Could one say thee are Katas in MMA, Boxing, Wrestling, Football, Baseball, etc.?
Take an interpretive dance class and then look at kata. Better yet, take a look at hula and how it relates to lua. The Okinawan cultural tradition is similar.
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Could one say thee are Katas in MMA, Boxing, Wrestling, Football, Baseball, etc.?
Better yet, take a look at hula and how it relates to lua. The Okinawan cultural tradition is similar.
Is the dance a teaching method though? Kata is for teaching techniques, if the dance is simliar does it too have a meaning other than just doing the movements?
You could say this if memorization was the only goal. Martial arts kata go much deeper, learning patterns that can be adapted to many varied techniques.
Getting back to your question. I could be convinced you might be able to develop a kata for wrestling, less likely for MMA, even less for boxing and not at all for football or baseball.Could one say there are Katas in MMA, Boxing, Wrestling, Football, Baseball, etc.?
Getting back to your question. I could be convinced you might be able to develop a kata for wrestling, less likely for MMA, even less for boxing and not at all for football or baseball.
Could I ask what you understand as 'kata' and how do you see it applying in these areas? :asian:
Thank you well said why some choose to come from on high and speak for all that just because they cannot find it in thier book or a committee or org has not endorsed it? Our group believes and teaches that all MA regardless of style owes its origins to TCM 8,000 years ago. Why refuse to add more richness and reality to your personal training and better personal self defense. We always start when teaching seminars keep an open mind. I think resistance comes from the insecurity of not knowing. When you take away learning that was originally only passed down master to deciple so the public could not comprehend just from watching practice or art forms being required to be taught only as a school sport you are only left with myth and legend for many of the current party base line explainations of movements.Very true. Stuart Anslow and Simon O'Neill have both written books based upon this bunkai/hoshin interpretation methodology. Although there are many in the TKD community that resist this methodology, it is a valid avenue of delving much deeper into the art of TKD (or any art based off of Okinawan karate). It is a growing community within those arts as more and more students desire more 'meat' in their training beyond just the cookie-cutter 'learn a form-get a new belt' method of training.
True. What I was getting at was that boxing has rules to stop holding, therefore kata, which requires some form of restraint to ensure the next technique, will not really work or is not going to work well. Best situation would be a predetermined response against a straight right or a left hook etc. With MMA you could use existing kata or perhaps look at developing something more suited for ground work. That's why I qualified my statement "might be able to develop". Personally, I wouldn't bother, but the question was asked. :asian:You wouldn't need kata for MMA surely as many of the styles encompassed within it already have them, karate, Judo, TKD etc.
True. What I was getting at was that boxing has rules to stop holding, therefore kata, which requires some form of restraint to ensure the next technique, will not really work or is not going to work well. Best situation would be a predetermined response against a straight right or a left hook etc. With MMA you could use existing kata or perhaps look at developing something more suited for ground work. That's why I qualified my statement "might be able to develop". Personally, I wouldn't bother, but the question was asked. :asian:
Getting back to your question. I could be convinced you might be able to develop a kata for wrestling, less likely for MMA, even less for boxing and not at all for football or baseball.
Could I ask what you understand as 'kata' and how do you see it applying in these areas? :asian:
Is Kata a rehearsed routine?
Is it a routine to bring about a degree of awareness?
Will it develop the awareness to a level of profficiency?
Is Kata a rehearsed routine?
Is it a routine to bring about a degree of awareness?
Will it develop the awareness to a level of profficiency?
According to Iain though, who like myself comes from Wado Ryu, there are techniques within the katas for ground work. He is a Judoka as well so can see the movements that work on the ground. Even I can see some and I have to work at it usually. Watching Iain I get alot of 'ah so that's what that is' moments!
Mr Abernethy may come from a Wado background, however his approach is very un Wado in my experience.
Wado-ryu does not have Bunkai - or at least not in the "Okinawan" karate sense.
That said, I am not saying that what he does is bad - far from it, but it's definitely not Wado.
Sojobo
It's the Wado that I know as well as Iain and it's what taught here, it certainly does have Bunkai.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wado-Karate-Do-Kata-Bunkai-Vol-1/dp/B0017HP9GA
http://bunkaijutsu.com/tag/wado-ryu-bunkai/
http://japankarateintern.blogspot.co.uk/2008/06/more-wado-kata-team-kata-team-bunkai.html
http://karatedojo1.tripod.com/id11.html
Perhaps your Wado training didn't include Bunkai? Not everywhere does.
My Wado training includes Kaisetsu, which is quite different to the process of bunkai.
http://www.ishikawa-karate.com/kata/kaisetsu.htm
Sojobo
I think the word Bunkai has become a "must have" within many Karate groups (even Wado ones) without its actual process being trully understood.
It is very much the driving force behind Okinwan karate like Goju-ryu, but of course Wado isn't Okinawan - its Japanese - and in most part, its DNA comes from Koryu Bujutsu (Shindo Yoshin Ryu etc).
If you train with some of the older Japanese intsructors like Hakoishi and Ohgami etc, they will use the expression like "explanation" of movement rather than Bunkai and then it is always within the omote of the kata itself.
This is different from Bunkai.
Does your goup practice Kihon Gumite, Idori and Tantodori etc Tez?
hehe - I've popped over there a few times, and as I say, I don't think what he does is bad - but it's also not Wado. Iain and I have communicated over this (over the years) and tbf he does concede that whilst he uses the "frame" of wado kata to transmit his approaches - he is not suggesting it is Wado.
And, I admire him for that.
Sojobo