Bruce Juchnik

[kelly keltner]

Thakyou for the clarification.
kelly

 

[Touch Of Death]

MOD WARNING
please keep the conversation polite and respectfull.
Sean Wold

 

[GAB]

Rob, Kell already posted in this thread about me, I guess I can post something in my profile, even that does not mean much, I have told the people on kenponet a lot about me and they still try to tell me kid stuff. Pathetic, I say. I state I am a trained killer. But people still want to tell me how I should train in this or that; or claim I am not who I say am. So what is the use, I know who I am...Thats all that counts, the rest is just foreplay.. Regards Gary

 

[Rob Broad]

Rob, now that is what I call a taunt, which by Webster is sarcasm.. I am not being sarcastic. you are Sir. Bring your Dictionary to the class before you throw taunts at me and call my statements Sarcasm, then run off to the monitors and say what you will..
You have already violated the first article of Kenpo as Will Tracy has said in the past about SGMEP. You know the more I read the more I believe Will..
As far as a deity, Talk to clyde about that one, like I said before, for all the Mormons and others, I am an Agnostic.. So take your best shot Rob. My History is a lot more solid then the Mormons is, I go back to pre Revolutionary and then some, I have been under the gun for so many years this is kids play.. Take Care, Gary

I have no idea what the .... you are talking about. I am not taunting anyone, I am trying to allieviate a little bit of the tension in this thread. I know for fact that people respond better to those who take the time to fill out their profile, it allows people to know who they are talking to.

I never mentioned anything about diety. I refuse to take shots at any religious group, it is not my style.

I have not taken any shots at anyone.

 

[Rob Broad]

Gab

My last post was being typed at the same time you posted your post.

 

[kelly keltner]

Thank you Dave I appreciate that insight. Let's review shall we; in post #60 doc quotes Mr. parker as saying"he's not really mitose's son". The implication being that Bruce Juchnik was seeing or was claiming Mitose at the time, but Juchnik was still teaching Tracy's Kenpo at that time. Next let's look how that ties into time frame. By all acounts Mr. Juchnik did not start seeing Mitose until late 1977 and Alan Reyes died in 1977. That would mean that there could be a 2-3 month overlap between the time Alan Reyes died and when Bruce first started communicating with Mitose. Therefore there is a remote possibility that this occured, if you believe docs story. Doc also states that Al Reyes came up and spoke to him later at the internationals. Now the only way for this to be possible is if it falls between the 2-3 month period and the date of Al Reyes's death. Now If Al Reyes's date of death is early to Mid 1977 then Doc's story is full of enough holes to sink a battleship. Not to mention the fact that no one has come forth as an eyewitness to what he saw and did to coroborate his story. Not to mention the fact that Bruce Juchnik states he was never there to begin with. I have spoken with Bruce and he is very concerned that these stories are circulating about him and is happy to speak with anyone who has questions. Just drop me an email at [email protected] an I will give you his number. I am truly saddened to see these statements being made and so little being done to contact the person being attacked.

 

[kelly keltner]

It was a General 'To All Participants of the Thread' Warning.

~Tess
-MT. S. Mod-

Thankyou for the clarification I thought someone might have been offended by my Doc Holiday Quote.
kel kel

 

[kelly keltner]

kelly keltner

Why is it that you keep insisting Doc call Mr Juchnik, if it is that much of a thorn in your side why don't you give Doc a call and discuss it on the phone, maybe even have a 3 way call. I have been fortunate to have exchanged emails with Doc in the past and I for 1 respect him. He isn't hiding behind others sporting claims to greatness and giving heresay about the old days, he was there. He was there with Ed Parker and knows the score.

This thread has become quite tiresome, so if you want to resolve things with Doc do it on the phone instead of wasting space on a good board with dirty laundry.

I still haven't recieved a message from Doc
kelly

 

[kelly keltner]

I've no idea about how well Mr. Juchnik moves, nor do I particularly care.

However, I strongly object to the implicit racism in this last post, which calls Ron Chap'el a liar and specifically grounds its reasons for that claim upon his being, "Black."

I also wasn't there. But I believe the story, because it tells me that then--as now--there's too damn much of the emperor's new clothes in kenpo. I've personally seen more than one, "senior," in kenpo who can't move for beans, and whose form sucks. Fortunately, I've also seen more than ten of them who have wonderful form, and who can snatch a bean out of my hand any time they want. And while I haven't met him and have disagreed with him right from the get-go, I've never seen any evidence that Ron Chap'el lies.

I also believe the story--at least as an allegory--because I'm familiar with the structure of nonsense. There's way too much idolizing going on; the attempts to legitimate learning Mystic Secrets through prison bars are ludicrous; there's no solid evidence presented that Mitose (who lost, "Mr.," so far as I'm concerned, when he got into conspiracy to commit murder on two elderly people) knew very much at all. Then too, there's way too much, "knows more than most martial artists learn in a lifetime," and "knows 200+ kata," and assorted other attempts at compelling agreement with sheer numbers--you know, like Nixon used to do--"The FBI has investigated over 1,263 reports, submitted over 32,119 pages of report, catalogued in excess 0f 243, 675 pieces of forensic evidence, and I can tell you categorically that this Administration has been cleared of all connections to the Watergate burglars."

I suspect, too, that some posters are going by hearsay, not direct experience, anyway.

And anyway, who the hell cares? As has been mentioned, it is presently impossible to disentangle fact from fiction in martial arts history generally, let alone in kenpo, given a) the hype; b) the lack of evidence; c) the secrecy; d) the fantasies; e) the politics; f) the oedipal games; g) the self-promotion....it'll take some real scholarly types (hey, John Bishop...whaddya doing for the next five years? want to collaborate?) sitting down with lots of time and support, and even then, it's going to be extraordinarily difficult. Because in my professional opinion--and yes, insofar as scholarship is concerned, I can legitimately give one--most of the stuff that gets passed off as scholarship in martial arts is laughable.

And anyway, who cares. Don't follow leaders, watch your parking meters, I say. Shouldn't folks be worried about what THEY can do, not what their kenpo great-granddaddy can do? Shouldn't teachers be teaching self-reliance and a commitment to study, not adoration? Shouldn't we be looking at our history and its tangles with a skeptical, knowing eye, not searching for little brass ikons?

Sorry. That last post cheesed me off. I'm sure that "GAB," will shoot back a claim that they didn't mean anything by it, which is just what always happens. But this is the sort of thing you get, when you go off on these sorts of threads, which seem designed only to sing paeans to the Gods.

Sir ,you should find and read I wrote about what Mr. Juchnik learned from mitose. No MoJo no secrets. Since this will problably fall under the dreaded catagory of the H word (dare I speak it aloud here) hearsay. I would direct you to Bruce for more information from an eyewitness point of view.
kelly

 

[GAB]

To Kelly Keltner,
Send Doc a personal,
I think we need to stop and redirect.
The people on this posting group don't understand or care about the facts or the things that have been pointed out, talk about holding someone or some people as a deity, It is clearly what they are doing with SGMEP, and Doc...
This is a waste of time and effort. Last but not least it is Pathetic and I mean that from the bottom of my heart..
Regards, Gary

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

This might be immaterial, but I'm going to ask it anyways, since there are so many learned (albeit hostile) folks on this thread. I went to school with a guy from No Cal who was a black belt in KJKB/Kempo from Al Reyes Jr. Anybody know how old he is? Id he still alive? Does he still teach?

Also, I've seen Mr. Reyes Sr.'s first name spelled out fully as both "Alan", and "Aleju". Any KJKB yudansha in the know about the proper spelling? Or was it just "Al"?

Regards,

D.

PS -- hypertension kills. Breathe deeply, and relax often.

 

[Rob Broad]

In my first post in this thead when I stated, "He isn't hiding behind others sporting claims to greatness and giving heresay about the old days, he was there. He was there with Ed Parker and knows the score." I was not saying whether or not he was at the tournament in question, I was saying that he was around back in the early days of Kenpo in the US.

 

[John Bishop]

This might be immaterial, but I'm going to ask it anyways, since there are so many learned (albeit hostile) folks on this thread. I went to school with a guy from No Cal who was a black belt in KJKB/Kempo from Al Reyes Jr. Anybody know how old he is? Id he still alive? Does he still teach?

Also, I've seen Mr. Reyes Sr.'s first name spelled out fully as both "Alan", and "Aleju". Any KJKB yudansha in the know about the proper spelling? Or was it just "Al"?

Grandmaster "Aleju" Reyes died in the late 70's. Grandmaster "Alan" Reyes is his son. He is still actively teaching in No. Calif.

 

[Seig]

This thread is now locked.

Seig
MT Operational Admin