Welcome to the 13th century, NC!
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Steve
Mostly Harmless
Power of attorney doesnt do nearly as much as people think... And there are several different types of PoA.
Don, serious question. Do you KNOW that this is fact or are you repeating so,merging youve heard that Sounds reasonable?
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WC_lun
Senior Master
Yesterday, in a defense budget bill, a law was put in by Republicans in the House that states US gay military personel are not allowed to marry. When heterosexual people are subject to these same type of laws, then you can tell us about how the homosexuals in our country are not subject to discrimination. Gays are allowed to serve openly in our military now, and about time. Now Repubs in the government are saying, "Sure, its okay if you serve and maybe die in that service to our country, but you better not want to marry someone you love." It is nothing more than prejudice. Some of it might be from society and some might be from religion, but in the end it treats people as second class citizens because they are different.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
and?
granfire
Sr. Grandmaster
I sure hope you are just doing this to inspire a conversation on the topic.
The old saying goes, what's good for for the goose is good for the gander......
That puts the discrimination on federal level, goody...
So, now, regardless of the will of the people of said soldier's home state, he/she can't get married. Per federal demand, for the reason of....what exactly?
WC_lun
Senior Master
Also part of the bill that was added by Republicans, if a soldier is from a state that allows gay marriage, his/her spouse is not allowed spousal benefits, including if they are KIA. So for you guys argueing about it being a states decision, or should be up to the voters, or the fed should not be deciding issues like this, how do you feel?
I have to ask again, why are these laws being enacted?
I have to ask again, why are these laws being enacted?
Big Don
Sr. Grandmaster
It could be, they threw something the left would find objectionable to get the entire law vetoed... It has been done before...
FYI, a service member may name anyone he or she wishes beneficiary of their life insurance policy...
To a Republican politician, it seems the only good gay is one that died fighting for the rights others can enjoy, but they themselves can't.
Big Don
Sr. Grandmaster
“It is good to see that after intense political pressure that President Obama has finally come around to the Dick Cheney position on marriage equality.
Nope, Dick Cheney is not a Republican...
by the way, this has been Cheney's position for years, i.e., he didn't just change it to get campaign contributions...
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I read some of the commentary on that GOProud site ... I was at first a bit confused for I thought that it was a pro-Gay rights site that I was being directed to rather than a right-wing 'opinion' portal (one can't call it scandal-mongering propaganda, after all, altho' I would if I wasn't being polite) :lol:.
Ooooh nooo, quite an unpleasant place for my eyes to be - do you chaps really place any weight on what these self-appointed commentators write? I'm shocked if you do. As I said the other day to BillC, if you do it's like basing your political views on what you read in the Sun or Daily Mail newspapers; hardly something to be recommended.
Ooooh nooo, quite an unpleasant place for my eyes to be - do you chaps really place any weight on what these self-appointed commentators write? I'm shocked if you do. As I said the other day to BillC, if you do it's like basing your political views on what you read in the Sun or Daily Mail newspapers; hardly something to be recommended.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
Good thing im young so i have MANY more voting years ahead of me.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
So i ask again whats your plan to fight this great injustice?
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
And ill ask again whats your plan to fight this great social injustice?
WC_lun
Senior Master
Fair enough question, Ballen. I voice my opinion trying to use logic and common sense, I use my vote, I write my representatives, and on rare occasions I will donate part of my meager funds to politicians who fight against bigotry.
Now could you answer some of the questions I have posed?
Now could you answer some of the questions I have posed?
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
I already have it is bigotry.
Everything we do and every choice we make is a form of bigotry. You pick coke over pepsi bigotry. You choosea ford vs chevy. You decide gay lifestyle is a sin. You choose to want marriage to be a man and woman only. You dislike people based on race or religion or job. We all have some form of bigotry in all of us. Were human and were not perfect. Look at the responces against the ones that voted for the ban, uneducated redneck, christain right wing nut jobs. Im not even against gay marriage ive said several times in other threada id be for it if it was written like the canadian law or i believe how Carol says its written in her state but because i defend a states right to make its own laws i get told how great the world will be when i can no longer vote. There is all this talk about freedom for gays to marry yet all of you want to take away our number 1 freedom which is our vote. As long as the vote goes how you like it then its power to the people but when you dont like the outcome its screw the vote we need the govt to override the people. Which may be fine for this but what about the next time the govt decides it knows better then the people like i dont know federal wire taps or TSA pat down on children all in the name of "your safety". So steve claims to look at the big picture and i say i am. The will of the people is our only check on a corupt govt and your so willinging allow them to step in and step on the will of the people in the state of NC.
WC_lun
Senior Master
I have never advocated taking away your power to vote. However, I do not believe a person's power to vote trumps another's civil rights. There are plenty of things that haven't fallen my way when it comes to voting. That's how the cookie crumbles in a democracy. This instance it is diffferent though. This time a majority is restricting a minority's civil rights. This effects people in ways that would be very hard to imagine as a heterosexual. I do not believe that people have that power, and history has shown that the courts agree with me. Hopefully, SCOTUS will settle this soon, but until they do we are letting bigotry define our law and I do have a real problem with that.
Time and again I have asked how letting gays marry negatively effect anything. The silence in reply has been defening. When asked why we need such laws, I get responses of "the bible says its a sin." Now correct me if I'm wrong, but our constitution is written in a way that protects minorities from religious and civil persecution. Have we suspended the constitution? Should we go back to a time when lynching was okay because most people thought it was okay to hang that particular person? Or maybe just okay violence against minorities when whites do it because after all, whites are the majority...for now. I know, lets take Jewish wealth among Christians, because the sentiment among many is that Jewish peole are wealthier than non Jews. When we, as a country, decide it is okay to limit minorities' civil rights because of prejudice, we open the door for our own civil rights to be trampled on. I am not even saying a person does not have a right to be a bigot. That bigotry should NOT become law though.
Time and again I have asked how letting gays marry negatively effect anything. The silence in reply has been defening. When asked why we need such laws, I get responses of "the bible says its a sin." Now correct me if I'm wrong, but our constitution is written in a way that protects minorities from religious and civil persecution. Have we suspended the constitution? Should we go back to a time when lynching was okay because most people thought it was okay to hang that particular person? Or maybe just okay violence against minorities when whites do it because after all, whites are the majority...for now. I know, lets take Jewish wealth among Christians, because the sentiment among many is that Jewish peole are wealthier than non Jews. When we, as a country, decide it is okay to limit minorities' civil rights because of prejudice, we open the door for our own civil rights to be trampled on. I am not even saying a person does not have a right to be a bigot. That bigotry should NOT become law though.
ballen0351
Sr. Grandmaster
And why does that matter? When it coems to voting your free to vote for any reason you want you don t need a good one to vote. You dont need to justify your vote when you cast it.
There are plenty of things that the Govt does that I believe go against our constitution.
Like it or not if you got enough people to vote for it you conld do all of those things.
It should not become law your right but it is and does. Its the way the cookie crumbles as you say. Id rather give the power to the people then say the Govt knows best and allow them to make our choices for us
Steve
Mostly Harmless
Ballen, what if the government made it illegal to hire anyone with blue eyes? The people voted and the law passed. Blue eyed people are no longer Able to work legally in our country. What would you do?
Your entire position is a chicken **** cop out. It boils down to, oh well. Not me.
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Your entire position is a chicken **** cop out. It boils down to, oh well. Not me.
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