Originally posted by D.Cobb


Quite often you will find that it is not what you do on the day that counts, but how you carry yourself in between times.

I find myself agreeing both with this point and with GouRonin's, though overall I agree that when the student is ready, the test is unnecessary. There is some satisfaction, some closure, and some marking of a transition that comes with "passing a test" but I too would be just as happy to be tossed a belt when it's ready. The belt represents years of hard work, not just one day's effort.

I don't like having to grade other peoples' students--as I have done a great many times in Modern Arnis (recommending belt levels to the Professor at camps)--because I can only judge the technical level I see demonstrated, not character, commitment to the art, and so on. Overall, I'm not that enthusiastic about the belt test concept.

How widely used are belt tests in Japan and Korea? I think it's fairly common in TKD, kendo, judo, and so on.

 

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by D.Cobb
Quite often you will find that it is not what you do on the day that counts, but how you carry yourself in between times.

That's my point.

Originally posted by D.Cobb
It doesn't matter if you can't get through the hard stuff as long as you give every ounce of yourself on the day. It's hard, but sooooo gratifying at the end. Kinda like hitting your foot with a hammer to make yourself feel better, because it feels so good when you stop.

Why do you do this?

 

[Chiduce]

Originally posted by paulk

I quite agree

I trained for 14 years to achieve shodan, not because I dont understand or am slow but because I wanted to fully understand what I was doing before I considerd myself worth the rank.

Every one please take the time to promote quality in the martial arts.

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/kempo-jujitsu/

Hey paul that is pretty cool! So you, like myself wanted to understand exactly what you were doing. I'am in the same boat. It took me 22 yrs. to get the same rank. My sifu was pretty proud to see that i was one of his only students to go all the way! Sincerely, In Humility; Chiduce! please feel free to go to my website at http://www.chiduce.swsites.net and http://maxpages.com/butokutsururyu

 

[thaiboxer]

Like my instructor, I don't expect people to call me 'sensei' or 'sir'. If they can pronounce it D), they can call me by my first name. I like it casual, but still respectful...not just to me, but amongst the students as well.

Grrr. Babbling yet again.

Cthulhu [/B][/QUOTE]

Cthulhu you gain more respect from your students if you dont enforce the sensei thing. In fact ill ask - do you think you are respected more? Its how much you give to your students, thats how respect is gained, not through yelling, ranting, raving and enforcing ridiculous conditions within any training facility, due to minor acts of "disrespectfulness".
I respect my kru (trainer) no end due to his passion for what he does, the way he treats me and trains me and tries to help me in everyway he can to become better at what i train in - muay thai.
hes a legendary bloke and highly respected amongst his peers here where i live.
good for you anyhow i like your style

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by tshadowchaser

What system or style are we doing this ranking in? Is the rank in a sport TKD system or a street system, or a system founded by former Navy Seals who only know how to kill and cripple.
Yes I know not all TKD people are into sport. I remember meeting the ROKs.
If we are talking the sport im sorry but I could care less because they are only going to get killed in the street anyway. Hell, what they do should not be allowed to be called a martial art. Now if we are talking the system that truly teaches how to maim and kill Kids should not be allowed in .
I don't like teaching kids but I will. But I let them know that they will not reach black till their 18 (16 if exceptional in mind and ability) and there are many things I will not show them till they are old enough to understand what death and the takeing of life is all about.
Yes I know some kids in other places kill and are at war all their lives but not where I live. If it comes to that I willchange my teaching ways and teach how to kill to all I teach.
Shadow

1. the navy seals use muay thai not TKD
2. sport TKD people might, boxers dont, i wouldnt take on mike tyson, lennox lewis, hell roy jones jnr would have me (most for that matter) for breakfast am im 10 kg (22 lbs) heavier, i respect boxers moreso than any other fighters on this planet.
3. i agree with all you guys on the young black belt thing i think it underrated and some governing bodies of the ancient systems will have to step in and stop all the crap that is being taught around the world at the moment, and the commercialism that corrupts all the arts. they are truly being wrecked and arts tarnished such as TKD for a prime example. most of them are just plain crap, cant fight for nuts.
4. as far as taking lives are concerned, even in thailand very few people actually die in full on ring fights, compared to how many take place, NHB basically, and the TKD guys i spar (ITF & WTF) could certainly not kill anyone from what ive seen. although however slightly possible it may be. im a no bull crap kind of guy and really talking about killing people with some martial arts moves is just down right hilarious (what some people claim to be able to do). And a little kid isnt going to muster enough coordination and power to do this anyway, so who really cares. never mind a lucky shot when your an adult. but they should be restricted to a lower belt and wait or some subsidiary belt i agree.

just my 10 cents worth

 

[Kirk]

Originally Posted By: thaiboxer
they are truly being wrecked and arts tarnished such as TKD for a prime example. most of them are just plain crap, cant fight for nuts

I don't know about being wrecked. TKD is the most popular
style in the U.S right now. Their numbers are far greater than
any other style. I'm baffled as to why it continues this way.

I have a friend studying TKD right now. He refuses to admit that
it's one of the least effective styles for street self defense. He's
been at it less than a year, and he's done a bunch of "double
promotions". He's like 2 or three belts away from black. At the
rate he's going, he'll be ranked a blackbelt in just under 2 years
of training. He won't dare go to another style, because his ego
won't let him start as a white belt. When he's done studying TKD,
he's going to study another Korean style, because they'll more
than likely let him wear his black belt in the do jang. I just hope
his ego will allow him to walk away from a fight, instead of him
attempting to defend himself. His favorite "joke threat" that
he uses on me is "I'll kick you in the head". :shrug: He feels
that's the end all, be all of defense. He doesn't buy that his
balance would be thrown WAY off in order to perform that kick,
and that it's an extreme level of skill necessary to perform that
kick without telegraphing the hell out of it.

When belts are awarded so quickly, I think there's a LOT of
people who like the guarantees of "you'll have a b.b. in 2 years"
I think ego has a lot to do with it. Unless their membership
starts to dwindle, I think it'll be wrecked, but I don't think it'll
suffer after the "wreck" is complete.

 

[thaiboxer]

hi kirk
yeah geez i hope your mate doesnt ever run into anyone who can even averagely defend themselves, and dislike being taunted, its big mouths like that that cop a pasting ultimately. just big noting. i spar against quite a number of TKD exponents, there are two in our class that have recently come across to MT. they are hopeless to say the very least, and in the first couple of times they have sparred still using their TKD technique, as they are accustomed to that obviously. they cop a pasting. A high roundhouse is easily defended by using the forearm as to block a western boxing hook punch or deliberately hit their foot with your elbow to try inflict some damage on them (although this is a little more difficult).
he'll learn the hard way, an easily obtained BB will certainly not help him defend himself any better, he may be of the illusion that he can but hey, real life is what matters, and big noting oneself and ones ability in any aspect in life is usually a sign that there is a weakness there.

 

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by thaiboxer
1. the navy seals use muay thai not TKD

Actually, they use whatever they get their hands on. They are trained to use weapons and explosives and most of the training they get is minimal and they tend to seek out whatever they can on their own time.

This is no ONE art they study as an official group.

 

[thaiboxer]

Originally posted by GouRonin



Actually, they use whatever they get their hands on. They are trained to use weapons and explosives and most of the training they get is minimal and they tend to seek out whatever they can on their own time.

This is no ONE art they study as an official group.

who cares i wouldnt like to come across one of them anyhow in battle. they really would kill you.

 

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by thaiboxer
who cares i wouldnt like to come across one of them anyhow in battle. they really would kill you.

Yeah, guns tend to do that.
:iws:

 

[Chiduce]

Actually, seals are very good hand to hand combat fighters! I've had the honor of meeting a few as well as one of the original UTD guys. This is why the Eagle Globe And Anchor on the Marine Hat and Seal Hat differ only with the Eagle holding it's head down in humility for the Seals. The Navy Seal is also a Marine of the highest honor and humility! They are trained very well. Though as always, it all depends on which type and ones that you would meet up with. Member's of Seal Team 5 are noticably different from members of Seal Team 6. I also have friends that are Delta and Recon. Sincerely, In Humility; Chiduce!

 

[TLH3rdDan]

in response to gou its not the 12 hours that suddenly made me a black belt the 5 years leading up to that point did that... the 12 hours was more of a lets see what your really made of... it was a test of wills it was a are you going to break under pressure... it was a lets see what you have really learned in your training... it was not just an activity.... it was a chance to drive me beyond where i had been and beyond the hows and whys of technique it was to push me to the limit in that 12 hours... and it really never ended... i dont know what more to tell you... here is something that you might be able to compare it to as far as the idea behind it... think of it as a sort of crucible for martial arts... or a hell week for martial artists... all rolled into one 12 hour period... and before you draw your own conclusions... no i am not saying it was just as hard as those two events... i am saying it served the same principal... more or less initiation, a welcoming, a pressure test, a last chance to weed out the week, to see who is for real and who is there for a work out and and a piece of paper. hope that answers some of your questions