Joe Rogan smack talking TMA's like kung fu

[JowGaWolf]

You know you really can compare them. The second a competitive fighter is allowed to bite or scratch or pull hair they are going to.

There are pacing differences. But they are generally not rules driven.

So you can have these running battles where some moves become higher percentage and the tactics change. But the basic mindset really dosent.

You wouldn't own the field just because you can eyegouge.

ha ha ha.. I stand corrected. Those Russian fighters always messing up somebody's argument. I saw that video when I was looking for the MMA team fight video. Russian always has some crazy fight videos. That competition is about as close as you can get without anyone dying. lol no one has died doing it right?

 

[JowGaWolf]

All of those shots that were thrown in competition you mean? And that as a fighter you would have to be aware of.

Oh yeah in a street fight you definitely have to be aware of stuff like that. Someone like me would at some point in the fight target the groin if I see an opportunity to be successful in landing a snap kick to the groin. Me person would never assume that someone won't kick me in the nuts.

I actually do something stupid from time to time such as spar without a cup and not having that cup makes me totally aware lol.

 

[Tez3]

I actually do something stupid from time to time such as spar without a cup and not having that cup makes me totally aware lol

Teach a children's martial arts class, you will learn very quickly to defend yourself form the most unexpected shots and especially groin shots, one kid took out one of our assistant instructors, the kid 'headbutted' him in the groin just by running at him and being the right height lol. Of course, I laughed.

 

[JowGaWolf]

You know you really can compare them. The second a competitive fighter is allowed to bite or scratch or pull hair they are going to.

There are pacing differences. But they are generally not rules driven.

So you can have these running battles where some moves become higher percentage and the tactics change. But the basic mindset really dosent.

You wouldn't own the field just because you can eyegouge.

No one is going to allow intentional eye gouging in a competitive fight. Eye gouging is serious a people have gone blind in their eye because of it. There would be a bunch of one eyed fighters walking around if eye gouging was legal.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Teach a children's martial arts class, you will learn very quickly to defend yourself form the most unexpected shots and especially groin shots, one kid took out one of our assistant instructors, the kid 'headbutted' him in the groin just by running at him and being the right height lol. Of course, I laughed.

ha ha ha.. so true. I remember when I thought I could just spar with a kid and just take it easy on them. It's not like they had the strength to hurt me. That mentality lasted all of 15 seconds. I turned my head to glace at something and the next thing I knew that kid kick me in my groin. The kids thought it was funny.. Every since then I'm on guard big time when sparring with kids.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I wasted all of my time posting here and I should have just posted this and called it a day.

 

[Tez3]

ha ha ha.. so true. I remember when I thought I could just spar with a kid and just take it easy on them. It's not like they had the strength to hurt me. That mentality lasted all of 15 seconds. I turned my head to glace at something and the next thing I knew that kid kick me in my groin. The kids thought it was funny.. Every since then I'm on guard big time when sparring with kids.

Muay Thai shin blocks are great when kids try to kick you especially when their parents are watching, it just looks as if you have lifted you leg a little but the pain caused to said child is satisfying ( it's always that child who tries to kick you) but the parent can't say anything because you didn't appear to do anything wrong.

 

[Hanzou]

I wasted all of my time posting here and I should have just posted this and called it a day.

I certainly hope you're not saying that you agree with that video. The guy's argument in there is pretty silly.

Not only did he cut up Rogan's comments and took them out of context, but the prop up of Wing Chun as a complete system over MMA is pretty laughable in of itself.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Uh, I brought it up in a list of changes that happened to China between 1870 and 1920, showcasing why those two points in Chinese history are different. I'm still waiting for you to tell me how the martial arts practiced by the Chinese "military" in 1894 (or I guess 1931) is relevant to a discussion about Sanda ground fighting.

You brought it into the discussion so you must have felt it relevant at the time, I am simply trying to find out if the statement of yours was actually based in knowledge or just thrown out to make you sound like you had knowledge. At this point, based on your refusal to answer I am pretty sure you were just trying to appear that you had knowledge that you do not actually have.

I am satisfied with this, thank you.

which war are you talking about, and how is this relevant to the topic?

So you are now saying you do not remember your own post that specifically said which war as well as showing you did not comprehend my last post that clearly stated which war and why it could understood which war based on your choice of years. And it is relevant because again, you threw it out there and if you understand the history you should be at least taken seriously. However since it appears you do not then there is no reason to take any part of your posts in this third seriously because it appears you really do not know what you are saying on this point

I'm sure that I already stated that western boxing was incorporated into Sanda. I'm sure I can find some western influence in the throwing aspects too if I decide to care enough to dig deeper.

That is not to the versions of Sanda that is to what is found in it. You are talking about things incorporated into sanda here, not the different types of Sanda. Again you seem to not really know what you are talking about as it applies to Sanda since there are distinct versions of it. And if you do not care enough to dig deeper then you don't care enough to understand the statements you are throwing out there about it and also do not really know what you are talking about as it applies to Sanda

Oh brother...

Again, you are the one that made an issue of it so I do not understand why quoting Whinny the pooh applies at all. I was simply posting in order and you are the one that took issue with the order things were posted in so I explained and apparently you took issue with that as well... so be it

Based on your refusal to answer and take ownership for the things you posted, bottomline here is that you do not appear to know anything about the topic as it applies to Sanda and even less about anything Chinese history or the martial arts of China.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Why couldn't another system not just be better?

Why am I not surprised you don't get it

 

[drop bear]

Why am I not surprised you don't get it

Because you know I would not accept a statement at face value.

And would assume that if you looked at different methods and compared them. It is more likley there would be a difference in effectiveness rather than all the methods working the same.

This would be consistent for any method of doing anything.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Because you know I would not accept a statement at face value.

Nah, not even close, but if it helps your self esteem to think that then you go for it

 

[drop bear]

I wasted all of my time posting here and I should have just posted this and called it a day.

The issue you have is that if your components don't add up then the whole system falls down. Joe didn't get this either. So if you do mma and can't box then if you get into a situation where you either have to box or defend boxing then you are going to be bashed.

This is why boxing is part of mma.

So the argument flows on that if you have all the dirty tricks in the world but can't box or defend boxing on the street if you get in that situation you will get bashed.

So the question you would ask then is how does wing chun compare in those basic ranges of fighting?

 

[drop bear]

Nah, not even close, but if it helps your self esteem to think that then you go for it

No really. If I said all methods of eating ice cream are the same. Then it would be looked at sceptically.

I mean we could be comparing eating it with a spoon to flinging it at a wall and licking it off.

There will be methods that are consistantly more effective and efficient.

 

[JowGaWolf]

The issue you have is that if your components don't add up then the whole system falls down. Joe didn't get this either. So if you do mma and can't box then if you get into a situation where you either have to box or defend boxing then you are going to be bashed.

This is why boxing is part of mma.

So the argument flows on that if you have all the dirty tricks in the world but can't box or defend boxing on the street if you get in that situation you will get bashed.

So the question you would ask then is how does wing chun compare in those basic ranges of fighting?

I couldn't answer that question because I don't do Wing Chun lol. But using your argument, If a boxer steps on the street and can't kick or defend against kicking then the wing chun guy may end up beating boxer. Not knowing boxing doesn't guarantee a win for the boxer. If I had to fight a boxer then I would definitely fight the boxer where he is weak, for most boxers that's the legs.

 

[drop bear]

I couldn't answer that question because I don't do Wing Chun lol. But using your argument, If a boxer steps on the street and can't kick or defend against kicking then the wing chun guy may end up beating boxer. Not knowing boxing doesn't guarantee a win for the boxer. If I had to fight a boxer then I would definitely fight the boxer where he is weak, for most boxers that's the legs.

Correct. the aim would be to finish the fight without engaging in a punching exchange. And on the street with no gloves no rules this would be a case of if you got caught in a loosing punching battle you would be done in seconds. Two or three uncontested strikes and you will have trouble defending yourself.

 

[Tez3]

This is why boxing is part of mma.

Well that's why stand up is part of MMA, doesn't have to be 'boxing' (stance is wrong for MMA for a start) per se. people watch MMA see punching and striking while standing and assume it's 'boxing'.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I've already posted articles where the authors have said that the Chinese view Bjj and MMA (and other ring styles like Sanda and Muay Thai) as being more effective than traditional Kung Fu styles.

That is what drop bear would call 'anecdotal evidence'.

 

[kuniggety]

If he had kept the fight standing up then he would have been able to keep distance by moving

There are many more videos out there. Strikers fighting multiple people in a street fight
Not a street fight but a professional one. 2 vs 1 MMA fight. When the 1 grapple at the end or choose to stay on his feet

A lot of traditional art schools have 1 vs multiple attackers scenarios, unscripted. I know my school has it and I've seen other school do it. The purpose of the drill is survive, avoid being taken down, avoid being cornered, avoid being hit from solid attacks and strike when the opportunity presents itself.

The drills aren't full force because it becomes dangerous for the attackers once the defender reaches a certain skill ability because then it becomes dangerous. By this I mean that the attacker could be attacking one person and then suddenly launch an attack at someone who is behind them, which catches the attacker off guard. We had to actually tone down our scenarios because of this safety issue.

Vid 1: He got a lucky KO on the first guy. That's what was cool about the fight. Minus that KO, the fight would've went quite different.

Vid 2: The kids didn't circle the kid nor did any of them try to tackle him. They all pretty much ran in and let themselves get punched out by the kid. It was kind of funny to watch.

Vid 3: This one I thought was actually pretty cool. The guy obviously had some mad boxing skills. Kudos to him. I wonder what the outcome would have been if he couldn't run backwards though. He ran backwards which allowed him to fight one on one.

I am definitely not advocating a person not train striking. However, grappling should be in a person's arsenal. I don't care how well you think you can control the distance... you're eventually going to get cornered, you're going to get hit by the guy you didn't see, you're going to trip, etc and down you're going to go and you're going to need to know what to do. Also, if your intent is to subdue or control a single person, then striking isn't always the best method for doing so. Grappling will allow you to do that. You have to know when and where to use each style.

 

[drop bear]

Well that's why stand up is part of MMA, doesn't have to be 'boxing' (stance is wrong for MMA for a start) per se. people watch MMA see punching and striking while standing and assume it's 'boxing'.

Well here we can get technical and suggest whose boxing stance. To whose mma.

Kosta tszyu had a nice mma ish style.

But yeah it dosent have to be boxing. It depends where your strengths are.