When the kata is applied to self defense

[Hanzou]

You asked why the Tai chi "masters are not going round kicking butt ...

And you said that all the masters are old age. Thus the logical question is, where are the new masters? If there are no new masters, then the art has degraded.

So in other words yet again your opinion

An I would refrain from giving and name calling no matter your opinion as that is not respectful ...yes he is outta shape now but he was at one point the real deal in his Art but hey you mighta missed that

Segal is a woman-beating pig, so you'll excuse me if my respect for the man is near the basement.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

You asked why the Tai chi "masters are not going round kicking butt ....from there you managed to get that TMA standards are dropping and now your saying cause they are in old age where are the new masters ....they are still studying but I would thought that would have been kinda obvious

The problem of Taiji is not Taiji master are in old age. The problem is Taiji training was wrong in the past 200 years. I believe Taiji could be used in fighting 200 years ago. I can come up a list of issues that Taiji has today.

Every time that I met a Taiji instructor, I always asked him, "Which Taiji move will you use to end a fight if needed?" They all looked at me as if I came from another planet.

 

[now disabled]

Where did I say I was an expert? I'm merely discussing what I'm observing and asking some questions.

Well your bashing Arts and people so usually a person that does that can at least claim to be experienced enough and studied enough (there by gaining rank ) before starting pulling things apart and basing it basically on you tube and the internet opinions and maybe a dash of experience.

Trust me it does kinda show believe it or not

 

[now disabled]

And you said that all the masters are old age. Thus the logical question is, where are the new masters? If there are no new masters, then the art has degraded.

What part of they are still studying are you not grasping ....like the hundred other things that seem to fly past

 

[Martial D]

So in other words yet again your opinion

An I would refrain from giving and name calling no matter your opinion as that is not respectful ...yes he is outta shape now but he was at one point the real deal in his Art but hey you mighta missed that

What if there was evidence of him throwing that kick before segal consulted with him?(hint, there is loads of it. Watch some of his fights from the early/mid 2000s)

 

[Hanzou]

Well your bashing Arts and people so usually a person that does that can at least claim to be experienced enough and studied enough (there by gaining rank ) before starting pulling things apart and basing it basically on you tube and the internet opinions and maybe a dash of experience.

Trust me it does kinda show believe it or not

Where am I bashing arts? @JowGaWolf said that the majority of TMA practitioners aren't doing it to learn to fight, they're just doing it for "fun". That actually coincides with everything I've been saying throughout this thread.

 

[now disabled]

Segal is a woman-beating pig, so you'll excuse me if my respect for the man is near the basement.

This is not the place for that comment at all ...right or wrong it really isn't

 

[JowGaWolf]

A martial art is only as good as the people who practice it.



Didn't you make a big stink about how you could stop a double leg takedown?

Defending against a double leg takedown has nothing to do with trying to beat a wrestler or boxer. It's learning how to defend against an attack that someone may try, regardless of the system they may or may not know. A double leg take down is not only done by wrestlers.

 

[now disabled]

What if there was evidence of him throwing that kick before segal consulted with him?(hint, there is loads of it. Watch some of his fights from the early/mid 2000s)

Oh great ok ya missed the point again like 99% of other points ...look just leave it or put me on ignore or I will do that to you as honestly you miss the points totally and continually go vid vid vid vid

 

[JowGaWolf]

A martial art is only as good as the people who practice it.

Explain

 

[Martial D]

Oh great ok ya missed the point again like 99% of other points ...look just leave it or put me on ignore or I will do that to you as honestly you miss the points totally and continually go vid vid vid vid

How did I miss the point? You argued that the fact segal didn't teach that kick to Silva was only opinion, which I merely showed can be easily disproved. It's a fact which can be checked.

 

[Hanzou]

Defending against a double leg takedown has nothing to do with trying to beat a wrestler or boxer. It's learning how to defend against an attack that someone may try, regardless of the system they may or may not know. A double leg take down is not only done by wrestlers.

It is a move done primarily by wrestlers, and is generally taught to the general population via wrestling. Bjj and MMA exponents made it a point to learn DLTs from wrestlers, because their method is simply the best around.

An untrained moron isn't going to be doing double leg takedowns, they'll be doing tackles. So you're pretty much learning DLT defense to stop a trained grappler which more than likely is going to be a wrestler.

 

[pdg]

Where am I bashing arts?

Pretty much consistently in every post where you claim any form practice is detrimental.

Admittedly, you're not picking on a specific art ("X is crap") but basically bashing anything that isn't mma.

 

[JowGaWolf]

The problem of Taiji is not Taiji master are in old age. The problem is Taiji training was wrong in the past 200 years. I believe Taiji could be used in fighting 200 years ago. I can come up a list of issues that Taiji has today.

Every time that I met a Taiji instructor, I always asked him, "Which Taiji move will you use to end a fight if needed?" They all looked at me as if I came from another planet.

Unfortunately it's really difficult to find someone who knows how to still use it as a fighting system, which is a shame.

 

[Hanzou]

Pretty much consistently in every post where you claim any form practice is detrimental.

Hardly. You can strip the forms away from traditional arts, and they will be just fine. In fact, I would argue that they would be better off, because you would streamline the curriculum, dump the nonsense saved only by tradition, and focus on the most effective techniques.

 

[now disabled]

Where am I bashing arts? @JowGaWolf said that the majority of TMA practitioners aren't doing it to learn to fight, they're just doing it for "fun". That actually coincides with everything I've been saying throughout this thread.

Don't pull another in and try and get them to defend you

Bashing arts ok no you haven't at all apart from saying that TMA (and again gonna s you to define that and your interpretation of that phrase or title) is just practiced for fun ...how the heck do you know ???

Karate you said there were no grappling in said or alluded to that (your Karate teacher said only dogs fight in the dirt or something like that) well umm define grappling again as umm I don't think your grasping again and ummm do you know all the Karate styles?

Koryu you said after the rise of Judo it disappeared and even posted a pic of the Kodakan and said look here that proves it and that there are more JJ schools outside Japan than inside ummm doh the rest of the world is kinda bigger so that does not really take much thought and really well ...nope not gonna say it

and that is not including the original vid and the avoid like the plague comment

Need I go on or are ya gonna try wriggling out of that too and go running looking for others to agree ...seem to remember a post saying well according to all the likes .........remember that ?

 

[now disabled]

Hardly. You can strip the forms away from traditional arts, and they will be just fine. In fact, I would argue that they would be better off, because you would streamline the curriculum, dump the nonsense saved only by tradition, and focus on the most effective techniques.

Are you serious ? truly or are you just being a troll?

 

[drop bear]

Another question to add to my list above: should a given training method (such as kata) always closely resemble the actual fighting application of the art? If not, what are some good reasons for divergence between the two? Do those reasons actually apply to the particular kata (or other training method) you are currently examining?

Dropping in to funky stances help train stability and movement.

That is why people do animal walks.

When I start thinking there is a secret move hidden within a frog jump. Then I might need some reality injected in to my training.

 

[Kung Fu Wang]

Admittedly, you're not picking on a specific art ("X is crap") but basically bashing anything that isn't mma.

Hanzou just points out that without using "sport" as the path, you can't reach to the final "combat" goal. I agree with him 100% on that.

I don't believe Hanzon has ever criticized boxing, wrestling, Chinese wrestling, MT, Judo, Sanda, Sanshou, kick boxing, ...

If you (general YOU) think your MA style works, go into the ring, or step on the mat, and prove it.

 

[pdg]

Hardly. You can strip the forms away from traditional arts, and they will be just fine. In fact, I would argue that they would be better off, because you would streamline the curriculum, dump the nonsense saved only by tradition, and focus on the most effective techniques.

In your opinion.

In my opinion, most would be worse off.

In fact, in my opinion most wouldn't exist.

If it was purely about "effective fighting" my school would have maybe one member (not me) and no instructors. This forum would be you and two others arguing about whether to stay standing or go to ground.