Calling Somebody's Dojo A McDojo Is Offensive

[Steve]

Who’s Wendy? She sounds nice.

She's a lady that works BOH at a local steakhouse.

 

[Gyakuto]

You are hired as my PR and marketing director

What’s the pay like? Do I get a car? Will you give me a black belt?

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Sincerely, if you intend to keep it lighthearted, I'm relieved and retract what I said completely. I was obviously misjudging the tone of your posts.

It’s really okay. I sound snippy in the best of live scenarios. I am not very skilled at the tone of text. My wife even thinks so. If you re read my posts and look carefully for the poor attempts at humor, I’m sure you will find them.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

She's a lady that works BOH at a local steakhouse.

The ginger one with the pig tails? She must be 60 years old but still has that teenage smile.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

What’s the pay like? Do I get a car? Will you give me a black belt?

it’s an internship. I doubt you can drive the car, the steering wheel is on the left, and you must drive on the correct side of the road. The car has a snazzy black belt built in, it even comes with a matching bandolier, that’s because you will start off as a 2 nd degree.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Quality can be measured in different ways.

…is that what she said? I’m sorry, I really am, I just couldn’t resist that one.

 

[Wing Woo Gar]

Also a great way for a chef's restaurant to go out of business. Unless being persnickety becomes part of your brand, like Albert Yeganeh.

There are different ways to build a successful business, but the key here is that if whether the business succeeds or not isn't important to you, you can basically do whatever you want. Who knows? You might get featured on a popular TV sitcom and find your way into the cultural zeitgeist, like Albert did in Seinfeld.

No heel kicks for you!

 

[PhotonGuy]

Now we're getting into "black belt means something" territory. Can't do that!

But a black belt does mean something, otherwise it wouldn't exist.

 

[PhotonGuy]

There is no rank. There is no test. They come train, I give them new exercises and corrections as they progress. The process is not on a timeline. The student sets the pace of progression based on their individual ability, level of commitment, and consistency of effort. I don’t force anything on anyone, and I don’t coddle. They either have the will and the wherewithal or they don’t. Sometimes, that isn’t so obvious, so I stay patient and give them as much as they can digest on any given day.

I see, so your style doesn't have rank, not all styles do.

 

[PhotonGuy]

I can’t speak for WWG, but I offer no promotions. No belts, no titles, no colored tee-shirts, no special patches for their uniform (we don’t even have a uniform) no certificates…nothing. People keep training because they enjoy it and they apparently like me as a teacher.

Ya wanna know how I became a teacher? I was a student of one Sifu, and under his oversight I was teaching a little bit to some beginners who came into his class. Eventually my Sifu took me to meet his Sifu (my Sigung), and that man allowed me to join his small group of disciples who train in his back yard (I never did the discipleship ceremony, I am just a student) and he became my direct teacher (my sifu, no longer my Sigung). He knew I was doing a bit of teaching that carried over from the arrangement I had with my prior sifu, and he never objected to it.

Eventually I moved a couple hours away, and my attendance at his classes has become occasional. I saw a job posting for a “Professor of martial arts” at the local community college as part of the phys-Ed department. I sent my Sifu a text message with a link to the job posting and said, “hey sifu, what are your thoughts about me applying for this position?” He said, “you wanna teach? Sure, go ahead.” And that was it. I asked him to write a letter of recommendation as part of my application for the job, which he did. So I do have it in writing, but not on any certificate.

I never did get that job with the community college, but I began teaching a small group in my town and I hold classes in the local parks, with the permission of the city Parks and Recreation department. I am working on another arrangement with the next town over, to hold a class through their parks and Recreation department as well. That will begin in the autumn. When I see my sifu, he often asks how my teaching is going. He seems glad I am doing it, not many people teach our system in North America.

He never tested me, never gave me a belt or a certificate or any other token or gizmo or bauble of rank. He just said, you wanna do it, go ahead and do it.

So your style doesn't have rank. Not all styles do as I mentioned in my previous post. It's not unusual.

 

[PhotonGuy]

The term, I think, applies to many and poor quality students, teaching from the least qualified of instructors, accelerated Dan grade pathways and every opportunity to extract money from the poor students.

There was people who were calling my dojo a mcdojo because when they would run tests, a student could sign up for and take a test for their next rank at their own discretion. I just want to point out that just because a student can choose to test doesn't mean they will automatically pass or that the test will be easy. So just because you can choose to test doesn't mean that rank is easy to get.

 

[PhotonGuy]

This is the model used successfully by the British Kendo Association (kendo, Iaido and Jodo), the world oldest martial arts association outside Japan! My teacher makes his living as a ‘music type setter’ transcribing music such as operas into musical notation. Others are graphic designers, run a media company, are university academics etc. Our teachers take time out of their lives to instruct us because they love their art. Hard to believe, I know, but this was generally the norm within the martial arts in the U.K. until fairly recently!

Maybe there just isn't, or since you say until fairly recently, wasn't much of a demand for the martial arts in the UK, not like in the USA. I don't know much about the popularity of the martial arts in the UK although I do know a bit about Vernon Bell who apparently introduced much of the martial arts to the UK, but if there is not a high demand for something it will be hard to make a living teaching or providing it and so you might have to have some other job in addition to it to make a good living.

 

[PhotonGuy]

People can make whatever silly assumptions they like. My price has always been set at $0.00; I have never charged a single penny. But I think students have been satisfied with their training.

So you teach for free? Students just sign up and start taking classes without paying anything for it?

 

[Hot Lunch]

There was people who were calling my dojo a mcdojo because when they would run tests, a student could sign up for and take a test for their next rank at their own discretion.

At my last dojo, there was a sign-up sheet during the week of the test where you sign your name, and then you'll check a day later on the list to see if you've been approved. At my current dojo, you simply go to the office and pay the fee. I imagine that if there's a problem with you testing, the discussion would be had right there, but that hasn't happened to me so far and I don't know of anyone else that it happened to.

Either way, I'm perfectly fine with either one. What I would NOT be fine with is not being told why I can't test, or the explanation not being something that I can develop a plan of action from.

 

[Dirty Dog]

So you teach for free? Students just sign up and start taking classes without paying anything for it?

It's a very simple statement. Which part of it confuses you?

 

[Hot Lunch]

It's a very simple statement. Which part of it confuses you?

Probably what the ledger books look like.

 

[PhotonGuy]

It's a very simple statement. Which part of it confuses you?

The part that confuses me is that I've never known of any place where I could just get lessons for free, and I've visited many different dojos and training gyms.

 

[Dirty Dog]

Probably what the ledger books look like.

A blank piece of paper...

 

[PhotonGuy]

At my last dojo, there was a sign-up sheet during the week of the test where you sign your name, and then you'll check a day later on the list to see if you've been approved. At my current dojo, you simply go to the office and pay the fee. I imagine that if there's a problem with you testing, the discussion would be had right there, but that hasn't happened to me so far and I don't know of anyone else that it happened to.

Either way, I'm perfectly fine with either one. What I would NOT be fine with is not being told why I can't test, or the explanation not being something that I can develop a plan of action from.

A point I've been trying to make on this forum for years.

 

[Dirty Dog]

The part that confuses me is that I've never known of any place where I could just get lessons for free, and I've visited many different dojos and training gyms.

I have always taught at the YMCA. I do not charge. I have never charged. Not one penny. Ever. And I never will. I am a volunteer.
Is there any part of that that still defies your understanding?