Need more advice in cane fight practice

[lklawson]

It is so laughable of like TKD or Wing Chung to raise the forearm and elbow to block the punch, all the fancy sticky hands. WHAT A WASTE OF TIME EVEN TO PRACTICE THOSE. You get killed using that. My teacher did not even make us practice any of those. We only practice katas 2 weeks before belt test.

Because your assumption wrong and it was commonly done in the era when bare knuckle boxing was the way you boxed? Maybe that's why? Carl Cestari called it "the Vampire Guard" because it reminded him of Bela Lugosi sweeping Dracula's cape in front of his face.

Even general "karate-like" parrying was common.

There are, literally, hundreds more:

https://www.martialtalk.com/media/the-swing-mike-donovan-1893.25343/full

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Because your assumption wrong and it was commonly done in the era when bare knuckle boxing was the way you boxed? Maybe that's why? Carl Cestari called it "the Vampire Guard" because it reminded him of Bela Lugosi sweeping Dracula's cape in front of his face.

Even general "karate-like" parrying was common.

There are, literally, hundreds more:

https://www.martialtalk.com/media/the-swing-mike-donovan-1893.25343/full

Okay, but what is with the shorts in this picture?

 

[lklawson]

You and I don't have the same definition for fancy. Up to this point, a lot of the things that you say are fancy aren't. Most of what you have been pointing out is either an advance technique or a technique you don't understand.

I used to use upward blacks all the time when sparring and that's when I relied on my Karate skill set. I wouldn't have any problems using them today. I can use the upward block to jam my forearm into a person's face, use it against an incoming punch., or use it to pin a punch.
You make the assumption that a technique has only one use / one application.

A lot of the techniques in Kata and Chinese forms will have multiple applications for the same technique.

I've been arguing for years that the "traditional" karate-style two-step blocks (High, Middle, and Low) are actually misunderstood. The first step where you "chamber" the block isn't a chamber, it's the block (well, an inside parry, anyway). The second part, the hard "block" part is actually a ripost (counter-strike) with a backfist. So someone punches at your face and you open-palm parry the punch and then backfist with the same hand.

I first realized it when I was reading Jack Dempsey's Championship Fighting boxing manual. The technique is seen in plenty of other bare knuckle boxing material but Dempsey liked (taught) to bring your fists up and out, leaving a pretty clear path to your face between them. This baits the other person into punching at your face and you know it's coming. You swat it away and ripost with a backfist. It works super sweet. You just have to pay attention to someone who doesn't take the bait and wants to throw body blows and rib shots.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[lklawson]

Okay, but what is with the shorts in this picture?
View attachment 27944

Yeah, the Daisy Dukes are definitely not what modern "manly men" think of for boxing.

I guess they stayed cool. No air conditioning back then.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[JowGaWolf]

This baits the other person into punching at your face and you know it's coming.

You could probably write a book entirely on how to bait someone in martial arts or show the techniques that have use it. It's some pretty sneaky stuff and if you show it, without explaining it, people will say "I'll just punch you in the face." which is exactly what the martial artists wants. "a punch directed at his face." The punch that he knows is coming.

That's when the "Art" comes into play. The understanding of human behavior and body mechanics at that level is amazing to me.

 

[lklawson]

You could probably write a book entirely on how to bait someone in martial arts or show the techniques that have use it. It's some pretty sneaky stuff and if you show it, without explaining it, people will say "I'll just punch you in the face." which is exactly what the martial artists wants. "a punch directed at his face." The punch that he knows is coming.

That's when the "Art" comes into play. The understanding of human behavior and body mechanics at that level is amazing to me.

Muhammed Ali would have been the dude to write that book.

He knew every trick in that book, from the basic to the sophisticated "long game."

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Dirty Dog]

Okay, but what is with the shorts in this picture?
View attachment 27944

Combat wedgie. Very effective.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

OK. Thanks.

Yeah, sometimes slogging through pics and the written word for a given technique can be somewhat dry.

I like Hutton's stuff for the most part. I have a fencing Maestro friend who says he thinks Hutton's duelling sabre is a good system. From him, that was a very solid endorsement.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

Interesting. That dueling Sabre is the stuff that grabbed me. I like watching Sabre fencing most of all. I don’t know what im looking at most times, and it is FAST. I find the movements with a Sabre more comparable to what I do.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Combat wedgie. Very effective.

Lmao!

 

[JowGaWolf]

Floyd Mayweather
This is how I use it the upward block sometimes. There's more than one application of it.

Floyd using it again. In this clip he lands a punch in the opening that is created by the rising block.

Rising block used against a jab.

Rising Block under the chin. This is close to my application of it. If the Boxer doesn't throw a jab, I still follow through with the rising block sending it towards the face. It will then cause your opponent's head to be backwards. At this point your opponent is blind to your attacks. and lacks the structure to land solid attacks on you.

The biggest difference is that in the pictures above it's being used defensively like a shield. The way that I use it would be illegal in Boxing, because I would use my forearm and elbow to use the rising block as a strike. As you can see. It's not fancy. Lots of fighting systems have a rising blocks and use rising blocks.


There is a difference between practicing technique in form/kata, and technique in application. When a form or kata is done, it's pure. Pure meaning it focuses only on the technique and not any of the elements that you have to deal with when fighting. It simplifies the action of that technique. Once that technique is programmed into your mind and body. You'll move into the application learning environment so you can learn about everything else that the form/kata removed. Because the technique is programmed into your mind and body. You don't have actually about it as you sparring. You know how it feels and you will be able to see and feel when you can use it vs. trying to think "Can I use this technique now?"

 

[JowGaWolf]

Combat wedgie. Very effective.

Naw man. you're full of poo poo. lol

 

[Alan0354]

Does the knuckle of your thumb normally stick out like that? Does your right hand look ike that? Looks like something is out of place. Sprained thumb?

Not sure if I would be hitting any bags if I had bruising on my thumb like that, even if it's just a bruise.

yes, it is normal like this. I never have problem with my thumb. Even when I was hitting the bag last Sunday, it was not the joint that is painful, it's clearly the compression on the part where the bruise first appeared that hurt(between the two joints, not the joint).

Well, I got to hit the bag to get the strength. I'll get over it, I just posted because it never happened like this for almost a year of regular hitting the bag until I started practicing using whole body to strike. I think it must be the added force that caused that. Just like punching the pole, you get used to it and it will be that much better later.

Thanks

 

[Alan0354]

You "disagree" with actual video proof, just like you "disagree" with actual court cases, merely because you don't like it and would really really like to believe something else? So the plan is to stick your fingers in your ears while chanting, "I can't hear you"???

OK. Let us know how that cognitive dissonance works out for you.

Just let it go, don't try to pick a fight. Put me on ignore. PLEASE. Don't you have better things to do?



To Dirty dog:
Are you the moderator? You gave thumbs up to his insult against me. I know you agree with him. But at the same time you ARE the moderator. Are you suppose to maintain a friendly environment on this forum regardless of your own opinion. It is him that started the insult from day one. I really too busy to argue. There is a difference between disagreement vs down right INSULT.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Well, I got to hit the bag to get the strength.

Practicing on an injury is never good. It would be better to give it 3 or 4 days to heal and then practice on an uninjured hand. It will be interesting to see how this turns out for you. Practice or No Practice.

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

Just let it go, don't try to pick a fight. Put me on ignore. PLEASE. Don't you have better things to do?



To Dirty dog:
Are you the moderator? You gave thumbs up to his insult against me. I know you agree with him. But at the same time you ARE the moderator. Are you suppose to maintain a friendly environment on this forum regardless of your own opinion. It is him that started the insult from day one. I really too busy to argue. There is a difference between disagreement vs down right INSULT.

I don't see an insult in that post. Crass yes, but he's not insulting you.

If there was an insult on day one, there is a report option you can use, so we're all aware and can take action to it. I only skim threads nowadays personally after the first/second page, so there might be much that I miss. Some of the other mods are the same, or will read full threads but only certain ones.

 

[Oily Dragon]

Just let it go, don't try to pick a fight. Put me on ignore. PLEASE. Don't you have better things to do?



To Dirty dog:
Are you the moderator? You gave thumbs up to his insult against me. I know you agree with him. But at the same time you ARE the moderator. Are you suppose to maintain a friendly environment on this forum regardless of your own opinion. It is him that started the insult from day one. I really too busy to argue. There is a difference between disagreement vs down right INSULT.

Oh how I wish I could thumbs down this post.

You just said don't try to pick fights, but suddenly you're all full of the usual "MMA works TMA don't" claptrap, in a thread about cane fight practice. I call that picking fights. Be careful, a lot of TMA folks here are actually skilled. I can tell.

Skidoosh, man. Please, stay on topic, and know that if you badmouth Chinese kung Fu like that again, I may have to get terse. Don't make me get terse.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Okay, but what is with the shorts in this picture?
View attachment 27944

The bigger the Bow / ribbon on the belt the smaller the shorts?

 

[Alan0354]

Hi

I rush to make this video even though I am not ready. Just want to show what I have been practicing lately. I change quite a bit because of the videos on the close quarter stuffs, so I added into practice a lot more thrusting, parallel cane to push/thrust to the body or face. I start adding kicks. On the second part, I change to a lighter padded stick because I meant to throw it down. Don't want to throw the heavy cane and break something.

I am thinking about in close quarter, it's better to lose the cane and start using knee and elbows. Holding onto the cane will hinder more than help.

From rushing, I know everything is half A$$ as I cannot concentrate in body movement or do anything precise. Just want to rush to show what I am practicing. Please comment.

Thanks

 

[Alan0354]

Oh how I wish I could thumbs down this post.

You just said don't try to pick fights, but suddenly you're all full of the usual "MMA works TMA don't" claptrap, in a thread about cane fight practice. I call that picking fights. Be careful, a lot of TMA folks here are actually skilled. I can tell.

Skidoosh, man. Please, stay on topic, and know that if you badmouth Chinese kung Fu like that again, I may have to get terse. Don't make me get terse.

Sorry to offend you, I don't mean to. I thought it is at least better to insult the particular person to their face. I thought that's the way not to direct confrontation.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Just let it go, don't try to pick a fight. Put me on ignore. PLEASE. Don't you have better things to do?



To Dirty dog:
Are you the moderator? You gave thumbs up to his insult against me. I know you agree with him. But at the same time you ARE the moderator. Are you suppose to maintain a friendly environment on this forum regardless of your own opinion. It is him that started the insult from day one. I really too busy to argue. There is a difference between disagreement vs down right INSULT.

I think you wouldn't get such a hard time if you just state that "this is the what you want to learn and they way you want to learn it." I think that is something everyone understand

You don't "get into trouble" until you start talking about what's Fancy and what doesn't work. And often times is about stuff that other people actually use in sparring. It's like someone saying in the chat that Long Fist punching techniques don't work. Anyone that says that will get a lecture from me, because it's something that I use with ease so I know it works.

I also think you'll be ok if you say that some techniques work for you and some do not. That's better than just saying "that the technique is crap just because it doesn't work for you." But don't invalidate a technique or system just because it doesn't work for you or fit your preference.