Wing Chun vs MMA

[drop bear]

Well, as far as my own personal observation goes, I'd have to ask a WC practitioner and a modern grappling MMA practitioner.

I'm not sure, and I'm not sure if that should be an ultimate determination of its application in self defense. MMA competitions, as much as I may enjoy them, are prone to popular trends in MA styles. Trends which (9 times out of 10) will have nothing to do with self defense applications.

I would have a go at the scrapping portion of that competition.(obviously I can't kata to save myself) There does not look anything I do would really restrict my ability to do that. Striking skills are fairly consistent across context.

Including self defence.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Well frankly I find the arts that tend to work towards MMA to be a bit more upfront and honest than the more traditional MAs that avoid MMA completely.

You ask that in a traditional MA school, you'll probably learn some nonsensical anti-grappling that will get your face planted into the concrete.

Like I've said before, you need to get out more.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I would have a go at the scrapping portion of that competition.(obviously I can't kata to save myself)

The sparring doesn't look much like kickboxing.

 

[RTKDCMB]

I think there should be a ban on X versus Y threads or else just have one sticky where those that wish to have the style v style arguments can chunter away to their hearts content.

Maybe we should have a Wing Chun versus Aikido thread, really give people something to talk about.

 

[drop bear]

The sparring doesn't look much like kickboxing.

Dosent have to.

 

[Finlay]

To get back to the OP question

Often when people ask about comparing styles for self defence people end up talking about style vs style as above.

This is not self defence this is a match.

In truth both and many styles bring something to the table.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Dosent have to

It is a common complaint that traditional martial art styles begin to look like kickboxing when they spar.

 

[drop bear]

It is a common complaint that traditional martial art styles begin to look like kickboxing when they spar.

Because kicboxing is the most efficient way to fight. (Sort of) But you want to go in there and do the hokey pokey dance by all means go nuts.

Otherwise similar concepts overlap.

 

[Tez3]

It is a common complaint that traditional martial art styles begin to look like kickboxing when they spar.

or to be more accurate kickboxing looks like karate when they begin to spar. After all, that's where kick boxing has it's roots.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Because kicboxing is the most efficient way to fight.

Then why does it take up to 15 minutes for a fight to end?

 

[drop bear]

Then why does it take up to 15 minutes for a fight to end?

Because the other guy can also fight so he has better defence.

 

[Spinoza]

If WC natively contained it, you wouldn't need stuff like this added to it;

The "popular trends" have been in place for the better part of 20 years. Even longer than that when you include Vale Tudo's history.

And the lei tai, where I'm sure WCers have competed against other martial artists, has been going on far longer than that. But again, that's sport fighting. I'm not saying it isn't valuable for self-defense, but it is very unlikely that your self defense is ever going to depend on whether you studied WC or MMA. Style vs style is like the gun folks who constantly fight over 9mm vs 45.

 

[Phobius]

Lets all use examples of a guy selling videos to people for money as an example of what the art considers proper groundfighting. Especially for an art that in all truth lacks a ground game. (The later being my opinion)

We bring in BJJ as part of ground game because we find it matching our concepts. Not because it is part of our style but because our style lacks something and then we better learn from those who know it best.

 

[drop bear]

Lets all use examples of a guy selling videos to people for money as an example of what the art considers proper groundfighting. Especially for an art that in all truth lacks a ground game. (The later being my opinion)

We bring in BJJ as part of ground game because we find it matching our concepts. Not because it is part of our style but because our style lacks something and then we better learn from those who know it best.

I was going to bring up the concepts idea. As it gets put out a bit.

I think matching concepts can create the baggage that you find in the anti grapple.

Bjj for example mostly dosent do this doubtful when say pulling a move from wrestling or something even considers it.

 

[Hanzou]

But again, that's sport fighting. I'm not saying it isn't valuable for self-defense, but it is very unlikely that your self defense is ever going to depend on whether you studied WC or MMA. Style vs style is like the gun folks who constantly fight over 9mm vs 45.

Typically if someone is asking this question, they're asking which MA will make them a better fighter. If we have a martial art that the vast majority of professional fighters pick up because it makes them a better fighters, versus a martial art that almost no fighters pick up because it doesn't make them a better fighter, then the choice should be clear.

 

[O'Malley]

You're lumping self defence and MMA under the same word (i.e. fighting) but those are two different activities. The guys you see in the ring are professional athletes that take the skills they need to win the match, which is a different goal from self defence. Some skills might overlap but they still are completely different activities.

You don't see many Krav Maga, Silat or Sistema stylists in MMA. However, those styles are widely used by the military or security guards who are also 'professional fighters'. Different goals, different tools.

 

[Hanzou]

You're lumping self defence and MMA under the same word (i.e. fighting) but those are two different activities. The guys you see in the ring are professional athletes that take the skills they need to win the match, which is a different goal from self defence. Some skills might overlap but they still are completely different activities.

You don't see many Krav Maga, Silat or Sistema stylists in MMA. However, those styles are widely used by the military or security guards who are also 'professional fighters'. Different goals, different tools.

And you see MMA being used by militaries as well, particularly the US military. Additionally, plenty of security guards and body guard train in MMA-based martial arts.

 

[Drose427]

And you see MMA being used by militaries as well, particularly the US military. Additionally, plenty of security guards and body guard train in MMA-based martial arts.

This point is irrelevant,

Several other martial arts are implemented by militaries, police, security, etc. It's incredibly common, even MCMAP admits to taking styles you've shown distaste for.

Not to mention MMA fighters and trainers in general tend to pull from those styles themselves.

 

[crazydiamond]

Bruce Lee figured this all out over 50 years ago WC was lacking, so he brought in Judo, western boxing and other martial arts on top of WC to create JKD. This was later expanded further with even more mixed martial arts by Dan Inosanto. This is why JKD is superior to WC and JKD Concepts superior to old JKD - the more MMA the better. Wait - I think I have branched off into two separate debates and disrespects in one post. Maybe three

 

[Drose427]

Because kicboxing is the most efficient way to fight. (Sort of) But you want to go in there and do the hokey pokey dance by all means go nuts.

Otherwise similar concepts overlap.

Just about every kickboxing style has ties to TMA's I have no idea why people think the two have to be mutually exclusive.

Not to mention there arent usually many differences anyways , depending on your school/style.

Just TMA's without the forms in a nutshell