Non-martial training in martial arts

[jobo]

Wow... so... say... if someone said martial arts had fitness benefits, provided scientific evidence to the effect, and invited others to come watch or participate in the class, that makes them a religious zealot? Just... wow...

i think a lot of ma, has distinct cultish elements to it yes, if the health benefits always our way the psychological issues, is debatable

 

[Gerry Seymour]

well yes and religious zealots' as well

My point was that behavior is far from unique to yoga enthusiasts. Baseball enthusiasts try to talk others into going to games. Rock climbing enthusiasts think everyone will find joy in rock climbing. And so on.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

i think a lot of ma, has distinct cultish elements to it yes, if the health benefits always our way the psychological issues, is debatable

That wasn't even an answer to the post, Jobo.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

i don't think I'm attacking you at all, I'm questioning the universal health benefits that are claimed for yoga. The fact you cant differentiates between the two, does indeed reveal a phycological dependence on it, or as some less charitable than myself may call it, religious zeal

do you think a rational soccer player would feel attacked if i said soccer was dangerous to your health, ? Or not as good as basket ball?

They might if you called soccer "hokum".

 

[jobo]

That wasn't even an answer to the post, Jobo.

yes it was,she asked if a ma who recommends ma could be considered a religious zealot, and the answer was Yes, that may well be the case

 

[jobo]

My point was that behavior is far from unique to yoga enthusiasts. Baseball enthusiasts try to talk others into going to games. Rock climbing enthusiasts think everyone will find joy in rock climbing. And so on.

no that doesn't work as a comparison, if i said to a base ball man, I've got a bad back, he seems unlikely to say, watch base ball that will cure it, or indeed that i has balance problem, it seems unlikely that a rock climber would say do a free climb a few thousand feet, that will cure it. There is i agree a fine line between enthusiast and obsessive, but yoga seem to cross that line more than most, perhaps only ma comes close

 

[Gerry Seymour]

yes it was,she asked if a ma who recommends ma could be considered a religious zealot, and the answer was Yes, that may well be the case

No, she asked if a MA who recommended MA and provided scientific evidence to support the recommendation would be considered a religious zealot. That's an important distinction, which you ignored in your reply. You responded to a question other than the one asked.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

no that doesn't work as a comparison, if i said to a base ball man, I've got a bad back, he seems unlikely to say, watch base ball that will cure it, or indeed that i has balance problem, it seems unlikely that a rock climber would say do a free climb a few thousand feet, that will cure it. There is i agree a fine line between enthusiast and obsessive, but yoga seem to cross that line more than most, perhaps only ma comes close

Meh. A lot of physical endeavors are pushed by the people who like them. Runners often tell people they'd feel better if they ran. Hikers often tell people they'd be more relaxed if they spent time hiking. And so on. It's probably more extreme with things like yoga and MA, because of the sheer breadth of claims often paired to those activities, but it's certainly not exclusive to them.

My original point was simply that enthusiasts tend to think everyone will be as enthusiastic as they are, if they'd only give it a try.

 

[jobo]

They might if you called soccer "hokum".

i doubt it to b honest, there quite a lot of people who will feel personally attacked if i say the team they support is ????, but i consider them to be mental inflicted, and arises from them using association with a particular team as part of their self esteem, they can't differentiate them self's from their hobby( obsession) but saying soccer in general was &&&&, wouldn't normally cause upset, unless they were particulary unbalanced

 

[jobo]

No, she asked if a MA who recommended MA and provided scientific evidence to support the recommendation would be considered a religious zealot. That's an important distinction, which you ignored in your reply. You responded to a question other than the one asked.

the. Scientific evidence is irrelevant, with or with out scientific evidence of health benefits, you may very well be taking about joining a cult.

cults generaly have some benefits or no one would join in then. First place.

 

[AngryHobbit]

i don't think I'm attacking you at all, I'm questioning the universal health benefits that are claimed for yoga. The fact you cant differentiates between the two, does indeed reveal a phycological dependence on it, or as some less charitable than myself may call it, religious zeal

do you think a rational soccer player would feel attacked if i said soccer was dangerous to your health, ? Or not as good as basket ball?

I never claimed universal health benefits for yoga. So, your accusation is pointless - since it is based on something I've never said.

 

[jobo]

Meh. A lot of physical endeavors are pushed by the people who like them. Runners often tell people they'd feel better if they ran. Hikers often tell people they'd be more relaxed if they spent time hiking. And so on. It's probably more extreme with things like yoga and MA, because of the sheer breadth of claims often paired to those activities, but it's certainly not exclusive to them.

My original point was simply that enthusiasts tend to think everyone will be as enthusiastic as they are, if they'd only give it a try.

as an aside, whilst in hospital a couple of tears ago, i git friendly with a Muslim lad, who was sweet and kind and generous, he couldnt however stop himself from telling me that taking the Islamic faith would cure very nearly all problems.

i went as far as a attending a few mosques with him, where the most striking feature was what a good work out the Islamic prayer ceremony was, no wonder they felt good after prayer, i took up the exercise and didn't bother with the religion

 

[jobo]

I never claimed universal health benefits for yoga. So, your accusation is pointless - since it is based on something I've never said.

i was laughing at your xchanges with tez, as you have exactly the same" take any view but my own as a personal attack posting style.

you need to differentiate, between someone that has a view over than yours and some one attacking you personality.
further more, you need to split people talking in general terms and people attributing a specific view to you

 

[AngryHobbit]

the. Scientific evidence is irrelevant, with or with out scientific evidence of health benefits, you may very well be taking about joining a cult.

cults generaly have some benefits or no one would join in then. First place.

Scientific evidence is irrelevant? You know who says that most often? People who can't be bothered with education and religious fanatics. So... what does that make you?

And how is anything I said suggestive of joining a cult. Let's see:

1) I said yoga has health benefits, and certain forms of it have the intensity of cardio and weight lifting.
2) I said scientists recommend yoga to people for heart benefits and orthoapedic benefits (I did not claim yoga fixes everything - that would be ridiculous).
3) I said we have all sorts of people in my class, including athletes and regular folks, people who joined because they were curious and people who were sent there by their doctors.

Where do you see anything cult-like in this? For your information, while I am a person of a certain faith, I do not belong to any religious organization or any particular church. As a life-long scholar and scientist, I am deeply averse to any sort of cults. And I never get involved in any physical activity without researching it first, which I did with all my current fitness undertakings, including martial arts, yoga, zumba, step, and cross-training for mud runs. I do every single one of those things every week, I do them in groups of people - also a mixed bunch, there for various reasons, and, if anyone asked me if I would recommend those activities, I'd say yes, but ask your doctor first, because it might not work for you. So, does that make me a member of five different cults? Oh, wait, I also like reading and following up on scientific research in medicine, physics, chemistry, and various areas of engineering. And I would recommend those too, because scientific evidence suggests those things are good for brain development. So, sign me up for a few more cults.

 

[AngryHobbit]

i doubt it to b honest, there quite a lot of people who will feel personally attacked if i say the team they support is ????, but i consider them to be mental inflicted, and arises from them using association with a particular team as part of their self esteem, they can't differentiate them self's from their hobby( obsession) but saying soccer in general was &&&&, wouldn't normally cause upset, unless they were particulary unbalanced

And how are they supposed to feel. "Hokum" is hardly a compliment. As are some of the other nouns and adjectives you used. What's the matter, you can dish out derogatory terms, but can't accept responsibility?

 

[AngryHobbit]

i was laughing at your xchanges with tez, as you have exactly the same" take any view but my own as a personal attack posting style.

you need to differentiate, between someone that has a view over than yours and some one attacking you personality.
further more, you need to split people talking in general terms and people attributing a specific view to you

You insulted what I do and then you lied about what I said. I consider that pretty personal. If you don't like it - don't say offensive stuff to people.

And what I talk about to other people is none of your business. This is about what YOU said, because you chose to make an offensive and ignorant statement and are now refusing to take responsibility for it. If you are going to spout ignorant drivel, be prepared to get push back. Like I said - grow up.

 

[jobo]

Scientific evidence is irrelevant? You know who says that most often? People who can't be bothered with education and religious fanatics. So... what does that make you?

And how is anything I said suggestive of joining a cult. Let's see:

1) I said yoga has health benefits, and certain forms of it have the intensity of cardio and weight lifting.
2) I said scientists recommend yoga to people for heart benefits and orthoapedic benefits (I did not claim yoga fixes everything - that would be ridiculous).
3) I said we have all sorts of people in my class, including athletes and regular folks, people who joined because they were curious and people who were sent there by their doctors.

Where do you see anything cult-like in this? For your information, while I am a person of a certain faith, I do not belong to any religious organization or any particular church. As a life-long scholar and scientist, I am deeply averse to any sort of cults. And I never get involved in any physical activity without researching it first, which I did with all my current fitness undertakings, including martial arts, yoga, zumba, step, and cross-training for mud runs. I do every single one of those things every week, I do them in groups of people - also a mixed bunch, there for various reasons, and, if anyone asked me if I would recommend those activities, I'd say yes, but ask your doctor first, because it might not work for you. So, does that make me a member of five different cults? Oh, wait, I also like reading and following up on scientific research in medicine, physics, chemistry, and various areas of engineering. And I would recommend those too, because scientific evidence suggests those things are good for brain development. So, sign me up for a few more cults.

no its irrelevant to my point, not irrelevant to the world in general, I'm generaly a fan of scientific evidence , unless its being presented selectivly by a religous zealot, Scientology uses " science" as well

 

[jobo]

And how are they supposed to feel. "Hokum" is hardly a compliment. As are some of the other nouns and adjectives you used. What's the matter, you can dish out derogatory terms, but can't accept responsibility?

I'm here to give my views, if you want compliments speak to your husband, if your offended by my views, in fact it seems by any view but your own, then you need to look to yourself, and ask is someone calling yoga hockum REALLY worth getting hot and bothered about?

 

[Gerry Seymour]

i doubt it to b honest, there quite a lot of people who will feel personally attacked if i say the team they support is ????, but i consider them to be mental inflicted, and arises from them using association with a particular team as part of their self esteem, they can't differentiate them self's from their hobby( obsession) but saying soccer in general was &&&&, wouldn't normally cause upset, unless they were particulary unbalanced

If they are enthusiasts, it'll likely bother them if you insult the thing globally and in response to them putting it forth as a good whatever. How they handle that (and whether you see it) is another matter. Most people handle stuff that bothers them a little without it being much of an issue.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

no its irrelevant to my point, not irrelevant to the world in general, I'm generaly a fan of scientific evidence , unless its being presented selectivly by a religous zealot, Scientology uses " science" as well

Scientology uses the word, not the actual thing, so far as I can tell.