A teenager walks in to your school...

[Carol]

A teenager walks in to your school....and calmly asks to challenge you.

You ask why?

He says he's self-taught, and he's recently challenged masters in a nearby town. He doesn't say the name of the school, but he says the style, and the town. He says he's held his own.

You gaze at his build, and notice that he is athletic. You ask how old he is, he says he is 15.

The teen talks to you clearly, calmly, and quietly. He doesn't raise his voice, and speaks very confidently and in a matter-of-fact fashion.

What do you do from there?

 

[Boomer]

Accept his challenge if you are the one who sets the rules to the "match". When he agrees to this stipulation, explain to him that the match will be decided by a game of rock, paper, scissors.
If he hasn't already left, explain to him that martial arts are a path of self discipline, not one of glory seekers. And tell him to stop using Clearasil...it causes TOO much confidence.

 

[still learning]

Hello, Do people still act like that? This teenager still needs to grow up. Most likely had a bad role model? or wants to brag or prove he can fight?

First of all I would tell him "NO" and politely ask him to leave. If he persists' time to call 911.

To reason with someone who does not have any common sense can be useless? Watches too many martial movies?

I also would watch my back a few days,weeks.

Always be humble, be nice, and ask him to leave. Let him know that is NOT our way.

Remember if challenge? You will need to prepare to fight to the death?
Who knows what he may do to you? (avoidance is the best answer).

Guys like this may lose and come back a few months/years later for revenge...a never ending story here.

Hope this is NOT real here? ............Aloha

 

[Tez3]

As long as he walked into the adults class and not the childrens there'd be no problem. We'd probably ask him to do the nights training with us first then if he still wanted to he can go on the mats with anyone he liked. If he won we'd sign him up for the team, if he lost we'd hope he'd stay and train with us. We've never had anyone come in and challenge us but we are a fighting club. We've had people come to train with us who've had a cocky attitude but they've either not come back or changed it quickly. We don't go overboard and hurt anyone but we do train hard.
To walk into an MMA club and challenge someone in the manner described would take a lot of guts (or sheer stupidity) so we wouldn't be insulted or laugh at him. We would however be careful not to damage him.

 

[terryl965]

First off Iwould ask him to please show me some simple techniques and go over those teachs. If done not correctly explain it to him and if done right go on to some simple mid belts and then advance once we have fininshed that I would simply explain that the challenges of the seventy is gone but if he would like to sign a waiver, so the school and myself was not held responsible for anything. Then I would proceed to gear him up and let him sparr a few students and if he could show that he could hang with them then I would explain the beenefits from coming to class to learn everything else he need to know.

I would personally not spar him it would not be a fair fight, Not that I'm that good just that I have more experience and would use that to my advantage against him.

 

[tshadowchaser]

being of an old mind set I would explain that we needed his medical information and a wavier signed by his parent (in front of me). I would explain that a challange is not an offer to spar and that someone would end up in the hospital.
I would invirte him to come back when a class was being taught and I might let him go through the workout with us.
I might accept him as a student or I might not depending on how he conducted himslef in the free class.

BTW he asked if he could come in and teach some of the things he has learned to the class. would you let him show what he knows???
YES folks this one is for real it happened Sat.
For those of you that know us he wanted to challange Charlie or myslef at first

 

[stickarts]

I smile and thank him for the offer and then recommend that he try some other school.
Thats not at all in in line with why I or my my school is here.

 

[stone_dragone]

House Rules...no one crosses hands without a full practice first. I agree with the sentiments above regarding this concept!

 

[Drac]

For those of you that know us he wanted to challange Charlie or myslef at first

..Hell have to go back to his buds and explain that a skinny MA beat the chicken soup outta him...I'd have paid for a copy of that fight

 

[Tabris]

Believe it or not, but on one of my trips to china, that happened, only the boy was 18, had want from school to school learning for a year, then moving on. He dropped by the school I was visiting (recommanded by a friend and fellow MA) and bravely stood his ground and asked to fight only the master of the school. He threw down the challenge and it was picked back up and threw back at him, he lost... BUT... he was very polite about it and thanked the students, teachers and master for letting him enter there honorable school and asking to be forgiven for so rudely stopping the class. I am told two weeks later he moved onto a school two "blocks" over and fought there. True Story. If it had asked anywhere else, he'd be refused. Interesting yes?

 

[theletch1]

15? Nope, doesn't even get a handshake until I see the parents. Our country has gotten far too litigious to even consider breaking a nail on a 15 year old with that kind of mindset. It sounds like he's watched one too many old kung fu movies and doesn't have enough parental supervision in his life.

 

[Tez3]

Insurance not really a problem, we have public liability as well as instructor and personal. For us it wouldn't really be a problem if he wanted to spar with any of us, we wouldn't take a challenge seriously as such just let him get in with the rest of us. He'd might be annoyed at the lack of fuss though. Everyone is skilled enough to not hurt him and also to take anything he gave out. Just watching some of the others spar could be enough to make him change his mind, if not and he was calm and confident we'd see no reason not to let him have a go. As I said if he's got the guts to walk into a full contact fighting club we wouldn't belittle him, he'd be treated with respect. I'm not sure though what should happen in a traditional club though.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Well first I would show him the door and tell him that he is interfering with the students time. (would not matter what his age was) Next I don't do challenge matches. Not because I do not believe in them just because it is not what I train for. I train for real life personal protection skills not sport. That is a big differance. Nor do I have time for testosterone filled egos as it gets in the way with all of the practitioners training. Still if he pressed and attacked me then it would be a self defense situation and that would be a bad situation for one of us as I do not play fair nor do I engage empty handed when I can have an advantage. (advantages abound in my Training Hall and I would seek the best one) Next I imagine that the whole class would join in and we would cuff him (lots of those hanging around in the Training Hall) and call the police and off he would go for a nice nights stay in the local jail. (that is if he survived and his attack did not warrant lethal force) No matter what I would abide by the law and make every effort to have him leave peaceably and under his own volition. Still if he attacked myself, one of my assistants, students then action would be needed and taken if necessary!

Bottom line I have simply no time for children or adults acting like children. Threasts, challegnes, etc. are assault and would be treated like an assault!

I am not hiding either because I love to have a go at it with students and fellow practitioners all the time but they are students/practitioners and we have mutual goals in mind. So if this individual after being told to leave did and called me later and said he was sorry for interrupting and wanted to train we might accomodate him and eventually he would get plenty of hands on training, rolling, grappling, sparring, with and without tools, etc.

You see there is a difference in approach with real world personal protection and a different mind set.

Surprisingly enough I have not been challenged by anyone in a long, long time even though I am sure a few have thought about. Maybe it is the way I move or carry myself or my presence as I am pretty matter of fact and have been in many work related physical confrontations in the past!

Still this is just a what if as every situation is fluid and would require unique handling skills. What might work in one situation simply would not work in the next.

I wonder what spurred the question Carol as few people seem to be interested in going into a FMA school and challenging an instructor with all the sticks, blades, etc. laying around! Did this happen at your training hall?

Just my 02. on the matter.

 

[kosho]

For those of you that know us he wanted to challange Charlie or myslef at first.


Sensei,
Call me when you get a free moment, I would love to hear more this...

and also share a story as well.

Kosho

Dojo number 1-978-544-9693

 

[Tez3]

Thinking more about it, it's probably a lot easier for us as we get people coming in to train with us all the time, sometimes it's people from other teams or clubs who want to spar with different people, we get boxers coming in to do stand up with us, we have TMA people who are in the area for a while and pop in. At 15 we'd treat him as an adult, it's one of things about our club that the teenagers are treated the same as the adults as to how they are spoken to and included in the conversations, jokes etc. We have a couple of 14 and 15 year olds who help out at shows as well and they respond very well to being treated this way.

Anyone who walks through our door and wants to spar with us is welcome to,we're open to everyone. What we would never do though is match someone up like this on a show without a coach or trainer putting entering him. he'd only be allowed to fight junior rules until he was 16 then amateur until he was 18.

 

[Makalakumu]

I would ask him to leave and if he didn't, I would call he cops. Challenge matches are a big no no in my dojang. They go against the spirit of what I am trying to teach my students and they have all of the legal risks that have been mentioned above.

On his way out, I would make sure he had my contact information just in case he wanted to come back and try some classes. And I would make sure that he learned the proper attitude before he came back through my door.

 

[Tez3]

A teenager walks in to your school....and calmly asks to challenge you.

You ask why?

He says he's self-taught, and he's recently challenged masters in a nearby town. He doesn't say the name of the school, but he says the style, and the town. He says he's held his own.

You gaze at his build, and notice that he is athletic. You ask how old he is, he says he is 15.

The teen talks to you clearly, calmly, and quietly. He doesn't raise his voice, and speaks very confidently and in a matter-of-fact fashion.

What do you do from there?

People are assuming the worst here when the OP says that he's calm and quiet. There's no reason to assume he's an out of control, rampantly hormoned thug who wouldn't leave if asked! I imagine if he's as described by the OP he would take a polite refusal and leave, doubtful he would attack anyone when he would seem to want a proper match. We wouldn't bother calling the police, I'm already there lol! Plus where our club is he would have had to show ID to get in through the camp gates so we'd know who he was.

Our classes aren't rigid and someone coming in wouldn't disrupt us, we don't do challenges but we do have an open door for any that want to come in. I can see how it would disrupt a traditional class but we are always on the look out for new fighters, we don't expect them to challenge anyone though to get into the team lol! I know we aren't everyone's cup of tea but it suits us.

You know 15 year old boys can be quite romantic when it comes to challenges and proving themselves? He may think he's on a quest and be perfectly respectful and sane about it, I wouldn't laugh at him for being old fashioned! Until I knew differently I would treat him with respect and not as a delinquent who needs to grow up. If he were serious I would not want to hurt his feelings or treat him like a child. If he really insisted he wanted to challenge someone, I'd try to dissuade him but I'd see no reason why he couldn't spar wth us, plenty of others do.

 

[MA-Caver]

A teenager walks in to your school....and calmly asks to challenge you.

You ask why?

He says he's self-taught, and he's recently challenged masters in a nearby town. He doesn't say the name of the school, but he says the style, and the town. He says he's held his own.

You gaze at his build, and notice that he is athletic. You ask how old he is, he says he is 15.

The teen talks to you clearly, calmly, and quietly. He doesn't raise his voice, and speaks very confidently and in a matter-of-fact fashion.

What do you do from there?

Wasn't this guy on MT a little while ago? He talked about this and got basically "shouted off" this forum by the instructors and the (real) ranking Dans. Is he STILL around? Geez. Did he walk into your school Carol?

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Well, if I *Had* a school it'd go like this, we'll set the time 10, 15 years in the future:

ANDY: Do you understand what it is you're doing? What you've just done is not the same as simply asking for a friendly spar. People stopped doing this 20 and 30 years ago because of what used to happen to people in them. Do you understand that?

KID: (gives whatever response he does)

ANDY: Son, how old are you?

KID: 15.

ANDY: When are you gonna be 18?

KID: (gives a month/year)

ANDY: OK, if at that time you still wanna do this, come back and talk to me. I don't need the cops lookin' to pick me up for assaulting a minor. HOWEVER-- In the meantime, come over here with me, there's something I wanna show you and something I want you to think about for those 3 years.

*walks the kid over to his uncle's shadow box he made that has the triangular folded flag, his posthumous Purple Heart, his unit patches/pins and such.

ANDY: When my uncle was killed in Vietnam, his family got this Purple Heart. He served in the 25th Infantry Division as a medic. He was killed by a sniper outside Cu Chi in 1969.He was supposed to be shipped out to Germany that year, but chose Vietnam instead despite the danger he knew was there. Do you know why he did this?

KID: (gives whatever answer he gives, probably "no" or "why")

ANDY: OK, now look over here.

* Andy shows the kid his own two shadowboxes--one from his days in the Massachusetts State Guard, the other from his time in Civil Air Patrol( served concurrently).

ANDY: These are from MY days in uniform--I joined both these services when I was 29. I first tried to join the regular federal forces the week I turned 17, but was turned away for my hearing problem. Some years later when 9/11 happened, I came to be very frustrated that I couldn't be out there doing what had to be done. So when I learned that My home state at the time had such a force available, my best friend had been in a few years before me and they were for real, and I got in. Do you know why *I* did this?

KID: (gives whatever answer, maybe even closer to what I'm trying to drive home to him).

ANDY: The common bond between my uncle and I, even though he died before I was born, is this: WE READIED OURSELVES TO FIGHT FOR A CAUSE BIGGER THAN OURSELVES.

When my uncle chose instead to deploy to Vietnam, he didn't do it for some bull**** abstract like his Flag, his Nation, or "Democracy"--he went to be near his COMRADES. It was his job to heal the wounded and he wanted the people he cared about to be safe, enough that he risked, and gave, his life for them, in order to do *whatever it took to look after the ones he cared about.*

I didn't swear in or put a uniform on for some bull**** abstract like my Flag, my Nation or "Democracy For damnsure I didn't do it for our President at the time.

I chose to volunteer for this way of life for one simple reason: I want the people I care about to be safe. Which included my brothers and sisters in my unit as well as my family, friends and countrymen.

Now I wasn't so naive as to think that I could wave my magic bayonet and magically prevent anything from happening to them specifically, but I guess what I was hoping is that if there IS some kind of higher power pulling strings up there, that maybe it understands fair trade. That if I prepared to face the bad things, maybe they wouldn't have to.

And that's the whole point of this little talk: You came in here today, I'm thinkin', because you wanna get strong.

So I'm thinkin' maybe you need to ask yourself of just what exactly "strong" is.
Has anything I've said sunk in?

KID: answers however he does, I'm hoping he starts to "get it")

ANDY: So now you're starting to understand that the reason you train is less about you and more about keeping the people you care about safe, and if you're any kind of "awake", it's startin' to switch on in your head now why this approach you're takin' seeking out violence for its own sake isn't ****in' kid stuff , good to go?

KID: (answers however he does, hopefully he's enough on board I can continue and close this out).

*Andy points one last time to Uncle Ricky's Purple Heart*

"Whatever it takes to look after those you care about"......and maybe now you're starting to understand just exactly what that means. THAT'S where the strength you need comes from, son, not challenge matches. Keep training, keep working out, but always remember this talk we're having.

*Andy reaches into his pocket and pulls out his 25th Infantry challenge coin he keeps around in his uncle's honor.

ANDY: I want you to keep that, to remind you of this talk we had. In the meantime, you can start changing what you need to about how you view things on your way out--when you find yourself walking out on that street, or next time you're out with your friends or wherever, quit thinking in terms of, "these people better watch out, because I'm here".or trying to out-stare them or whatever, instead just look, give'em a slight smile and a little nod, and think from the point of, "Everyone in this place is just that little bit safer because I am here". You'll find that people in general are less likely to be put off and you'll make more friends that way as a side benefit. People's perception of you is that subtle, but that real, and I'll bet you dollars to donuts you'll find that your number of "high-risk" incidents rapidly drops to near zero.

I've a class to get back to, but I hope I've given you something to think about in the time before we meet again. Have a good night, "

 

[Sukerkin]

Interesting response, Andy, that delves into a few of the essential precepts of what makes a martial artist and a good person at the same time :tup:.