It's Raining Grand Masters.

[Tames D]

I think in some circles it's not uncommon for "Grandmasters" to "sign" for each other (sign a rank certificate) as a tit for tat, which explains why you get people with 8th Dans in 10 different arts. Not worth the paper it's printed on, but it sure looks good.
Personal peeve of mine: Instructors who use the term "Professor" to describe their role as a martial arts teacher, but having ro relationship with any university.

Agreed. I always had trouble connecting the two. I wonder if the Professor on Gilligans Island was a Kenpo 6th Black, lol.

 

[arnisador]

As a professor myself, that drives me crazy too. Remy Presas was a university (adjunct?) professor in the Phil. and the title stuck. Over here some arts have even made it an "official" title. We don't give black belts to new Ph.D.s...don't give professorships to new black belts!

 

[wade]

Nolerama, go here, brouse around and enjoy yourself. BTW, still looking for that patch.

http://www.usakarate.org/links.html#usakf

 

[tshadowchaser]

Are there really organizations that "sell" grandmaster titles?

way to many of them out there.
I have been offered the title ( for a price) with at least 4 different organizations. other tittles where also offered : professor, soke, headmaster, etc. each had a price on it and would mean less to me than the paper they where written on as i would view it as a wasted of paper

 

[tshadowchaser]

are there places that sell that title??

way to many of them out there.
I have been offered the title ( for a price) with at least 4 different organizations. other tittles where also offered : professor, soke, headmaster, etc. each had a price on it and would mean less to me than the paper they where written on as i would view it as a waste of paper

 

[MJS]

Sadly, this practice is not limited to the complete frauds. I have seen even reputable places let some losers past to high rank when Mr Green talks.

Yes, I'm sure that does happen, unfortunately. It is good to know though, that there are still some people out there that are still 'old school'.

Mike

 

[MahaKaal]

Its a sad fact that due to the ego and greed of various individuals, such "Grand Masters" pop up everywhere. In the art I practise, the Gurdev (Teacher) opens himself up to what is termed Hadh Thor (bone breaking) challenge, where anyone can challenge the teacher to test his skill and the skills taught in the Akhara (Training School). If any real practitioner finds that an individual has set up a school without Aagaya (permission) then the person will be challenged to see how much he knows. This type of challenge and testing is what keeps true schools alive, and makes sure that imposters do not hijack the name of the art to appease their ego and wallet.

 

[newGuy12]

If any real practitioner finds that an individual has set up a school without Aagaya (permission) then the person will be challenged to see how much he knows.

Awesome.

 

[Rich Parsons]

As a professor myself, that drives me crazy too. Remy Presas was a university (adjunct?) professor in the Phil. and the title stuck. Over here some arts have even made it an "official" title. We don't give black belts to new Ph.D.s...don't give professorships to new black belts!

And many who teach at a College or University are not professors they are Lecturers.

 

[exile]

As a professor myself, that drives me crazy too. Remy Presas was a university (adjunct?) professor in the Phil. and the title stuck. Over here some arts have even made it an "official" title. We don't give black belts to new Ph.D.s...don't give professorships to new black belts!

Reminds me of the little pre-printed signs you used to see in those old, vanishing mom-and-pop convenience stores: We have an arrangement with the bank: they don't sell ice cream and we don't make change. :lol:

 

[Steel Tiger]

As a professor myself, that drives me crazy too. Remy Presas was a university (adjunct?) professor in the Phil. and the title stuck. Over here some arts have even made it an "official" title. We don't give black belts to new Ph.D.s...don't give professorships to new black belts!

We do give them funny hats though!

You're right though. This trend, mostly in FMA, seems to stem from an idiosyncracy associated with Remy Presas. It is even more notable for those of us from England and Australia because a professor is a senior member of a university faculty whereas I get the impression that the US usage is more like that of a synonym for lecturer or teacher.

I can just see the rank system now

1 Assistant Professor
2 Associate Professor
3 Professor
4 Distinguished Professor
5 Professor Emeritus

Probably needs a few more so you can get to an 8th.

Actually, you know that doesn't sound too bad. and people might think you know something too.

 

[arnisador]

This trend, mostly in FMA, seems to stem from an idiosyncracy associated with Remy Presas. It is even more notable for those of us from England and Australia because a professor is a senior member of a university faculty whereas I get the impression that the US usage is more like that of a synonym for lecturer or teacher.

I see it in many arts but I think you're right about the FMA--Remy Presas was entitled to its use but others have picked it up since then (cf. 'soke' in the JMA). But yes, in the U.S. a brand-new 28 year old Ph.D. may well be an Assistant Professor, and essentially all those teaching have some type of 'professor' title (save Lecturers, Instructors, and Research Associates). This is very different from in Europe, where you may well have only one Professor per dept., or at least per major area within that field--though I understand title inflation is hitting over there now too.

I can just see the rank system now

1 Assistant Professor
2 Associate Professor
3 Professor
4 Distinguished Professor
5 Professor Emeritus

Eh, some of these folks would qualify as a Distinguished University Professor Emeritus.

But Kenpo does use a system like you indicate above.

 

[exile]

But yes, in the U.S. a brand-new 28 year old Ph.D. may well be an Assistant Professor, and essentially all those teaching have some type of 'professor' title (save Lecturers, Instructors, and Research Associates). This is very different from in Europe, where you may well have only one Professor per dept., or at least per major area within that field--though I understand title inflation is hitting over there now too.

The European system is very different from the US (and, increasingly, the British) systems. I've taught in German universities on multiple occasions over the years and still don't feel I understand it (there are multiple affilations people have with working groups, research centers, universities, and so on, which have different degrees of structural permanence but which are nonetheless real elements in people's academic affiliation, in a way that's not true at all here, where your one permanent affiliation is to your own department). Things are changing, it's true; but the normal MO over there is, as Arni has said, to have a single full professor per program, with a bunch of assistants, usually on soft money and nonpermanent contract, floating around like increasingly desperate moths around a flame waiting for a Professorship to open up—as a rule, well out in the provinces; the ones in e.g. Munich or Berlin will have an already very senior person well at the head of the line, so you may well wind up at Bochum in the Ruhr or somewhere else in the sticks, at least for your first job. But once you're a Professor in Germany, you're set for life... except that now your job becomes scrambling around, full-time, to dig up the money, essentially all of which comes from the German government, to fund your own swarm of assistants who now depend on you for the food on their table. In a lot of ways, it's a good deal more brutal a system than ours here, though in other respects, given the much thicker social-service carpeting over there, you're in better shape if the worst happens and you wind up without a job... in any case, make no mistake: in much of Europe, call yourself a Professor without the academic credentials and you are going to be a laughingstock, and possibly in serious legal trouble as well. It's a different world over there...

 

[pstarr]

Yes, I received a letter from an organization that started out, "Dear Friend..." and they went on to inform me that I'd been nominated to the woopedy-doopedy "Hall of Fame"! Good Grief. They didn't even know my name! Oh, yeah...I only had to fork over something like $200 for the title. How gracious of them.

To make matters worse, they asked if I knew anyone who would qualify for their Hall of Fame and if so, they'd be happy to bring them into the fold.

Of course, I never responded. In fact, I was sorely offended...but I know of other teachers who were only too happy to accept, pay the money, and get a new title and certificate!

 

[IcemanSK]

The issue that I have with the title master, GM, etc. is when used, not that it's used. I have the same issue when a university professor uses the title. If they are used in class & in their professional circles, that makes sense. But if Prof. Smith from the university write "Prof. Smith" on the tag at the dry cleaners, that's rediculous.

In the same way, I saw our current president with a jacket with the presidential seal & "President George W. President" embroidered under it. Does he really need that on his jacket?

 

[terryl965]

The issue that I have with the title master, GM, etc. is when used, not that it's used. I have the same issue when a university professor uses the title. If they are used in class & in their professional circles, that makes sense. But if Prof. Smith from the university write "Prof. Smith" on the tag at the dry cleaners, that's rediculous.

In the same way, I saw our current president with a jacket with the presidential seal & "President George W. President" embroidered under it. Does he really need that on his jacket?

Iceman I am going to recommend that you become the Grand Master of all GrandMaster for the above statement

Please send $5000.00 US dollars

so we can send you back the certificate signed by everybody you do not know this will be something to have and to chearish forever.

PS Yes Georeg W Bush needs his name on his Jacket he get so mix up these days

 

[Andy Moynihan]

This here is New England. We grow 'em on trees up here.

 

[thardey]

Our system has only one GM, and he goes by "Sir". The only time you will hear titles used is during a formal introduction (Like on stage, or something.)

All of our teachers, even the ones who rank "Master" (5th or above) all go by "Sir" or "Ma'am".

Makes things simple.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Well after all this I have just decided that from now on I MUST be addressed as

Lord high omnipotent ruler, evil wizard and Grand Ubber Master of Xuefu…and YES genuflecting is required and one MUST not EVER look directly at me lest they will incur my wrath. :mst: :uhyeah:

If someone’s style has a Grandmaster and it is legitimate then great but it is the incredibly large numbers of grand masters that appear to be popping up out of nowhere that I find a bit odd...that is unless of course now the rules have changed and I was not invited to the meeting

 

[Sukerkin]

If someone’s style has a Grandmaster and it is legitimate then great but it is the incredibly large numbers of grand masters that appear to be popping up out of nowhere that I find a bit odd...that is unless of course now the rules have changed and I was not invited to the meeting

Which of course, Supreme Omnipotent Ruler {genuflects and looks away}, would be treachery of the highest order.

Speaking of Orders, I've decided to create one called the Way of the Supreme Ultimate Fist, so of course I'll have to be the Grand Master of that style (as can everyone else who sends me $5 for a genn-you-yne black&white injeted certif-e-kate) :ninja:.