What's your instructor's rank?

[Kimelac]

9th Dan, Grand Master Kun Hwa Lee.

Some notes about GM Lee :

He served as the Chief Instructor of the TANG SOO DO MOO DUK KWAN Headquarters in Korea (TANG SOO DO has evolved into what is known today as TAE KWON DO). He also served as the Chief Instructor for the Tang Soo Do Greek Federation, the Chief Instructor for the Tang Soo Do Italian Federation, and the Chairman of the Technical Advisory Committee for the European Tang Soo Do Federation.
In 1996 Grandmaster Lee founded the Greek and Italian Hwal Moo (Tae Kwon Do) - Jung Do Kwan Federation. During this time period Grandmaster Lee created the HWAL MOO (Life Defense) martial art forms, and today remains honored as the lifetime president of the Jung Do Kwan Federation.

Both me and my kids feel very priveledged to be learning from GM Lee.

 

[matt.m]

Yeah I agree 12th dan....hmmmm. You know dad told me a week or so ago the following "I must be a retard, I have been in hapkido since '73 and am only a 5th dan."

 

[IcemanSK]

WHAAAAAT?!? A 12th dan?!? I'm no TKD newby, but that's a new one to me! I just didn't know. Man, I feel like a real dumbass now cuz I thought 10th dan was top dogg too!!! Oh well, I guess it's true then, the study and learning of the martial arts is infinite. You learn something new all the time in the MAs... :uhyeah:

Wow! This guy must be something else. GM Park, Hae Man is a 10th Dan KKW (one of only 52....& most of those were awarded after death!) I love this art, sometimes.

 

[andyjeffries]

Iceman, don't suppose you have a list of the 10th Dan's awarded by the KKW have you?

 

[IcemanSK]

Iceman, don't suppose you have a list of the 10th Dan's awarded by the KKW have you?

No sir, I don't. I wish I did, tho. The only way I know that number is from the KKW website. It's not a list of who they are, just the number. In fact, I might even be off by one or two.

Sorry.

 

[phlaw]

BTW, late 40's is a bit young to be 7th Dan.

Why is that a bit young? My instructor is 39 and is a 7th Dan. According to the Kukkiwon requirements shown here, you could actually attain 7th Dan by the age of 36.

http://www.kukkiwon.or.kr/english/examination/examination08.jsp?div=01

 

[TraditionalTKD]

You know, several of our Instructors went to Korea last year for the Hanmadang and discussed the state of Tae Kwon Do with very high ranking KKW officials. One of the concerns was rank inflation-claimed rank being much higher than actual rank.
Why is 39 too young for 7th Dan? Because the rank of 7th Dan, or Junior Grandmaster, is a very high TKD rank denoting a long career in Tae Kwon Do, teaching and promoting. I believe, and I think others will concur, that a 39 year old simply does not possess the necessary maturity and body of knowledge and experience to do justice to a legitimate 7th dan rank. Disagree if you wish, and I imagine you do, but I firmly believe this. I am 38 years old, and will most likely test for 5th Dan this year. My GM adheres to traditional guidelines as far as rank requirements, and I simply could not see him seriously recommending a 39 year old to the rank of 7th Dan. He would not feel they were ready, based on all that 7th Dan carries with it.

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

.
.
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BTW, late 40's is a bit young to be 7th Dan.

You're referring to my late 40 year old instructor, he was born and grew up in South Korea. He began his TKD and MA instruction when he was 7 years old, he's now 47. He has 40 years in studying the art. I believe that it certainly qualifies him to competently hold his current KKW dan rank. I've trained under him for years, and I've studied other TKD masters and he is is quite capable and worthy of his rank.

 

[IcemanSK]

You know, several of our Instructors went to Korea last year for the Hanmadang and discussed the state of Tae Kwon Do with very high ranking KKW officials. One of the concerns was rank inflation-claimed rank being much higher than actual rank.
Why is 39 too young for 7th Dan? Because the rank of 7th Dan, or Junior Grandmaster, is a very high TKD rank denoting a long career in Tae Kwon Do, teaching and promoting. I believe, and I think others will concur, that a 39 year old simply does not possess the necessary maturity and body of knowledge and experience to do justice to a legitimate 7th dan rank. Disagree if you wish, and I imagine you do, but I firmly believe this. I am 38 years old, and will most likely test for 5th Dan this year. My GM adheres to traditional guidelines as far as rank requirements, and I simply could not see him seriously recommending a 39 year old to the rank of 7th Dan. He would not feel they were ready, based on all that 7th Dan carries with it.

I appreciate your conviction on this issue, but I do disagree on the idea that "necessary maturity" for high Dan rank cannot be obtained by 36 (as KKW states minimum for 7th Dan). There are many people in many fields of knowledge that obtain P hD's & receive tennured faculity positions at universities by 36. One can even run for president of the USA at 35. I've studied Taekwondo for 24 years. It's an absolutely amazing art & it one of my greatest joys in life. But I must say, I've done a lot of things that required more maturity & wisdom on my part than it.

If a Taekwondo student starts at a young age & trains consistently, 7th Dan at 36 years old is completely plausible.

 

[Kwan Jang]

It was not too long ago that the WTF changed their policies regarding age and dan rank. IIRC, it was when they added a fourth poom level. Many of the "old schoolers" are a bit uncomfortable with it because some of us were held back because of being "too young" ourselves. Still, with the proliferation of younger practitioners, it was decided that they had to be given some place to go.

The bottom line though is that if the WTF offers a rank at a certain age and someone meets the qualifications for it, don't blame the person for accepting it. What's the saying the kids have? "Don't hate the player, hate the game."

 

[IcemanSK]

It was not too long ago that the WTF changed their policies regarding age and dan rank. IIRC, it was when they added a fourth poom level. Many of the "old schoolers" are a bit uncomfortable with it because some of us were held back because of being "too young" ourselves. Still, with the proliferation of younger practitioners, it was decided that they had to be given some place to go.

The bottom line though is that if the WTF offers a rank at a certain age and someone meets the qualifications for it, don't blame the person for accepting it. What's the saying the kids have? "Don't hate the player, hate the game."

This makes a lot of sense. Thank you for the background on this, sir.

 

[Kwan Jang]

Glad to be able to add some value to the discussion. I just looked up the older WTF guidelines for minimum age classification for the following grades:4th dan-23 yrs old; 5th dan-28 yrs. old; 6th dan-34 yrs. old; 7th dan-42 yrs. old;. This is from the official publication put out by the KTA and WTF in 1975 (Test Committee: Article Seven), so being 7th dan by the late 40's may not have been very common under the old rules, but it was still was out there.

 

[jfarnsworth]

Just Do It!!!!

Right Jason!?! Make 'um just do it!!!:ultracool

You bet! :mst:


Nice to see you on the boards Cali.

 

[TraditionalTKD]

Keep in mind, those are MINIMUM guidelines established by the Kukkiwon. Many other Instructors, mine included, might very well feel that those ages are too young and establish their own requirements. Similar to minimal sentencing guidelines in court. The law says you must serve at least X years, but I'm sentencing you to XXX years in addition to what the law says.
One of our Instructors who holds the rank of 6th Dan told us that he had to wait several years past the time that others in his class tested because, since he was only in his early 40's, our GM felt he was too young. The KKW says 35 is old enough, but our GM obviously feels otherwise.

 

[terryl965]

Glad to be able to add some value to the discussion. I just looked up the older WTF guidelines for minimum age classification for the following grades:4th dan-23 yrs old; 5th dan-28 yrs. old; 6th dan-34 yrs. old; 7th dan-42 yrs. old;. This is from the official publication put out by the KTA and WTF in 1975 (Test Committee: Article Seven), so being 7th dan by the late 40's may not have been very common under the old rules, but it was still was out there.

I agree but witht hat said alot of GM would not promote at the earliest guidelines, mainly for the reason of over jealous GM and the ones that did promote early did mainly for control with many schools and othe Master along side of them.

 

[Mariachi Joe]

My instructor is a 1st dan, his instructor is a 5th dan.

 

[IWishToLearn]

4th Dan Kwan Jang Nim Alejandro Mora.

 

[TraditionalTKD]

A 4th Dan is a Sa Bum Nim, not a Kwan Jang Nim. A Kwan Jang Nim is a Grandmaster-8th or 9th Dan.

 

[Kwan Jang]

Not neccesarily. The title Kwan Jang Nim was used by the original Kwan leaders at the formation of TKD and their original rank at the formation was 4th dan. It was also very common for masters to be addressed as KJN at 5th dan and greater in "old school" TKD. This is still a common practice in other Korean MA's including Hapkido, KSW, and Hwarang Do.

 

[exile]

Not neccesarily. The title Kwan Jang Nim was used by the original Kwan leaders at the formation of TKD and their original rank at the formation was 4th dan. It was also very common for masters to be addressed as KJN at 5th dan and greater in "old school" TKD. This is still a common practice in other Korean MA's including Hapkido, KSW, and Hwarang Do.

Thanks for that particular bit of info, Kwan Jang---I've always been a little unsure of just what the protocol is for Kwanjangnim vs Sahbumnim. This make a lot of sense...