I should add it has a vertical component like an olympic barbell snatch, but seems like a Perfect compliment to the oly snatch. Snatch, Nangzi 3 Exercises, hanging ab raises (upside down hanging with tops of feet on bar), and the deep split lunge weight over front foot with DBs might be "the 6 not to miss".
A serious question to adept martial artists about physical fitness...
- Thread starter Zombocalypse
- Start date
At most gyms, the pulley cable has a carabiner clip at the end. You could make an extension to clip into that, and it might work. I've thought about just taking in a long webbing sling (nylon webbing tied in a loop) and clipping it in for this kind of thing.
RavenDarkfellow
Orange Belt
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I'd like to take a crack at actually answering your question. I haven't read through the 15 pages of what I assume is mostly nonsense, since the thread managed to degenerate into bickering before the end of the first page-- but I have a serious answer for you which you may find insightful, or perhaps it will just seem like a re-hash of something someone else already said... regardless:
I think there are three fundamental reasons for this.
1 ) An "I already know enough about physicality" attitude. Many martial artists who satisfy their own curiosity about what it takes to be a "real" martial artist decide they don't need to learn anything other than their *very specific* field or interest. They may even become "Senior Grand Master" in their particular fighting style, but all of their information is limited to their own scope, and they believe that's enough.
2 ) Genuine lack of time. A lot of martial artists become fully dedicated to their art and practise, and all of their free time spent learning more about anything has to do with learning martial arts specifically. Humans have finite lives, and finite time in each day within those lives. We have to pick and choose what elements to learn with that time. You could spend your entire life learning everything there is to learn about martial arts, and even if you stayed fully within one "sphere" or paradigm of the arts, you could spend your life learning *just that* and die before you learned it all-- let alone branching out into other spheres. So many, obsessed with the martial arts, hone in on just the spheres of technique and tradition, disregarding more natural/primal elements like common health and fitness.
3 ) Sales. When it comes down to it, there are generally two types of schools: Those who are great at martial arts, and those who are great at recruiting. Usually, it's not both, and if you find a school that is great at both, you've got a diamond in your hands. This is why most good martial artists are poor with failing businesses. They focus on their art, not on the skills required to proliferate it. So when you see highly-proliferated information, it's usually from the *other* guys. They're making click-bait. Some of them believe their own hype. Often they're just making statements that satisfy their egos while also psychologically directing people to what's in the marketer's best interests. There can also be elements of points 1 & 2 above, mixed into this.
Doing research is logical. That's all there is to it. No intelligent person can convince themself that research is a waste of time. You can put good knowledge in front of a person and they will throw it away -- the same people that say they don't have enough time are the people that think they know enough. They say they want to learn the million things their art can teach them but that's a lie they tell you to their face -- they want to do mechanical repetition until they die. They want a thin margin of growth that they barely eek out over their years and just break up their day with something that fills their mind with images and sensations other than that of their workplace and home.
It's an excuse everyone uses to cover their weaknesses. You know how you give the busiest co-worker something to do? They're already doing something so they get it done much quicker than the guy that's just sitting there doing nothing. Genuine lack of time is almost non-existent. Every hour can be worth another's 10 hours. I'm not going to give anyone the benefit of the doubt because everyone that gives themself the benefit of the doubt just stops progressing and somehow has only enough time to do what they're already doing.
If someone is working 12 hours a day 6 days a week you know that they are not in control of their life or they don't care about doing much else. Anyone can find some comfortable situation but the weaknesses of a person often keep them "trapped". Anyone can research homesteading for instance but who the hell will put up with living in nature? Haha. Basic comfort addictions will leave you trapped working some **** job in a **** place. "Who will tell me what to do next out in some field or forest? What will I do?" They are waiting for someone to tell them what to do instead of finding out for themselves. You just have to type it in to google in the modern age, and it's all basic subsistence stuff.
Simply lost priorities. If martial arts is last on the priority list then that's that. They are not martial artists. Give that title to those that deserve it. Mental weakness or bold face lying to your face (about their priorities and commitment) -- you can pick one or both. Everyone lies to you man, they lie to everyone. You lie too. "Magical thinking" is the rule not the exception.
I am not claiming as a master of MA, I put in a few years. The reason is because they are IGNORANT!!!
I was brought up in Hong Kong, I was told many times by the so called kung fu masters that muscle is in the way and slow you down. They glorified lean and trim as oppose to strength. They TALK as if "with the right technique, you don't need strength to do damage". They are more than happy to demo to you, telling you to put your hand grabbing him and how he use two fingers to make you to submission!!!.......That is if you grab him and hold him in static position and let him do whatever he want!!! The whole problem is not whether it's true. If you given the chance to position in the perfect way, yes, you don't need strength. BUT.......BUT......to get to that position, you most likely need strength to get to that position, all the tuck of war to get to that position. The other person is NOT going to stand still and let you take the time to get to the perfect position. That's when the strength comes in.
In UFC or Boxing, they have different weight categories, you think they do it for fun? You seriously think a 160lbs fighter can fight a 220lbs if they are both trained? Let say they both are same height and same reach. You seriously think the 160 have any chance to win over the 220? I bet the 160 won't last 1 minute unless he dance away from engaging.
I would say strength and technique are equally important. I just saw a women fight in Profession Fighting League fighting on tv. It's MMA style. A gold medalist Judo woman fight against a very well known MMA submission fighter. The odds of betting was like 15:1 the Judo one would lose. Guess what, the fight did not last a round and the Judo won. That Judo woman was buffed, you can clearly see the muscle even they are in the same weight category. The submission artist just cannot get into position to do her submission. The Judo flipped her around, pushed her away, threw the whole game plan off and won. I don't remember was it by ground and pound or submission. It was an easy won, was never even close.
Also there is a whole lot more about strength training. You damage your body from MA training, strength training in the right way help you heal your body and make you last longer. Notice the professional athletes are getting older and older now compare to like 30 years ago. The difference is they emphasis on weight training for recovery and the last longer and longer. It used to be like 30 or so and you retired, now you talking about up to the mid 40s.
I personally can attest to the weight training as I benefited tremendously from it. Between 1983 to 1986, I was training in Tae Kwon Do. I ruined my back from all the high kicks and for almost two years, I cannot even stand over 2 minutes without tingling feeling all the way down to my toes. I went to all different kinds of treatments short of operation. Finally one doctor in St. Mary's Spine Center ( hospital that operated on Joe Montana) suggested to go on a weight training regiment. It brought me back all the way. I am still doing weight training over 30 years after that. I still cannot do side kick, spin kick or round kick high, but I pretty much can train everything else. Weight training literally saved my life.
Almost half of my training is still on weights today. I added stick fighting with a cane lately, my body is screaming from the added exercise, it's the weight training that still keeping my body together.
A lot of MA are way behind time. Look at MMA, they do weight training. My wife goes to UFC gym ( for exercise and weights, not fighting). they have full set of weight training equipment. Don't think for a moment those fighters don't do weights. Look at their body, do they look thin and trim? Anyone say weight training is useless are absolute ignorant.
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I agree mostly. Strength but basically general physical prowess is how you win. Reaction time and speed is improved with physical training but strength is a big one.
You should check out kneesovertoesguy he's a coach that has a youtube channel. He's helping college athletes and I think pros. Learned from the best as well he talks about anatomy and Olympic coaches and what they do. Well studied. He uses his own stuff and it works. He used to be stiff and slow but powerlifted, now he is still good in powerlifting but can play recreational basketball like a college pro, can dunk, sprint, everything. I'm not sure why his knees were busted but he had tears and surgery.
The exercises require strength but flexibility. Weights are used. They're unconventional sometimes. He talks about the training of a 50+ year old guy that still plays basketball and dunks. Basketball is big in the ankles and back, point being that the training works to get one to peak athleticism. Coach himself is over 40 and doing some pretty stellar stuff.
I agree, it's everything together. Strength, flexibility, speed, coordination....... They all play a role. I responded to the original post and I heard enough BS from those old fart kung fu "masters" and others in Hong Kong that muscle just get in the way and slow them down.
It's all about balance.
It's all about balance.
I came back a little too late to edit. I want to show, I do stretch even I don't do high kicks. It is important to have flexibility, it's a given. I am not flexible like the video you show, but I am still stretching every week. Bare in mind I am 68 years old.
I used to go to gym to lift weights, but since the shutdown, I improvise and do it at home and it works. This is my "bench press" doing pushup with 60lbs weighted jacket doing 20 reps. I do bicep curl with 40lbs dumbbell 10 reps each, body weight dips, squats with 60lbs jacket and 40lbs dumbbell in each hand to get 140lbs.
Weight training is almost half of my trainings.
I used to go to gym to lift weights, but since the shutdown, I improvise and do it at home and it works. This is my "bench press" doing pushup with 60lbs weighted jacket doing 20 reps. I do bicep curl with 40lbs dumbbell 10 reps each, body weight dips, squats with 60lbs jacket and 40lbs dumbbell in each hand to get 140lbs.
Weight training is almost half of my trainings.
Impressive stuff man. I admit you lift more than me by some.
You should definitely go through the kneesovertoesguy stuff though, flexible explosive athletic strength is like an instant boost to an old man's status and respect, and a boost to anyone's quality of life and martial ability. The loaded groin stretch is killing you, right? Haha me too. It's the one after the butterfly. Really difficult but I can feel all my connective tissue and bones in the pelvis a bit and it reminds me of an insect or something. Saw a diagram and it the level of interconnection and mass of webbing is insane.
My goal is BW on each of the 7 exercises for 100 reps, maybe 50% BW on the kneeling quad lift, 1.5x BW for 100 reps on the side lift one. Day 1 at 12.5 - 25% BW with every lift besides the kneeling quad extension. I'm not much in shape so a lot of room above you know what I mean. Sky is the limit.
Nordic curls, split squat, foot lift and sissy squat aren't integrated in my workout yet but he talks about them alot and I'll get them worked in. I would do sissy squats for my knees but didn't know their name haha the patella just feels better afterward.
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It's true.
Thanks
I think I have enough exercise. I am not trying to excel in anything. I am not an expert in MA, I put in 3 years in the 80s. I had to quit because of my back, but I hung a heavy bag and work out regularly at home since, never stop. Been doing weights since. Lately, I added stick fighting with cane since all the attacks on older Asians. I am exercising like 7hrs/wk. It's a lot on my plate, I don't want to add any more. In fact, when I get better on the cane, I would want to cut down a little. As is now, it's over an hour 5 days a week, between rest in between, showers and all, it's like the whole morning every week days already. It's tiring also, I do NOT work out like a senior, I do push.
I am too old to try to excel and impress people, this is more about survival to me. I want to have balanced workout, not just MA. Weight training is very important for old people to keep their bones strong to avoid breaking bones if fall. A little flexibility will make it easy to move around. I am more training for quality of life than to be good in anything.
I learn a few months of Judo when I was young, learning how to break the fall. Once a week, I even try to fall on the concrete floor and practice breaking the fall a few times to remember how to break fall if I tripped. It's all about quality of life for me.
Ha ha, I practice deep body weight squat everyday after shower to squeegy the glass door door. I squat down all the way to scrape the door like 6 or 7 times. Don't laugh, this is NOT easy for seniors, their joints get stiff. At the beginning, I even had a little trouble even though I exercise.
Ha ha, that I can show off to the old people!!! I can squat down all the way cold!!!
haha well done man.
Buakaw is a beast. His training method is obviously world class. Not many men can train and compete at such a high level as him.
People dont have to back squat to be great fighters.
