Modern Arnis Lineage List or chart

[arnisador]

I have heard of some karate and TKD organizations that use a provisional/temporary/probationary 0th dan belt for 6 months to a year. But I also had heard that the extra brown belt and extra black belt ranks were typos of just the form you had mentioned.

Have it been decided how you will recieve your next promotion when the time comes? From the DAV as an organization, or from the 8th degree in the Philippines, or from respected martial artists in other styles?

 

[DoctorB]

Originally posted by Renegade

John was the first full time Modern Arnis school teaching Modern Arnis only.

We are in agreement on this point. As I noted in my post, Sifu Don Zanghi, taught Tracy Kenpo and Modern Arnis as "matching partners" from white belt through black belt. He was also the first IMAF Area Representative and he was John Bryant's, instructor in both arts until, John, cut a back-door deal with professor, to get his lakan rating, plus open the Filipino Martial Arts Academy. I did mention that John exclusively taught Modern Arnis. As such he was the first 'full time' Modern Arnis School in the area, but *most definately not* the first Modern Arnis program.

Jerome Barber, Ed.D.

 

[DoctorB]

Originally posted by Renegade

The following are the Black Belts that started in Buffalo or came to Buffalo for their training. Several of these people may have trained with more than one teacher. This list represents who was their primary influence. Most of the head instructors became direct student of GM Presas.

Don Zanghi produced the following students:
Jerome Barber
John Bryant
Gary Castanza

John Bryant produced the following students:
Tim Hartman
Dave Smith
Tammy Wilson

Tammy Wilson produced:
Peter Kautz

Dan Carr Produced:
Bob Chesbro

Tim Hartman 6th Degree produced the following students:
Kevin Black
Jeff Rech
Jeffery Leader
Ron Murcin
Mike Alfano
Mike Antecki
A. Paul Dawdy (Canada)
John CS Lehmann
Paul O’Grady
Amy Antecki
David Battaglia
Gene Cunningham
George Harris
Primo Luciano
Mark Mosler
Mike Milazzo
David Pajak
Mike Rogers
Tim Unger
Jordan Yee

Dr. Jerome Barber produced the following students:
Richard Curren Black - Lakan
Tim Kashino Black - Lakan
Tom Verga Black - Lakan

The following is the complete list of Black Belts from Buffalo with rank issued by GM Presas:

1.Tim Hartman--------------6th Black - Lakan Anim

2.Dan Carr------------------Rank 4th or 5th???

3.Jerome Barber-----------3rd Black - Lakan Tatlo
4.Kevin Black---------------3rd Black - Lakan Tatlo
5.Bob Chesbro--------------3rd Black - Lakan Tatlo
6.Jeff Rech-------------------3rd Black - Lakan Tatlo
7.Don Zanghi---------------3rd Black ???

8.Jeffery Leader------------2nd Black - Lakan Dalawa
9.Ron Murcin----------------2nd Black - Lakan Dalawa

10.Mike Alfano--------------1st Black - Lakan Isa
11.Mike Antecki-------------1st Black - Lakan Isa
12.John Bryant--------------1st Black - Lakan Isa
13.A. Paul Dawdy-----------1st Black - Lakan Isa (Canada)
14.John CS Lehmann-------1st Black - Lakan Isa
15.Paul O’Grady-------------1st Black - Lakan Isa

16.Amy Antecki--------------Black - Dayang
17.David Battaglia----------Black - Lakan (belt revoked by GM Presas)
18.Gary Castanza----------Black - Lakan
19.Gene Cunningham------Black - Lakan
20.Richard Curren----------Black - Lakan
21.George Harris-----------Black - Lakan
22.Tim Kashino-------------Black - Lakan
23.Peter Kautz--------------Black - Lakan
24.Primo Luciano-----------Black - Lakan
25.Mark Mosler-------------Black - Lakan
26.Mike Milazzo------------Black - Lakan
27.David Pajak-------------Black - Lakan
28.Mike Rogers-------------Black - Lakan
29.Dave Smith--------------Black - Lakan (belt revoked by GM Presas)
30.Tim Unger---------------Black - Lakan
31.Tom Verga--------------Black - Lakan
32.Tammy Wilson----------Black - Dayang
33.Jordan Yee--------------Black - Lakan


* The people listed above have been issued OFFICIAL IMAF diplomas from GM Presas. These ranks have not been bestowed by WMAA, IMAF Shea, IMAF Delaney, MARPPIO, DAV, etc. Although, some of them have since been awarded such ranks in addition.

Tim,

I want to make a couple of corrections to your list.

John Bryant, is Professor's student, not Don Zanghi's. John only completed is first level brown belt at Fighting Back Institute. He cut a deal with professor to receive his lakan rating and then opened the FMAA with Professor's blessing. That opened a very large wound that never quite healed between the three men. It also adversely affected David Smith and Tammy Wilson, because there were aspects of the Modern Arnis program that Sifu Don had learned and taught after the split, but we, the nexxt group of students were never allowed to share any of that information with anyone from the FMAA. If you think back to your student days there, we almost never attended any of Proofessor's seminars at the FMAA, nor did you or your classmates attend the seminars at FBI. Isn't interesting when you think about it, Professor did two seminars in the Buffalo area on the same weekend but for the most part the students and instrucors of the FMAA and FBI, only went to one! John Bryant is Professor's student!

Richard Curren and Tom Verga are actually Lakan Isa. They each tested after being awared their Lakan's in Michigan that they attended with you as the lead instructor frooom the Buffalo. Richrad received his lakan isa in North Carolina and Tom's was in Philidelphia. Please update your records.

Jerome Barber, Ed.D.

 

[DoctorB]

Originally posted by arnisador

This was what I meant to say. Dr. Barber is correct that the story is more complicated than that. I knew many but not all of the details he mentions and most of the people. Thanks for clarifying the matter!

Thanks Arnisador,

This stuff brings back both good and bad memories. Perhaps now some readers will have a better appriciation of just how
well I and some others from the late 70's know about the foibles and strengths of the late Professor.

Jerome Barber, Ed.D.

 

[Dieter]

I have heard of some karate and TKD organizations that use a provisional/temporary/probationary 0th dan belt for 6 months to a year. But I also had heard that the extra brown belt and extra black belt ranks were typos of just the form you had mentioned.

OK, I don´t know about the US. Here in Germany it is not used at all.

Have it been decided how you will recieve your next promotion when the time comes? From the DAV as an organization, or from the 8th degree in the Philippines, or from respectedmartial artists in other styles?

Very good question. This problem (not my personal situation but the general problem) is exactly the question and the reason, why I initiated the thread: "Grandmaster of Modern Arnis", that you can find here.

I am in the same situation as Tim Harman, Randi Shea, Dan Anderson etc., so people, that are heading a Modern Arnis group.
For us in Germany it is not such an unusual situation, to make gradings and promotions, because we have been doing that for 20 years now (not that high though). We always had our grading requirements.

But in the US it is different I think, because all the degrees came from Remy before.

As far as it conserns me, it is not in my hands and nothing is decided. I will let you know if/when it happens.

I think, as the situation is now, (and not only for me but for all the others in that situation) the first two solutions that you propose are honorable ones, the third one is not really acceptable or relevant. I could not imagine accepting a Modern Arnis degree from somebody with no connections in the Modern Arnis world.

But this topic will come up eventually, when student levels get higher (4th and 5th Dans), that the organisations have to to think about, what and how to handle the degree of the person at the top.

I think it has to be discussed and thought about.

I would appreciate to hear other other opinions about this topic, or even make another thread out of this.

Best reards from Germany


Dieter Knüttel
Datu of Modern Arnis

 

[DoctorB]

Originally posted by Dieter

OK, I don´t know about the US. Here in Germany it is not used at all.

Very good question. This problem (not my personal situation but the general problem) is exactly the question and the reason, why I initiated the thread: "Grandmaster of Modern Arnis", that you can find here.

I am in the same situation as Tim Harman, Randi Shea, Dan Anderson etc., so people, that are heading a Modern Arnis group.
For us in Germany it is not such an unusual situation, to make gradings and promotions, because we have been doing that for 20 years now (not that high though). We always had our grading requirements.

But in the US it is different I think, because all the degrees came from Remy before.

As far as it conserns me, it is not in my hands and nothing is decided. I will let you know if/when it happens.

I think, as the situation is now, (and not only for me but for all the others in that situation) the first two solutions that you propose are honorable ones, the third one is not really acceptable or relevant. I could not imagine accepting a Modern Arnis degree from somebody with no connections in the Modern Arnis world.

But this topic will come up eventually, when student levels get higher (4th and 5th Dans), that the organisations have to to think about, what and how to handle the degree of the person at the top.

I think it has to be discussed and thought about.

I would appreciate to hear other other opinions about this topic, or even make another thread out of this.

Best reards from Germany


Dieter Knüttel
Datu of Modern Arnis

Hello Dieter,

It seems to me that this is an issue that a number of people have stead-fastly avoided trying to answer, because that same question has been asked on this forum several times in the past by several different people.

I have suggested that we could open a thread to discuss this matter or it could be a topic for discussion at the upcoming 2003 Symposium. If people would like that to happen at the Symposium, they will have to write me or post the request on
this forum.

It is a very real concern - just how does one go above the 6th degree level that seems to be the upper limit of ranks in the USA, Canada and Europe? Seems to me that this needs to be discussed.

Jerome Barber, Ed.D.

 

[oatmeal]

Been a while since posts on this subject, but I remember two guys from Massachusetts that ran a school called Kicks and Sticks. They both had black belts awarded by Remy Presas. I believe they were direct students of his. The school is closed now. Not sure if they are still active.

Ernie Laberge - 4th or 5th degree
Dave Belanger - 1st or 2nd degree