BJJ vs striking arts in self defence

[Steve]

Hey, no fair - giving the "I have a theory" and then not giving said theory.

its nothing I haven't said many times. But I'll try it differently. if I wanted to learn how to cook, I could buy a cookbook. I would be able to learn, intellectually, the steps needed to cook. Given enough time and effort, I might be able to get in a cooking forum and really impress people with my esoteric knowledge of the culinary arts. I could define terms and correct people, and maybe even fool a few real chefs.

But if I wanted to become a good cook, I would need to apply what I know intellectually by actually cooking meals. Not just one, but many. Over and over, and with intention to improve and grow. Truly, the more I cook, the better at it I become. Not every meal turns out, but failure is absolutely critical to the process. it's the failures that really impart lessons that stick. Without cooking, one cannot be a great cook. And unless you've ruined a few dishes, you won't be able to improvise when things don't go just right.

And further, with every meal learned from a cookbook, and every tip gleaned from tv or from sharing a kitchen with another cook, you gain practical experience. It's this experience that allows for innovation. You can start to look at what you know and why you know it, and create new dishes.

The person who is a professor, who knows a lot but cannot do a lot, is, at best, a mimic. You can sometimes learn a lot from a mimic, but the best teachers are those who teach from experience.

And eventually, people who do will outgrow the professor, once they realize he's not speaking from experience. It's like this NSFW scene from the 40 year old virgin:

when you realize that the person who speaks with such confidence has never actually experienced it. (This is a little naughty, but also pretty funny, and very apropos.)

 

[drop bear]

its nothing I haven't said many times. But I'll try it differently. if I wanted to learn how to cook, I could buy a cookbook. I would be able to learn, intellectually, the steps needed to cook. Given enough time and effort, I might be able to get in a cooking forum and really impress people with my esoteric knowledge of the culinary arts. I could define terms and correct people, and maybe even fool a few real chefs.

But if I wanted to become a good cook, I would need to apply what I know intellectually by actually cooking meals. Not just one, but many. Over and over, and with intention to improve and grow. Truly, the more I cook, the better at it I become. Not every meal turns out, but failure is absolutely critical to the process. it's the failures that really impart lessons that stick. Without cooking, one cannot be a great cook. And unless you've ruined a few dishes, you won't be able to improvise when things don't go just right.

And further, with every meal learned from a cookbook, and every tip gleaned from tv or from sharing a kitchen with another cook, you gain practical experience. It's this experience that allows for innovation. You can start to look at what you know and why you know it, and create new dishes.

The person who is a professor, who knows a lot but cannot do a lot, is, at best, a mimic. You can sometimes learn a lot from a mimic, but the best teachers are those who teach from experience.

And eventually, people who do will outgrow the professor, once they realize he's not speaking from experience. It's like this NSFW scene from the 40 year old virgin:

when you realize that the person who speaks with such confidence has never actually experienced it. (This is a little naughty, but also pretty funny, and very apropos.)

Well you could explain the interesting version.

Here was my boring one.

 

[Juany118]

OMG, that's pretty cool. I went to Olney High School. And I thought that you were in the UK or Australia.

Lol cool indeed. My Father taught in the Philly School District for like 30 years, not at Olney though. Funny thing is Olney is now one of the Charter Schools. Me I am a very lapsed Catholic so I was a LaSalle boy.

 

[Tony Dismukes]

I think you have to train to solve problems. This idea that you need a formula for the street often goes to far. Can you fight on stairs? what if it is a wall and not a cage. What if there are two guys and not one?

Have the tools that you can use in different environments. Have the mind set to employ them.

people figure stuff out.

I think the sentence I bolded is indeed key. You don't have to train every scenario, although you should put some concentrated work on situations you know you are personally likely to encounter (Judo tournament, MMA match, restraining a psychotic patient, whatever). However you should train different scenarios, even as one-offs, just to develop the mental flexibility so you get used to adapting on the fly.

There's a BJJ instructor in Louisville who recently posted this video of a class where he had his students do "sock-wrestling". Each partner wears a sock and they grapple with the goal of taking their opponent's sock off. This seems silly - it has no obvious direct application to either tournament competition or street self-defense. What it does do is train the students to use their skills to solve a novel problem on the fly. (As he points out, it also helps train awareness for protecting a particular body part when necessary.)

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I think the sentence I bolded is indeed key. You don't have to train every scenario, although you should put some concentrated work on situations you know you are personally likely to encounter (Judo tournament, MMA match, restraining a psychotic patient, whatever). However you should train different scenarios, even as one-offs, just to develop the mental flexibility so you get used to adapting on the fly.

There's a BJJ instructor in Louisville who recently posted this video of a class where he had his students do "sock-wrestling". Each partner wears a sock and they grapple with the goal of taking their opponent's sock off. This seems silly - it has no obvious direct application to either tournament competition or street self-defense. What it does do is train the students to use their skills to solve a novel problem on the fly. (As he points out, it also helps train awareness for protecting a particular body part when necessary.)

I like that idea. I'm probably going to steal it from him. The idea, not the sock, 'cause that's nasty.

 

[FriedRice]

Lol cool indeed. My Father taught in the Philly School District for like 30 years, not at Olney though. Funny thing is Olney is now one of the Charter Schools. Me I am a very lapsed Catholic so I was a LaSalle boy.

Wow, that giant 5 story school is now chartered? That's great for that area. That school was wildly, freaky with its architecture....planned for some horror movie. I haven't been back there in a long time and heard it's a lot worse of an area now.

 

[drop bear]

I think the sentence I bolded is indeed key. You don't have to train every scenario, although you should put some concentrated work on situations you know you are personally likely to encounter (Judo tournament, MMA match, restraining a psychotic patient, whatever). However you should train different scenarios, even as one-offs, just to develop the mental flexibility so you get used to adapting on the fly.

There's a BJJ instructor in Louisville who recently posted this video of a class where he had his students do "sock-wrestling". Each partner wears a sock and they grapple with the goal of taking their opponent's sock off. This seems silly - it has no obvious direct application to either tournament competition or street self-defense. What it does do is train the students to use their skills to solve a novel problem on the fly. (As he points out, it also helps train awareness for protecting a particular body part when necessary.)

I have done it. it is a different game. A lot of places where you think you are safe you are not.

 

[Buka]

I think the sentence I bolded is indeed key. You don't have to train every scenario, although you should put some concentrated work on situations you know you are personally likely to encounter (Judo tournament, MMA match, restraining a psychotic patient, whatever). However you should train different scenarios, even as one-offs, just to develop the mental flexibility so you get used to adapting on the fly.

There's a BJJ instructor in Louisville who recently posted this video of a class where he had his students do "sock-wrestling". Each partner wears a sock and they grapple with the goal of taking their opponent's sock off. This seems silly - it has no obvious direct application to either tournament competition or street self-defense. What it does do is train the students to use their skills to solve a novel problem on the fly. (As he points out, it also helps train awareness for protecting a particular body part when necessary.)

I agree. And your statement of "so you get used to adapting on the fly" is spot on. I believe being able to adapt is the most important thing in fighting, self defense, sparring, competing, whatever anyone wants to call it when people go at each other.

 

[JP3]

I like that idea. I'm probably going to steal it from him. The idea, not the sock, 'cause that's nasty.

I employed an idea like this a couple times. Once in class to see how it would work, testing it, then once when I was a-guesting at a seminar.

Give one guy a bottle. Of course, in my own... ah... personal style, the bottles in question were beer bottles. Bud Light as it happened. Something you'd want to keep, but not something you'd either kill/die about, eh? Anyway, the goal was to keep the bottle away, while their task was to get it out of your(their) hand. Talk about mobility and evasion practice. I think I underestimated the motivation level.

Only thing I think I could have done to make it more combative would have been to be the first instructor teaching on the mat at a 7:00 a.m. start time and have the person holding a cup of coffee....

 

[drop bear]

our local pub does a version of that. Winner got $500. I had to break up the craziest fights some times.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Only thing I think I could have done to make it more combative would have been to be the first instructor teaching on the mat at a 7:00 a.m. start time and have the person holding a cup of coffee....

I don't think liability insurance covers that level of carnage.

 

[JP3]

I don't think liability insurance covers that level of carnage.

I had to get a rider if I wanted to do it again.