A breakdown of the Frank Dux claims

[Gerry Seymour]

Yeah, but nothing mystical. No “ancient Chinese secret” involved. No Miyagi-isms. And a non-MAist who’s never stepped foot in a dojo could’ve said the same thing. That’s being a normal human being, not a follower of “the way of the warrior” or any other stereotypical stuff.

Truth be told, had he started spouting off Funakoshi quotes or the like, it would’ve probably gone in one ear and out the other.

To me, the "do" is just that stuff - trying to help students improve beyond fighting skills. It never has been mystical, except where a few sold it as such.

 

[JR 137]

To me, the "do" is just that stuff - trying to help students improve beyond fighting skills. It never has been mystical, except where a few sold it as such.

That “do” is no different than sports coaches, teachers, scout leaders, et al. If it was my high school football coach, my college mentor, or a coworker giving me the same advice, verbatim, would that still be “do?” Or would that just be someone giving me some solid life advice?

 

[pdg]

Would it change a person? Perhaps if the person wants to change, I guess. I’d say no far more often than yes, but I guess it can and has somewhere.

I think that's the crux of it.

If someone wants to change then sure, it can help provide focus and maybe even give an extra reason or two.

Maybe (surely) somewhere along the line someone has changed because of it, without going into it wanting to change.

 

[USMC0311]

Just a heads-up. You may have missed it in the forum rules, but fraud-busting isn't allowed in this site. Just trying to make sure you don't accidentally run afoul of the moderators.

Would you call this fraud busting or would you consider it as a few statements of obvious and shallow facts?

 

[_Simon_]

Yeah, but nothing mystical. No “ancient Chinese secret” involved. No Miyagi-isms. And a non-MAist who’s never stepped foot in a dojo could’ve said the same thing. That’s being a normal human being, not a follower of “the way of the warrior” or any other stereotypical stuff.

Truth be told, had he started spouting off Funakoshi quotes or the like, it would’ve probably gone in one ear and out the other.

That “do” is no different than sports coaches, teachers, scout leaders, et al. If it was my high school football coach, my college mentor, or a coworker giving me the same advice, verbatim, would that still be “do?” Or would that just be someone giving me some solid life advice?

Yeah I think it's all part of it. To me it has different levels, and when it's sold as secret woo-woo mystical stuff it can deter alot of people. If it's been a platform for some real self-awareness and self-honesty, I think that's part of the "way" aspect. It does go deeper, but it's not something that can be contrived and sold as some guarantee.

To me it's not mystical in the usual understanding of what that means, but a way of inquiring within and a process a real honesty with yourself. Like an investigation that you learn along the way in the process of doing it. Like peeling back more and more layers to see what's underneath. Just seems maybe more aligned with martial arts practice, but certainly applicable in other sports.

The trouble is when people turn the "do" into something it's doesn't seem to be (not saying at all I know what it is, but my current understanding of it), or just indulging in fantasy to escape from facing real stuff. It can certainly become over laden with some self-proclaimed "noble warrior on a quest" notions...

 

[Gerry Seymour]

That “do” is no different than sports coaches, teachers, scout leaders, et al. If it was my high school football coach, my college mentor, or a coworker giving me the same advice, verbatim, would that still be “do?” Or would that just be someone giving me some solid life advice?

I think it's the same thing. I've said before that the non-martial benefits people get from MA can be had elsewhere. A good football coach can be as valuable as a good Karate instructor for that. Because we (those of us with Eastern arts background) learn those words/terms from the origin languages, we sometimes think of them as specific to that group of arts. They really arent - those concepts are found in many places. I know some business managers who deliver good "do" to their direct reports.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

Would you call this fraud busting or would you consider it as a few statements of obvious and shallow facts?

Since some folks actually used the word "fraud"...