Patience Vs. Efficiency

[drop bear]

Yeah, yet more of the same and actually that is your problem.

you don't have to post on threads that don't interest you. I mean not every thread is going to appeal to everybody. But even i am not troll enough to jump on threads that are boring to me and constantly say how boring they are.

just sayin.

 

[PhotonGuy]

So let me ask you all, do you believe patience to be important? Not just for martial arts but for life in general.

 

[Gnarlie]

So let me ask you all, do you believe patience to be important? Not just for martial arts but for life in general.

Absolutely, if you want to have meaningful social interactions.

 

[Buka]

Kind of a Yin/Yang thing. On the one hand you have -

"Patience is a virtue, possess it if you can,
Seldom in a woman, but never in a man."

On the other hand -

Patience is what you have when there's too many witnesses.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Absolutely, if you want to have meaningful social interactions.

Well thats true, and so perhaps I should exercise patience in this thread. That earlier post with Captain Picard I found rather offensive.

 

[Transk53]

So let me ask you all, do you believe patience to be important? Not just for martial arts but for life in general.

Yes, because I have a lack of it PhotonGuy. You have to know it is like to go from zero to one hundred in a nano second. If you can practice one hundred percent patience, then well, share the secret? Probably best not venture into differing patience levels, I would imagine the thread would go South Imho of course!

 

[Transk53]

Kind of a Yin/Yang thing. On the one hand you have -

"Patience is a virtue, possess it if you can,
Seldom in a woman, but never in a man."

On the other hand -

Patience is what you have when there's too many witnesses.

That is a good point. Oh well I am totally boned then as Bender would put it

 

[Transk53]

Well thats true, and so perhaps I should exercise patience in this thread. That earlier post with Captain Picard I found rather offensive.

Why?

 

[Gnarlie]

Well thats true, and so perhaps I should exercise patience in this thread. That earlier post with Captain Picard I found rather offensive.

The mode of expression may not have been the most subtle, but I think Tez3's message behind that post is pretty fair. This is at least the third thread I have seen where you have posted the same theme under different thread titles. I don't post often, but I do read everything on this site - it seems like some members are losing patience with you, which is understandable, because you have been re-wording and re-posting your point in different threads without showing acknowledgement of the opposing points that have been made.

People have given their views, then you've started another thread covering the same topic. In case you haven't sensed it, this makes people feel like you have either not understood or ignored their views, or you value their views so little that you are going to keep posting the same thread until you get the response that suits you. When people don't feel valued, they start to get a bit short.

I can't help but feel you might get further with your understanding if you ask questions rather than making statements, and if you restate the points that others have made, summarising during the discussion to demonstrate that you understand what points are being made, even if you do not agree.

In the threads you have posted, two qualities come across - that you are quite introverted - by this I mean inward looking, self analytical. Also, possibly due to the introversion, you tend to be stuck on transmit rather than receive. If you try to look outward, at what others feel and understand, you may make more progress here.

I mean no attack or offense with this, only that peoples reactions to you here are a mirror of your posting style. I do wonder what you are like in person.

 

[Transk53]

The mode of expression may not have been the most subtle, but I think Tez3's message behind that post is pretty fair. This is at least the third thread I have seen where you have posted the same theme under different thread titles. I don't post often, but I do read everything on this site - it seems like some members are losing patience with you, which is understandable, because you have been re-wording and re-posting your point in different threads without showing acknowledgement of the opposing points that have been made.

People have given their views, then you've started another thread covering the same topic. In case you haven't sensed it, this makes people feel like you have either not understood or ignored their views, or you value their views so little that you are going to keep posting the same thread until you get the response that suits you. When people don't feel valued, they start to get a bit short.

I can't help but feel you might get further with your understanding if you ask questions rather than making statements, and if you restate the points that others have made, summarising during the discussion to demonstrate that you understand what points are being made, even if you do not agree.

In the threads you have posted, two qualities come across - that you are quite introverted - by this I mean inward looking, self analytical. Also, possibly due to the introversion, you tend to be stuck on transmit rather than receive. If you try to look outward, at what others feel and understand, you may make more progress here.

I mean no attack or offense with this, only that peoples reactions to you here are a mirror of your posting style. I do wonder what you are like in person.

Rightly or wrongly, I have always thought a Buddhist Monk.

 

[PhotonGuy]

If you can practice one hundred percent patience, then well, share the secret?

I would if I could but the fact of the matter is, I know no such secret. Patience, or should I say lack of patience, is one of my weaknesses too, but I, working on it.

 

[PhotonGuy]

Why?

Well in and of itself I don't find anything offensive about the fictional character Captain Picard but the way he was presented, putting his hand to his forehead and the wording of the post as well I found offensive. Like I said, I don't automatically find it offensive to see a picture of Captain Picard putting his hand to his forehead but rather, how it was directed at me I find offensive.

 

[PhotonGuy]

The mode of expression may not have been the most subtle, but I think Tez3's message behind that post is pretty fair. This is at least the third thread I have seen where you have posted the same theme under different thread titles. I don't post often, but I do read everything on this site - it seems like some members are losing patience with you, which is understandable, because you have been re-wording and re-posting your point in different threads without showing acknowledgement of the opposing points that have been made.

People have given their views, then you've started another thread covering the same topic. In case you haven't sensed it, this makes people feel like you have either not understood or ignored their views, or you value their views so little that you are going to keep posting the same thread until you get the response that suits you. When people don't feel valued, they start to get a bit short.

I can't help but feel you might get further with your understanding if you ask questions rather than making statements, and if you restate the points that others have made, summarising during the discussion to demonstrate that you understand what points are being made, even if you do not agree.

In the threads you have posted, two qualities come across - that you are quite introverted - by this I mean inward looking, self analytical. Also, possibly due to the introversion, you tend to be stuck on transmit rather than receive. If you try to look outward, at what others feel and understand, you may make more progress here.

I mean no attack or offense with this, only that peoples reactions to you here are a mirror of your posting style. I do wonder what you are like in person.

Well in this thread I wasn't posting the same thing I was actually posting how my viewpoints have changed. At one time I thought that patience was a recipe for failure because I was confusing patience with efficiency. I posted threads explaining how I was against patience and now, in a big part because of other people's responses, I view patience differently and that is what this thread is about. So I post a thread about how my viewpoints have changed and I get a Captain Picard with his hand to his forehead. Is that fair?

As for members losing patience with me, it was people on this board who explained to me about the value of patience in the first place, perhaps they should set an example?

 

[Gnarlie]

Well in this thread I wasn't posting the same thing I was actually posting how my viewpoints have changed. At one time I thought that patience was a recipe for failure because I was confusing patience with efficiency. I posted threads explaining how I was against patience and now, in a big part because of other people's responses, I view patience differently and that is what this thread is about. So I post a thread about how my viewpoints have changed and I get a Captain Picard with his hand to his forehead. Is that fair?

As for members losing patience with me, it was people on this board who explained to me about the value of patience in the first place, perhaps they should set an example?

You are saying your viewpoint has changed, but reading your posts and comparing them to your others, it's not that clear how, and it is really not clear whether you have actually understood the views of others. That I think might be why some frustration has become evident in your threads.

I think in order to minimise that frustration, you might need to try the following:

Stop using metaphor / allegory / comparisons with 'vs' to describe things. The examples you choose are often only valid from your perspective and only muddy the waters in terms of communication. For example, martial arts is not a race to be run, nor is learning a physical skill the same as academic learning, nor are patience and efficiency comparable.

Restate the points made by others to demonstrate that you understand. When people feel misunderstood or ignored they get frustrated.

If your views have changed and you want to state that, then try stating what you thought (directly), what you think now (directly) and what made you change your mind (directly).

Patience is a virtue and a gift to be granted to those who deserve it. If you want people to be patient with you, you have to go some way towards proving that their patience will not be wasted - posting what people perceive to be repeated incorrect points (regardless of their actual validity or otherwise) will quickly exhaust patience you may originally have been afforded.

 

[PhotonGuy]

You are saying your viewpoint has changed, but reading your posts and comparing them to your others, it's not that clear how, and it is really not clear whether you have actually understood the views of others. That I think might be why some frustration has become evident in your threads.

I think in order to minimise that frustration, you might need to try the following:

Stop using metaphor / allegory / comparisons with 'vs' to describe things. The examples you choose are often only valid from your perspective and only muddy the waters in terms of communication. For example, martial arts is not a race to be run, nor is learning a physical skill the same as academic learning,

Analogies often are really good for describing stuff.

[QUOTE="Gnarlie, post: 1685459, member: 27131"nor are patience and efficiency comparable.
[/QUOTE]
That's what I said in my first post in my thread.

The fact of the matter is, I don't mean any harm in any of my posts and yet I get blasted. Is it fair for me to get blasted when I don't mean any harm?

 

[Tez3]

That earlier post with Captain Picard I found rather offensive.

Feeling offended is what as known as a narcissistic injury.

 

[Danny T]

When people make statements about what another said being offensive my first thought is:

"You Are Offended?! How does it feel to be so weak the words hurt you".

 

[Tez3]

 

[PhotonGuy]

Feeling offended is what as known as a narcissistic injury.

Be that as it may there are rules on this forum.

 

[Steve]

Analogies often are really good for describing stuff.

That's what I said in my first post in my thread.

The fact of the matter is, I don't mean any harm in any of my posts and yet I get blasted. Is it fair for me to get blasted when I don't mean any harm?

Hey, PhotonGuy. Analogies can be VERY helpful when explaining things. But putting one things "vs" another isn't an analogy. It's something called a "false dillemma." An example of a false dillemma is when you say to your child, "You can have peas or green beans with dinner. Your choice." The idea is that you are giving an illusion of choice and limiting the scope of the discussion. There is no acknowledgment that one could have both green beans AND peas, or neither of the two.

In the same way, patience VS efficiency sets up a false choice. It frames them as mutually exclusive which kind of sets the wrong tone for the discussion.