When recreational drugs are legal...

[Tgace]

Id be fine with it too if all the costs of killing yourself wasn't reflected in my insurance premiums, medical expenses and the dead innocents you crash into while you do whatever you want with your body.

That argument (im only hurting myself) only goes so far...its only really accurate if you are living in a cabin in the wood's. Try telling a few parents their kid is dead from an OD....impacts them pretty hard.

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[ballen0351]

I don't have a problem with "my body my choice". If it were that simple I say use anything you want you die that's on you I don't care. The problem is you may smoke weed and be fine and not bother anyone but not everyone is as responsible as you. I can show you countless emails to our tip line about how marijuana smokers users and dealers are bothering other people so your body your choice is effecting other's. Your freedom to be you is not greater then my freedom to be free from you. Now you may say why punish everyone for the behavior of a few but that's just the way it is. Can some people have a beer or two and drive OK? Sure but everyone can't so its illegal. Millions of people drive drunk every weekend with no problems so we are clearly punishing all for the behavior of a few.

 

[ballen0351]

.

Would I want my kid smoking pot? Of course not. Do you want your kid drinking Jack Daniels? No? Me neither. Frankly, that's a silly question to ask.

I don't think its silly if you wouldn't want your kids doing it why would you vote to allow mine to do it?

 

[Tgace]

PS- I know you are talking mostly about weed Steve, but the "my body" argument kinda segues to everything else no?

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[Steve]

Id be fine with it too if all the costs of killing yourself wasn't reflected in my insurance premiums, medical expenses and the dead innocents you crash into while you do whatever you want with your body.

That argument (im only hurting myself) only goes so far...its only really accurate if you are living in a cabin in the wood's. Try telling a few parents their kid is dead from an OD....impacts them pretty hard.

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So, government intrusion is okay when... What? What's The distinguishing factor here? Because I'm seeing some pretty overt cherry picking going on.

I understand the point you're making, and have no problems with it if you're consistent about it. Not a traditional conservative position either.


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[Steve]

I don't have a problem with "my body my choice". If it were that simple I say use anything you want you die that's on you I don't care. The problem is you may smoke weed and be fine and not bother anyone but not everyone is as responsible as you. I can show you countless emails to our tip line about how marijuana smokers users and dealers are bothering other people so your body your choice is effecting other's. Your freedom to be you is not greater then my freedom to be free from you. Now you may say why punish everyone for the behavior of a few but that's just the way it is. Can some people have a beer or two and drive OK? Sure but everyone can't so its illegal. Millions of people drive drunk every weekend with no problems so we are clearly punishing all for the behavior of a few.

Dealers wouldn't be dealers if the drug were legal. They would be bartenders and/or convenient stores.


And I'm all for punishing anyone who crosses the line. I never drive drunk and would gladly see anyone and everyone who does so punished for it. No excuse. And the same would be true for weed.


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[Steve]

I don't think its silly if you wouldn't want your kids doing it why would you vote to allow mine to do it?

Are your kids over 21? If not, then I wouldn't. Who's talking about allowing minors to buy weed? They can't even legally smoke.


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[Steve]

PS- I know you are talking mostly about weed Steve, but the "my body" argument kinda segues to everything else no?

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It does, but the point remains that the line is arbitrary, and the conservative position is less government, not more.


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[Tgace]

So, government intrusion is okay when... What? What's The distinguishing factor here? Because I'm seeing some pretty overt cherry picking going on.

I understand the point you're making, and have no problems with it if you're consistent about it. Not a traditional conservative position either.


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The distinguishing factor is when enough of society is impacted by a behavior and enough politicians are convinced to craft law to deal with it.

I don't believe the Constitution protects an individual right to ingest or possess any substance they wish...especially one that influences behavior.

While not banned, alcohol is controlled, it was once prohibited to sell or manufacture and theoretically could be prohibted again...legally. I fail to see this as a "rights" issue.

While I don't think weed is the equivalent of heroin, I'm less than enthusiastic about putting yet another behavior altering drug into the sale market.

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[Tgace]

It does, but the point remains that the line is arbitrary, and the conservative position is less government, not more.


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Are you trying to pigeonhole me as a "conservative" or something?

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[ballen0351]

Are your kids over 21? If not, then I wouldn't. Who's talking about allowing minors to buy weed? They can't even legally smoke.


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My kids will always be my kids even when they are 50. I wasnt talking about minors I wouldnt want my kids at any age to use Marijuana.

 

[ballen0351]

It does, but the point remains that the line is arbitrary, and the conservative position is less government, not more.


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Less Govt dose not = NO Govt. Im in favor of Responsible laws and to me this one is responsible

 

[Makalakumu]

Less Govt dose not = NO Govt. Im in favor of Responsible laws and to me this one is responsible

Can you still say this even after reading about all of the negative consequences of prohibition that have been unearthed in this thread? Do you still think that legalization would be worse than what we have now?

 

[ballen0351]

Do you still think that legalization would be worse than what we have now?

I dont think things are as doom and gloom the sky is falling as you do. But then again I have zero desire to smoke a fatty.

 

[Makalakumu]

I dont think things are as doom and gloom the sky is falling as you do. But then again I have zero desire to smoke a fatty.

It has nothing to do with sparking up blunts, brah. It's a matter of cost vs. benefit. I wish the Feds would stop leaning on the states that basically have pot legalized. We could actually have a good social experiment!

 

[Makalakumu]

It's also a matter of civil and states rights. The slow erosion of the Bill of Rights that is prompted by the Drug War is something we'll regret more than a couple more hippies and rappers sparking blunts.

 

[Tgace]

It has nothing to do with sparking up blunts, brah. It's a matter of cost vs. benefit. I wish the Feds would stop leaning on the states that basically have pot legalized. We could actually have a good social experiment!

The feds lean on states where its legal because the people with the weed THERE can sell it for 3-4K a pound HERE where its illegal. Which has been a problem since various state's went the legalization route.

I cant make a case against a CA "medical marijuana" (pffft...) grower. The feds can.

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[ballen0351]

It's also a matter of civil and states rights. The slow erosion of the Bill of Rights that is prompted by the Drug War is something we'll regret more than a couple more hippies and rappers sparking blunts.

I never read the right to smoke a bowl in the bill of rights. Where can I find that one?

 

[Makalakumu]

I never read the right to smoke a bowl in the bill of rights. Where can I find that one?

The 9th and 10th Amendment.

 

[Tgace]

The 9th and 10th Amendment.

It is a common error, but an error nonetheless, to talk of 'ninth amendment rights.' The ninth amendment is not a source of rights as such; it is simply a rule about how to read the Constitution.

Pretty much the same for the tenth.

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