Why until recently effective TMA practitioners were not represented in MMA?

[ShotoNoob]

Okay so why on earth are you calling both me and tez a jockey....it makes no sense in any context at all

Following along. You know, your posts. What I added is Tez from what I can tell here has effective striking for MMA. Do you agree with my opinion?

 

[ShotoNoob]

And all of your American accents stink! . The Hemsworths are the worst!

Also, most who train MMA are not pros.

I felt the same way. Some of those fighting at the pro MMA level aren't well equipped to do so either.

 

[Headhunter]

Following along. You know, your posts. What I added is Tez from what I can tell here has effective striking for MMA. Do you agree with my opinion?

Okay I'm done here

 

[ShotoNoob]

I think we are both supposed to know what he means, sort of by mind reading or 'far seeing', I don't know about you but it's not working for me!

Not a mystery to me, from how you described your own training.

 

[ShotoNoob]

If you took 300 regular people, sent 100 to a school that trains "tma" and 100 to a school that trains MMA or even some other combat sport (wrestling, boxing, Muay Thai, BJJ), and then 100 who don't train at all as a control. The two groups who train both train 3 nights each week for 90 minutes. After a year, how do you think the three groups would fare in a fight? To be clear, I'm not talking about professional athletes or elite athletes or even people who are athletically inclined.

I'll pipe in. IMHO, the MMA camp would have the higher win rate, based on your scenario. You left out some relevant variables though which have been posted, spelled out by other pro-MMA members. As well as the sophistication of the comparative arts.

MMA is a training model. The difference in the training model is exactly what DB is pointing to. To say that MMA is an extension of TMA is a copout, like when Someone brags about how their cousin is successful, implying that they are also successful by proxy, or that they could also be successful if they wanted to be, while dismissing the hard work involved with success. Take the doctor example. A guy who works 80 hours at the hospital isn't going to become a great martial artist. Probably developing some real skill as a doctor, though. That person is making a choice.

This all makes sense, I think. Those that train harder (and smarter) come out better. Are people still hung up on this common sense.

 

[Dirty Dog]

ATTENTION ALL USERS:

It's sad to see a thread that started out very interesting degenerate into name calling and sniping.
It's going to be even sadder when the thread is locked and people start finding notices that they've earned some infraction points, been temporarily banned, or permanently banned.
If you'd like to avoid this, then I would strongly suggest that the nastiness stop. Now.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Mark A Cochran
Dirty Dog
MartialTalk Senior Moderator

 

[Tez3]

Not a mystery to me, from how you described your own training.

I'm sorry but I really don't know what you mean, calling me a jockey is confusing, both my daughter and son in law are in the horse racing industry, I am a very proficient rider having competed in eventing so it is a very confusing post. I haven't described my own training at all, I've trained several different martial arts and you really have me confused, can you please explain properly and within the rules.

 

[drop bear]

So you have a fat lazy guy who trains MMA once a week and is useless so it's the style's fault, there's someone who only trains Muay Thai when he feels like it and is a lousy fighter but it's Muay Thai's fault? That is an amusing thought but complete rubbish.

One fat lazy guy does not make a trend. If the martial art consistantly puts out good martial artists. Then that is the fault of the martial art.

 

[ShotoNoob]

I'm sorry but I really don't know what you mean, calling me a jockey is confusing, both my daughter and son in law are in the horse racing industry, I am a very proficient rider having competed in eventing so it is a very confusing post....

I got that you know how to navigate that business. Skilled like a jockey. Kept it very simple.

 

[Yokozuna514]

Yes, stupid. How'd you come on on your Shotokan, Kyo kata comparison. No answer, I see.

I find this comment amusing and typical of people who have only mastered keyboard jitsu.

We can all do research on the net. Why I come here is to meet others who also train so we can exchange perspectives and learn from one another. The only caveat I have is that people are actually training in the art they are speaking about in an authoritative manner.

If you have no personal training experience than your words ring pretty hollow to me. Call me whatever you like but I won’t be responding to you any longer as you clearly have no respect for someone that actually trains in Kyokusin.

 

[ShotoNoob]

I find this comment amusing and typical of people who have only mastered keyboard jitsu.

As there is no substance in your reply, then this applies to you.

We can all do research on the net. Why I come here is to meet others who also train so we can exchange perspectives and learn from one another. The only caveat I have is that people are actually training in the art they are speaking about in an authoritative manner.

You haven't responded to the substance of even one question. Yet you pose as an authority.

If you have no personal training experience than your words ring pretty hollow to me. Call me whatever you like but I won’t be responding to you any longer as you clearly have no respect for someone that actually trains in Kyokusin.

If you,,, hollow words. There is zero substance in this reply. It'a a throwing shade post. "clearly."

And you never did respond with any material. So your final statement is nothing new.

 

[Yokozuna514]

I'm no longer with Kyokushin, but I still help teach the kid's classes at my old dojo.

Yeah the camp is held not too far from me (and it's not uchi deshi style one that he holds in Thailand, but a 2-3 day one), and I've definitely considered it, but honestly I'm just not well enough to do it (have been unwell for more than a year). Would be far too intense for me at the moment, and am trying to leave behind that style of training, as educational as it would be. Would be awesome though...

Sorry to hear about that. Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

 

[Tez3]

I got that you know how to navigate that business. Skilled like a jockey. Kept it very simple.

I suspect I'm being insulted here. When you say 'that business' I still have no idea what you mean. I also don't know what you think my martial arts training is. Still very confusing.

 

[Tez3]

One fat lazy guy does not make a trend. If the martial art consistantly puts out good martial artists. Then that is the fault of the martial art.

There's thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of good martial artists out there from all different styles. You are just biased, which is fine because at least I understand what you are saying don't agree of course but that's also fine.

 

[Hanzou]

Nice vid!

 

[drop bear]

There's thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of good martial artists out there from all different styles. You are just biased, which is fine because at least I understand what you are saying don't agree of course but that's also fine.

Not really. If I was biased I would be saying Whitsunday martial arts has totally the best system. We just have a different training focus.

And then I would make up a bunch of excuses as to why.

I am not a pro fighter.
I have to work.
I have to cater for fat lazy unmotivated people

So in reality tiger isn't a better system. It is the individual. We are really training the same. It is a genetics issue.

 

[Tez3]

So in reality tiger isn't a better system. It is the individual. We are really training the same. It is a genetics issue.

Really, it's getting tiresome how you are playing your so called verbal sparring game and twisting what is said into something else. Well, you will have to play with yourself now because I'm off to drive my daughter to the airport to catch her flight to Melbourne and I really can't be bothered playing your game anymore.

 

[drop bear]

Really, it's getting tiresome how you are playing your so called verbal sparring game and twisting what is said into something else. Well, you will have to play with yourself now because I'm off to drive my daughter to the airport to catch her flight to Melbourne and I really can't be bothered playing your game anymore.

Was it skribs or pdg where you wouldn't even let fight mma because he did the wrong style?

You have already answered this question.

 

[Tez3]

Was it skribs or pdg where you wouldn't even let fight mma because he did the wrong style?

You have already answered this question.

What? you're doolally mate, totally lost it.

Oh Caulfield Cup, we just won it.

 

[DaveB]

If you took 300 regular people, sent 100 to a school that trains "tma" and 100 to a school that trains MMA or even some other combat sport (wrestling, boxing, Muay Thai, BJJ), and then 100 who don't train at all as a control. The two groups who train both train 3 nights each week for 90 minutes. After a year, how do you think the three groups would fare in a fight? To be clear, I'm not talking about professional athletes or elite athletes or even people who are athletically inclined.

MMA is a training model. The difference in the training model is exactly what DB is pointing to. To say that MMA is an extension of TMA is a copout, like when Someone brags about how their cousin is successful, implying that they are also successful by proxy, or that they could also be successful if they wanted to be, while dismissing the hard work involved with success. Take the doctor example. A guy who works 80 hours at the hospital isn't going to become a great martial artist. Probably developing some real skill as a doctor, though. That person is making a choice.

I direct you to the highlighted text.

If MMA is a training model as opposed to a style, then it is different from tma. Tma are fighting methods, in some cases collection of fighting methods. The training model used is variable. It changes due to time and place and person. A fighting method differs from a training model in that it is what happens when you fight as opposed to when you train, as in the training model.

There is no reason that MMA couldn't be the training model for a TMA. In fact most of the training in Drop Bears Tiger promo is things I've done in TMA schools.

There are distinct benefits to training towards competition with competition experienced coaches, such as better guidance in how to fight for the individual and better balancing of training programmes to improve fight fitness. MMA also has the advantage of mixing fighting styles to cover areas not covered in a traditional fighting methods.