Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
There you go again, trying to tell people what they do, and you have no first hand experience with it. Give it a rest.
Kung fu in MMA Wins
- Thread starter JowGaWolf
- Start date
Flying Crane
Sr. Grandmaster
Which origins? Different people developed similar techniques independently. You think these things each came from one single source?
Martial D
Senior Master
If that was true fights would all be over pretty fast. Yet they aren't.
Martial D
Senior Master
Martial D
Senior Master
Sigh
You use a low inside crescent kick to block the incoming kick, you then change your inside crescent kick into a knee level (or groin level) side kick. This is the basic long fist kicking training that I learned when I was 14 during my 1st month of my long fist class.
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OP
OP
I once tried to learn karate from pictures. It was the most difficult thing ha ha ha. But I'm glad I can understand it now. lol.
OP
OP
ha ha ha. mad because you clicked? or mad because you dont' agree? lol
Not saying that you are wrong about that. Just curious. Click bait or not it has lead to a good discussion.
Side kick
Jung Ga: Round house kick , side kick 1996. Good ole punch from a mile out demo lol.
Jow Ga Side kick
Choy li Fut round house kick
crane side kick. I don't know what this is but it's got a side kick
Hanzou
Grandmaster
One should never use a cross as his 1st punch.
You have evidence from before Bruce Lee days kung fu already have these kicks. I am not a historian, maybe you can educate me. I just know TKD is recognized and respected for these kicks, in teaching and Olympics.
Like I said, I've seen a lot of kung fu demo and movies in hong kong, I have friends that were very into it that time and showed my their kung fu. Those kicks were NOT known until Bruce Lee.
OP
OP
It's not a definite No. You can use it as your first punch, if for example, I use my lead hand (mirrored stance) to control my opponent's lead hand. I can use my lead hand to move your lead hand towards your center toward your punching arm and move to the outside of that lead hand then I can successfully use that reverse punch.
But as shown in that demo video. I wouldn't punch from a mile out and definitely not with a rear punch. If I want my first punch to be a reverse punch then my lead hand must clear the way. In terms of attacking with punching. The demo is not a direct visual of how those techniques would go down. For me that video is more of a concept video than an application video. Kicking to the ribs or abdomen while your opponent is punching is a concept.
Some how, the Kung Fu community seems to be very stubborn and too much pride. 30 years after Gracie whoop their butt, they still don't want to learn take down defense. If they learn take down defense, they can have a chance to go back to the UFC and show case.
They should have open mind and be humble enough to admit their short coming and learn. Like my school in the 80s, the school teach very little of traditional TKD, we forgo the wide horsestand, big stepping one step at a time those USELESS moves, punching from the hip all that stupid yesterdecade moves, learning from Bruce Lee, front leg round and side kicks, boxing hands........ We practice forms........TWO WEEKS before the belt test, then forget it right afterwards.
We concentrated on actual kicking on the pad while the partner holding it so one can get the feel of the kick, the other can get used to being kicked to the stomach and chest(through the bag). This is progress. The instructor never claim that is traditional TKD, he pretty much glorified Bruce Lee with a big picture of Lee hanging.
Maybe the Kung fu school has more open mind and humble in US, sure NOT in hong kong. They only know to bad mouth instead of changing and invalidate others..............OR say they have that too, that they just don't use it.
When I saw UFC I, 2 and 3, I said S*&%, what should I do?!!! I immediately start learning Iron Palm of Kung Fu thinking if that works, that would be the answer to the tackling. Their bad is exposed and I can iron palm the back and hurt the guy...............THEN I got fooled by the lies of iron palm that only gave me two carpal tunnels.
No, that's a good thing, BUT we don't claim TKD has boxing hands and dance like boxing too, we give credit to Bruce Lee and boxing. Our teacher was so humble that he actually invited a Jujitsu instructor to come every other month and taught us some Jujitsu. This is 1984, almost 10 years before Gracie BJJ conquered the whole MA scene ing UFC.
Be humble, do NOT take credit if it is not true. This is what I HATE about those so called "masters" of kung fu in Hong Kong. I hope in US, they learn to have an open mind and be humble like my school. Know your limits, LEARN instead of invalidating other styles.
What is MMA.......MIXED Martial Arts.....Emphasize MIXED. They admit at the very first word it's MIXED.
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OK, your style invent those too!!!!
If you use your leading hand to control my leading arm, your cross will not be your 1st move, but your 2nd move. When you do that, none of these could happen in this clip.
It's good to train partner drill. But it's not good to train unrealistic partner drill.
In wrestling, it's very difficult to be able to control your opponent's
- leading leg, and
- back arm,
at the same time.
An initial cross just give you that opportunity.
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How much CMA have you trained?
CMA has as much take down defense as Judo, wrestling, and BJJ have.
As far as I know, BJJ is not interested in take down defense training.
Hanzou
Grandmaster
Yet not enough to stop an actual takedown.
Well yeah, because it’s more efficient/important to deal with what happens after getting taken down.
It reminds me of a vid of Marcelo Garcia going against one of those Kung fu exponents who are supposedly hard to take down. Garcia took him down rather quickly. Since resisting the takedown was the core of his grappling knowledge, once Garcia got him on the floor Mr. Kung Fu really didn’t know what to do afterwards.
OP
OP
You can still do what is shown in the clip. Step parry to the outside of a punch and kick to the abdomen. That's totally do able. In theory the 45 degree step to the outside is all that you need. In actual practice, the lead hand parry followed by a kick will be able to control that lead hand before it gets the punch off. Which is the correct way to do that technique.
I do agree with you that the partner drill should be realistic, but that's a demo so I don't see it as a drill. I see it as concept. This is how I read the first technique concept demo. Concept: Step to the outside of the punch and kick under punch.
Actual technique. Keep your lead hand up to address your opponent's lead hand guard to prevent the punch from having a clean launch. The 45 degree off center step and your lead hand move at the same time. As you step off center use your lead hand guard to help ensure that any attempt by your opponent to launch a lead punch will be redirected with your lead hand. In this scenario redirected simply means denying the punch a linear path to your face. You do not wait for the punch but attack the lead guard with the understanding that your movements will trigger your opponent's lead punch. The off center step has to happen at the same time as your lead hand addresses your opponent's effort, or will to punch you with that lead hand.
If your opponent gets the punch started then use your lead hand to prevent the punches traveling a linear path to your face. By the time this action occurs, your stepping foot should have root allowing you to kick under the punch. If your get to your opponents lead hand before the punch launches then pin that hand against your opponents body giving you the option to follow up with a reverse punch during the pinning or a different kick to the knee or leg of your opponent.
The 45 degree off angle step should naturally cause your opponent's eyes to follow the larger body mass and ignore the kick.. What I described is a possible application of what was shown as a concept.
Concepts demos are very general. They show an idea but not a true application. They often leave out the important bits. Those who are familiar concepts will be able to fill in the important parts. I can't tell you right now that using that concept as an "step for step" application without adding important parts will get you knocked out. The purpose of the video "I hope" was to show the concepts of the various types of kicks. If they thought they were showing applications then they were fooling themselves.
Here's an example of concept of a flying car. Very general. It leaves out the details that make it work. If you don't know the important parts that makes this concept work, then you'll either won't fly, or you'll kill yourself trying.
