Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
Who was a 7th in 1987?
OP
jdmills
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #84
Correct. Joe Palanzo was a 7th in 1987. Sorry if my post was not sequential and got a bit confusing.
Jim
Jim
OP
jdmills
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #85
I've heard that Ed Parker did not even like belt ranks in the (very) early days. Can anyone confirm or deny?
Jim
Jim
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
That is correct. Joe Palanzo presented Tom Kelly and Frank Trejo a 10th Degree from Palanzo and the WKKA, however, Tom Kelly politely refused it due to the fact that Steve LaBounty (his original instructor and continued close friend) being a 9th Degree, so as not to disrespect him.
Frank aparently decided not to take the belt as well at that time, out of respect for Tom Kelly (as I understand it).
Possibly, conditions and attitudes have changed.
:asian:
OP
SingingTiger
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #87
From page 97 of Mr. Parker's "Infinite Insights, vol. 1", published in 1982:
"I will now attempt to justify the merits of the BELT RANKING SYSTEM which I was greatly opposed to during my early years of teaching. As long as a system, whatever the system might be, properly categorizes all of its basic elements into a systematic and progressive order, where one precept can build upon the other, then and then alone can they direct their system into proper graduating levels."
Rich
Doc
Senior Master
I think that I had mentioned before, Mr. Parker didn't even wear stripes until seventh. When he began to expand into the commercial area, many began to receive rank over time for many of the reasons already mentioned. It than became important for Ed Parker to display his rank relative to students who were now wearing theirs. For him to not would diminish those who did. You'd be surprized how big a deal it became to wear his stripes when taking pictures with students. I don't wear striped belts and neither do my students but, whenever I go to take a picture with a visitor in uniform or at a seminar, they always ask for the "other belt." I don't like it because I think it should be about me the man and my skill and knowledge, but I do understand having gone through that transition with my own black belts, who had to be weened from the markings. They still want me to wear the stripes in magazine articles, and of course that means they can wear theirs.
True2Kenpo
Purple Belt
Dr. Chapel,
I completely agree sir! I think some people overlook the person and their eyes go directly to how many stripes... It reminds me of meeting a gentleman by the name of John Bahr in North Carolina. I visited his school and took a class and he was just awesome. His skill and knowledge spoken louder than any stripe would!
Great saying sir!
Respectfully,
Joshua Ryer
UPK Pittsburgh
OP
jdmills
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #90
I agree.
In the late 80's I attended a seminar that was by Benny Urquidez. Someone asked him what degree black belt he was. Mr. Urquidez laughed and said that there were good black belts and bad black belts, and that we needed to judge for ourselves which of those categories any given individual fell in.
Benny Urquidez later gave a very brief synopsis of his credentials (beginning I think with studying wrestling when he was 4). I believe that he was trying to say that he had studied so many different styles of martial arts that his style was difficult to classify. After he was done with the synopsis, he said "so, what would you call me?" I think the black belt standing behind put it best when he spontaneously responded - "Sir".
In the late 80's I attended a seminar that was by Benny Urquidez. Someone asked him what degree black belt he was. Mr. Urquidez laughed and said that there were good black belts and bad black belts, and that we needed to judge for ourselves which of those categories any given individual fell in.
Benny Urquidez later gave a very brief synopsis of his credentials (beginning I think with studying wrestling when he was 4). I believe that he was trying to say that he had studied so many different styles of martial arts that his style was difficult to classify. After he was done with the synopsis, he said "so, what would you call me?" I think the black belt standing behind put it best when he spontaneously responded - "Sir".
OP
headkick
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #91
I've had the wonderful opportunity to take a few short (1.5 hour) seminars with Benny and aside from calling him Sensei (his preference), I think 'Da Man' comes to mind. The man is simply amazing. At one of the Vegas seminars, Tommie Chavies (another amazing martial artist, kenpoist and teacher) said he had seen Benny walking through the casino and a couple of guys bumped into him and Benny apologized. The guys kept walking with no clue as to how close they came had Benny not been the type of man he is. He has nothing to prove to anyone other than himself, so he has no ego on display for anyone else.
Great guy and incredibly knowledgeable and eager to share that.
Doc
Senior Master
That's a great story, and it sounds just like Benny.
OP
jeffkyle
Guest
- Thread Starter
- #93
Very interesting story! Makes me want to meet him even more!
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
I agree..... and yes, it does reak of his personality.
He is so humble and lovesssssssssssssssss to hit (especially guys bigger than himself). .......... and I might add... he NEVER whines~!!!
:asian:
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I thought he dreamed of opening a mouth piece concession stand at tournaments in Europe.
Wes Idol
Green Belt
There are letters between Pick and Parker that are quite private, but well describe how Pick quit the IKKA for a short time, but then him and Parker mended their fence. Also, I've seen another letter typed and signed (not stamped) by Ed Parker in the late 1980's. Parker states that Pick started at age 10 in 1957, and continues as a student to today. Also Parker refers to Pick as one of his most proficient, humble and longest standing students on the mats.
In the mid the late 90's many people approached Pick and thought he should put on a 10th...Pick would only do it by someone who was his senior...that means Tuiolosega, or Sullivan. After which time that Tuiolosega kicked Pick, Pick put down the bottle for good and believed he had a great responsibility put before him...to teach and behave as an example for others in training. If you talk to his son, Michael Jr. will testify how much has changed for the good in his Father, since Pick Sr. accepted this responsibility.
Lastly, I was there many nights before and the night of Pick kicking Trejo. Pick by no means was using Trejo for anything. Pick simply thought that Trejo has offered up so much of his body and spirit to this art, it was time. Pick has never brought it up again, nor has he asked Trejo to do anything but to just continue being Trejo.
On a final note, I know Trejo very well. If anyone tells you that he would allow anyone to use him for their own political posturing by way a 10th black promotion...that person probably doesn't know Trejo very well. Lastly, Trejo and Pick have a very old and long standing relationship...if you knew of it, as I do, you would never assume such a happening.
Respectfully,
WI, HI
UKS
In the mid the late 90's many people approached Pick and thought he should put on a 10th...Pick would only do it by someone who was his senior...that means Tuiolosega, or Sullivan. After which time that Tuiolosega kicked Pick, Pick put down the bottle for good and believed he had a great responsibility put before him...to teach and behave as an example for others in training. If you talk to his son, Michael Jr. will testify how much has changed for the good in his Father, since Pick Sr. accepted this responsibility.
Lastly, I was there many nights before and the night of Pick kicking Trejo. Pick by no means was using Trejo for anything. Pick simply thought that Trejo has offered up so much of his body and spirit to this art, it was time. Pick has never brought it up again, nor has he asked Trejo to do anything but to just continue being Trejo.
On a final note, I know Trejo very well. If anyone tells you that he would allow anyone to use him for their own political posturing by way a 10th black promotion...that person probably doesn't know Trejo very well. Lastly, Trejo and Pick have a very old and long standing relationship...if you knew of it, as I do, you would never assume such a happening.
Respectfully,
WI, HI
UKS
Goldendragon7
Grandmaster
You do have q right to your own opinion.
:asian:
:asian:
Greggers69
Yellow Belt
I don't think it's anyones place to question Mr. Pick or Mr. Trejo on thier advancement. Just as it's not my place to say the same for Mr. Mills:asian:
Sigung86
2nd Black Belt
Sorry Wes ... That is too home spun.
For what it is worth, at Mr. Duffy's Oct 2002 camp Mr. Trejo talked about meeting Mr. Pick and sparring Mr. Pick for the first time when Mr. Trejo was new to the Pasadena studio and how their relationship developed after that.
If I recall correctly, Mr. Trejo was an Orange Belt at the time and Mr. Pick was a Black Belt. I don't think Mr. Trejo mentioned the year.
If I recall correctly, Mr. Trejo was an Orange Belt at the time and Mr. Pick was a Black Belt. I don't think Mr. Trejo mentioned the year.
